XJT MEC declares war on ASA pilots.

[www.]

So how is the new system inferior? There has been a ton of homework done by the XJT scheduling committee, and I seriously doubt they would throw something out there that is subpar.

Well if it's so great why is there no one using it.

I have some questions:

When does the "globalization" process take place? Before OR after the bid closes?

How many bid sheets does the system actually look at during the process?

Is it a pure seniority system? The bid runs are done by pure seniority?

Is it ready to go live today without programming issues?

Does anyone from either sch. or neg. committees have a financial gain from the software company? Will anyone be given a management position if this certain software is used?

 

[wms]

Dear Legacy ExpressJet Pilots:

I have rode in the van with a lot of you and if you want the TRUTH about PBS talk to any ASA pilot and they will give you the real details. I like it and would never return to line bidding unless I had to. One question I keep hearing is you loose your 3 weeks vacation......NOT TRUE! We used to bid vacation the same way you guys did, if it inter fears with your vacation it gets dropped etc......same goes with PBS. One week turns into 19 days with PBS. Like I said don't read union emails or internet forums just ask any of our 1,700 pilots. Some may hate it but most like it.

PBS is a good system with some good features, but the company can't keep out of it. At IAD we can't get 3 on 4 off because the line thresholds are too high. The company also wants to take away vacation low.

I'm single-digit seniority in my position and will vote against anything with PBS. I spend a lot more time with ERJ pilots than just the occasional van ride and I tell them NO PBS...unless the company is totally out of it, the threshold is fixed at 75 hours or less and the company is totally out of pairing construction.

I prefer the legacy ExpressJet line bidding system

 

[dojetdriver]

Fist off, everybody is assuming that the OP is ACTUALLY talking facts;

Well if it's so great why is there no one using it.

Who the hell knows? Maybe because it's new software and the current PBS users haven't bothered looking into it yet? Has the ASA MEC been out on the lookout to see if there's a better system than what they went with years ago?

I have some questions:

When does the "globalization" process take place? Before OR after the bid closes?

How many bid sheets does the system actually look at during the process?

Is it a pure seniority system? The bid runs are done by pure seniority?

Is it ready to go live today without programming issues?

Does anyone from either sch. or neg. committees have a financial gain from the software company? Will anyone be given a management position if this certain software is used?

Again who the hell knows?

Considering the source, it's all just a bunch of divisive rhetoric being spewed here, as well as multiple other forums.

It's becoming increasingly difficult to take the OP, you whether it's under this username or any of the others you have here, or anybody that claims to be "and insider" seriously.

 

[The Boss]

A globalized bidding system is horrible and should be avoided. Continental uses a global bidding system.

A Seniority PBS system is not the same as a Globalized PBS System.

The biggest reason the CAL system sucks is because their work rules suck. Garbage in - garbage out.

 

[twott driver]

Well if it's so great why is there no one using it.

I have some questions:
Will anyone be given a management position if this certain software is used?

Bingo. Or six hours a day guarantee perhaps? Oh, hang on, they've already negotiated that for themselves. Sweeeeeeeet

 

[Data]

It's the pairings stupid! (To nobody in particular!)

 

[PooPooPants]

PBS is a good system with some good features, but the company can't keep out of it. At IAD we can't get 3 on 4 off because the line thresholds are too high. The company also wants to take away vacation low.

I'm single-digit seniority in my position and will vote against anything with PBS. I spend a lot more time with ERJ pilots than just the occasional van ride and I tell them NO PBS...unless the company is totally out of it, the threshold is fixed at 75 hours or less and the company is totally out of pairing construction.

I prefer the legacy ExpressJet line bidding system

I agree with WMS. When they keep the threshold at 75 hrs, PBS is great. The problem is that it's usually higher (85-89 hours). If you want the hours then it doesn't really matter. But like WMS said, you can't build to that threshold doing 3 on 4 off, which is something senority could hold before this PBS. I will vote NO on any type of PBS as well.

 

[ohplease!]

I agree with WMS. When they keep the threshold at 75 hrs, PBS is great. The problem is that it's usually higher (85-89 hours). If you want the hours then it doesn't really matter. But like WMS said, you can't build to that threshold doing 3 on 4 off, which is something senority could hold before this PBS. I will vote NO on any type of PBS as well.

,.....

