You get what you pay for!

[blue_side_up]

Just wondering about all those folks that went to UND, Riddle and all those high priced schools. Do you think that you received superior flight training compared to folks that learn to fly at smaller, cheaper technical schools or FBO's and if you do, do you feel that it prepared you enough to be able to handle a regional jet or anything bigger than a seminole? Thanks.

 

[idratherfly4283]

I have heard from a lot of people that riddle guys are the hardest to train, because they have been brought up with the mentality "there is a right way and a wrong way" they can't see that there might be a different way. I am sure the quality of instruction at a place that is expensive is better than that at your local fbo, but not enough to make the money difference up. I was leaps and bounds ahead of riddle people when i graduated in terms of hours, and as we all know hours=jobs, unless you paid for a crj course, then money=job=inexperience in the cockpit which leads to extremely low pay at the bottom. Thanks pft

 

[DC8 Flyer]

Just wondering about all those folks that went to UND, Riddle and all those high priced schools. Do you think that you received superior flight training compared to folks that learn to fly at smaller, cheaper technical schools or FBO's and if you do, do you feel that it prepared you enough to be able to handle a regional jet or anything bigger than a seminole? Thanks.

Short answer to your question, no on the "superior" part of the flight training, I would say thorough, yes on the ready to fly something other than a seminole. 7 years from Private Pilot to DC8 FO, yeah I got what I paid for.

I don't know where this "high" priced thing comes from. I paid about about 20-22000 bucks for all my ratings (Comm, CFI, CFII, MEI). Add another 15 grand for 2 degrees and voila.

I would say there is really no difference from UND or Riddle or Purdue and a local FBO, just that going to a "college" gives many more options to financing your training and more doors are opened to "free" money. I would also say you accomplish your training on a more efficient timeline.

I think the "attitudes" people are seeing are those that come from what they percieve as a "cool" place. UND's biggest problem children came from the Minneapolis area and those are the ones that paid nearly double for their flight training and wore the leather bomber jackets with $300 oakleys to fly a warrior.

The "attitude" isn't a result of the flight school it's a result of GenX or Y, or whatever the he!! letter we are on.

 

[Whyzitsokold]

I think the "attitudes" people are seeing are those that come from what they percieve as a "cool" place. UND's biggest problem children came from the Minneapolis area and those are the ones that paid nearly double for their flight training and wore the leather bomber jackets with $300 oakleys to fly a warrior.

QUOTE]

You mention just a few of the kids that attend training up north. It is just a percentage of them, just like anywhere else you go you are going to have some spoiled apples.

If you look at where you did your flight training, wherever it was, you had some hot shot wannabe as well. The flight schools just pump out more pilots so there will obviously be more bad apples. Most of the pilots are not rich and have 75K+ in dept just trying to make ends meet like everyone else.

 

[BoilerUP]

I attended Purdue as a Kentucky native. While the out-of-state college tuition was murder (Purdue offered the least financial aid of any school I applied to, including WMU, UND, ERAU, Lewis, & U of I), the flight and simulator fees were very reasonable, especially given the new equipment and high quality of instruction. I got my PVT, IR, COM and MEL ratings for somewhere in the ballpark of 25K in less than four semesters. My CFI, -II and MEI were probably another 4-5K.

At 21 years old I was near the top of my academic class, had 750+ hours, had every rating short of ATP, was checked out in a jet, over half my multi-time was turbine, had a ton of internship opportunities and had three different flying jobs staring me in the face. The job I have now is directly related to my experience and education. The best part is I got to enjoy all the benefits of a normal college life at the same time! While I know there are others out there who have far exceeded my experiences at the same or younger age, I believe my experiences both in and out of airplanes have been worth every penny.

I agree that humility is one thing this is sometimes lacking in the students of the aforementioned programs, and Purdue certainly hasn't lacked that arrogant attitude in the last decade. Fortunately I think most of my peers have learned from grads of the recent past and are humble and thankful to have a flying job. They have realisitic career expectations given the current environment, and I agree that the sense of entitlement is more a product of a generation of spoiled-rotten children who have had their lives catered than an institutional attitude.

I would not trade my educational experience for anything, but knowing what I know now I would have spent more time working in a traditional management curriculum to help make myself marketable outside of flying airplanes.

 

[DC8 Flyer]

Actually there are 2 DC8 operators out there that are worth a, how did you say, "dang". I work for the better of those 2.

 

[DoubleDown]

I'm a UND grad and I think I got what I paid for. One of the advantages of going to UND or any other university with an aviation college is the other students you get to know. The aviation college at UND accounted for about 1500 students of a total of 12,000 university wide. That helped keep some egos in check. (definitely not all mind you) Also, with that many aviation students, I know someone at about every airline, thats a lot of legs to walk in resumes. Also, the training costs at UND weren't that expensive. The Warriors rented out for $85 per hour, and none of them were older than 1998, dual garmins, KLN89b's, the works. We had unlimited airspace and many satelite airports. The weather sucks, but if you can live in North Dakota, you can live anywhere. The CRJ sim is a little after my time so I don't know how that is working out.

 

[Avpilot]

I have heard from a lot of people that riddle guys are the hardest to train, because they have been brought up with the mentality "there is a right way and a wrong way" they can't see that there might be a different way. I am sure the quality of instruction at a place that is expensive is better than that at your local fbo, but not enough to make the money difference up. I was leaps and bounds ahead of riddle people when i graduated in terms of hours, and as we all know hours=jobs, unless you paid for a crj course, then money=job=inexperience in the cockpit which leads to extremely low pay at the bottom. Thanks pft

Before I started working for XJT, I taught a CFI class in Jacksonville and Atlanta where we had a lot of Riddle guys in need of a quick course come through. I'd say probably 1 out of every 5 students was a current riddle kid. In a fast-paced program that required a lot of thinking outside the box, the Riddle kids were BY FAR the most difficult to successfully train to be a good CFI. It seemed that with them, more often than not they only saw things 1 way and couldn't seem to realize that there are many more ways of doing things than just how ERAU taught them. I have nothing against ERAU or its students, this was just my observation.

Tim

 

[Yank McCobb]

Actually there are 2 DC8 operators out there that are worth a, how did you say, "dang". I work for the better of those 2.

You work for UPS??? I believe THAT was the "DC-8" operator he was referring to...unless I am mistaken. In any event, I would think that would be the one that was "worth a dang".

 

[CSR]

I went to a UND as well and am satisfied with my education and training. I think most people have hit the nail on the head with the benefits. Structured program, from start to finish. Assuming the weather is good you know almost to the date when your checkride is going to be 3 months or more in advance. Contacts! We all know its not what you know its who you know! And most importantly for me, financial aid. I did not know a single person that flew airplanes and only had about 20 hrs when I got there, but I signed on the dotted line and magically paid for my training with financial aid. Some guys like me really didn't know all of the options out there to get training either!