 

[OCP]

I agree with WMS. When they keep the threshold at 75 hrs, PBS is great. The problem is that it's usually higher (85-89 hours). If you want the hours then it doesn't really matter. But like WMS said, you can't build to that threshold doing 3 on 4 off, which is something senority could hold before this PBS. I will vote NO on any type of PBS as well.

It is about the parings. If you are ASA then you should know that 3days went a way about 6-7 years ago. We've been 4 days as the norm since then, WAY before PBS happened.

 

[skootertrash]

Sounds to me like someone is being used as a mouth piece for a very deceptive and out of touch MEC. I’m sure your nego chairman Macintoush or what his name is, is leading the charge.
Merchant posted these messages on every web forum he could trying to stir the pot because they know PBS is the last thing they got. Once everything is said and done the ASA ALPA will be shown the door, at which point they might actually have to fly a plane!!!!
Ask yourself, is a group that has to resort to posting flamebait using the words “declaring war” really one to be trusted?

Keep going it your way and watch yourselves shrink.

 

[Freebrd]

Once everything is said and done the ASA ALPA will be shown the door, at which point they might actually have to fly a plane!!!!.

This! Im ASA and they're too comfy with management

 

[rjacobs]

The only problem I have with all of these "I heard this from the MEC/LEC/negotiating committee member/merger committee member/etc..." threads and rumors is that everybody who is in a position to ACTUALLY know what is going on has signed a confidentiality letter(or should have) and thus anything they leak out that is factual(say a TA'd section of the contract) could get them booted from their position with possible legal ramifications. If somebody is so stupid as to do that ******************** on purpose, they deserve to be shown the door.

That is why I dont give ANY credit to anything I heard of this nature.

 

[Jackie Moon]

It is about the parings. If you are ASA then you should know that 3days went a way about 6-7 years ago. We've been 4 days as the norm since then, WAY before PBS happened.

Not true. I haven't been here for 7 years and I held 3 on 4 of trips with weekends off commutable for about 2 years before I upgraded. They are gone now because of pbs but under line bidding I got them every month. The line might have only credited 60-70 hours but that wasn't my problem now it is because you can't complete a line that low. Not everyone wants 90 hours a month.

 

[PooPooPants]

Not true. I haven't been here for 7 years and I held 3 on 4 of trips with weekends off commutable for about 2 years before I upgraded. They are gone now because of pbs but under line bidding I got them every month. The line might have only credited 60-70 hours but that wasn't my problem now it is because you can't complete a line that low. Not everyone wants 90 hours a month.

BINGO! I held 3 on 4 off right until the end of regular line bidding. Can't do that with a bottom window of 85 hours no matter how senior you are. Why should the number 1 person in the company have to bid the same amount of hours as the guy just above the reserves? PBS is anti-senority friendly!

 

[Master Shake]

How about a new thread titled "Legacy ExpressJet pilots declare war on Joe Merchant". That's one I'd subscribe to.

You're a weenie Joe.

 

[Uncle Bunkle]

A 40-year-old (joe merchant) that acts like a 14-year-old.

 

[Texx]

What was it that Reagan said... "Trust but verify" Sounds good to me. If no one has anything to hide then they should have no problems.

 

[Cpt Oveur]

What was it that Reagan said... "Trust but verify" Sounds good to me. If no one has anything to hide then they should have no problems.

So does "Win one for the Gipper" mean stand up for the senior captains? I think there's too much of that going on...

 

[Texx]

So does "Win one for the Gipper" mean stand up for the senior captains? I think there's too much of that going on...

No just as I don't feel it's proper for a junior pilot to sell out for the SJS either.

 

[ArcticFlier]

And, once again, the reason I very infrequently peruse these boards.....

 

[OCP]

I don't know what you are doing wrong if you don't want to work much.
My month in Nov.
70 hrs. Paid for 75.

WE 02
TH 03
FR 04 A4A88 XNA
SA 05 SHV
SU 06 HSV
MO 07 ATL
TU 08
WE 09
TH 10
FR 11
SA 12 A4C13 ABY
SU 13 JAN
MO 14 HSV
TU 15 ATL
WE 16
TH 17
FR 18
SA 19
SU 20
MO 21
TU 22
WE 23 A4A38 CAE
TH 24 ABE
FR 25 CHA
SA 26 ATL
SU 27
MO 28
TU 29
WE 30

December 68hrs paid 75

TH 01
FR 02 A4193 AGS
SA 03 MEI
SU 04 ATL
MO 05
TU 06
WE 07
TH 08
FR 09
SA 10
SU 11
MO 12
TU 13
WE 14
TH 15
FR 16 A4859 CHO
SA 17 LIT
SU 18 ATL
MO 19
TU 20
WE 21 A415O CHA
TH 22 ATL
FR 23 A418O LIT
SA 24 BQK
SU 25 MGM
MO 26 ATL
TU 27
WE 28
TH 29
FR 30
SA 31

Had the first 5 days of Jan off too. In the last 100 on the airplane.

 

[PooPooPants]

I don't know what you are doing wrong if you don't want to work much.
My month in Nov.
70 hrs. Paid for 75.

WE 02
TH 03
FR 04 A4A88 XNA
SA 05 SHV
SU 06 HSV
MO 07 ATL
TU 08
WE 09
TH 10
FR 11
SA 12 A4C13 ABY
SU 13 JAN
MO 14 HSV
TU 15 ATL
WE 16
TH 17
FR 18
SA 19
SU 20
MO 21
TU 22
WE 23 A4A38 CAE
TH 24 ABE
FR 25 CHA
SA 26 ATL
SU 27
MO 28
TU 29
WE 30

December 68hrs paid 75

TH 01
FR 02 A4193 AGS
SA 03 MEI
SU 04 ATL
MO 05
TU 06
WE 07
TH 08
FR 09
SA 10
SU 11
MO 12
TU 13
WE 14
TH 15
FR 16 A4859 CHO
SA 17 LIT
SU 18 ATL
MO 19
TU 20
WE 21 A415O CHA
TH 22 ATL
FR 23 A418O LIT
SA 24 BQK
SU 25 MGM
MO 26 ATL
TU 27
WE 28
TH 29
FR 30
SA 31

Had the first 5 days of Jan off too. In the last 100 on the airplane.

That's great for you, looks like you're on the 50 and the bottom of the window must have been lowered. On the 700, I too have only had to work 75 hours the last couple of months because the window was set at 75hrs. I'm fine with that. The problem is a majority of the months the bottom of the window is set somewhere between 80-89 hours and you have to build your schedule up to the minimum regardless if you're number 1 or number 200. Can't get 16-18 days off with those required hours. Use to always get 16-18 days off with regular line bidding.
Also, almost impossible to accurately bid when the adjust the window after the bid closes. I'm senior enough to cherry pick all my trips and I'd like to know what the final minimum window will be!

 

[Oakum_Boy]

I have heard similar info from good sources, so this isn't Merchant making things up. Our MEC cannot figure out why XJET MEC wants this particular software at all. It's unproven, and they are pushing very harrd which should be MAJOR concern to all of us. Why why why.

Financial gain? Inside deal with management? Red herring in effort to confuse/distract hoping to keep line bidding??

My guess is someone over there has a financial interest in getting this software. Again, Joe isn't making this up, and neither is the ASA MEC.

 

[dojetdriver]

What was it that Reagan said... "Trust but verify" Sounds good to me. If no one has anything to hide then they should have no problems.

Considering the source, they can't exactly be trusted on anything. Hence, NOTHING to verify. Seriously, would you trust ANYTHING the OP says?

I have heard similar info from good sources, so this isn't Merchant making things up. Our MEC cannot figure out why XJET MEC wants this particular software at all. It's unproven, and they are pushing very harrd which should be MAJOR concern to all of us. Why why why.

Financial gain? Inside deal with management? Red herring in effort to confuse/distract hoping to keep line bidding??

My guess is someone over there has a financial interest in getting this software. Again, Joe isn't making this up, and neither is the ASA MEC.

As was alluded to by rjacobs, too bad the people that ACTUALLY know the truth (XJT or ASA) are barred by a confidentiality agreement and ACTUALLY interjecting the FACTS of what's actually going on. It's also a shame that agreement was breached, and somebody (the OP) likes to thing they something that's going on. Or rather, what's NOT going on.

All we really have is a senior lifer that thinks he's "in the know", yet really doesn't know anything. Just likes to blow his hole on multiple message boards about things he knows NOTHING about. And in the process, spewing divisive rhetoric that idiots on here believe. As opposed to emailing their reps to out what's really going on.

 

[crazy8]

I have heard similar info from good sources, so this isn't Merchant making things up. Our MEC cannot figure out why XJET MEC wants this particular software at all. It's unproven, and they are pushing very harrd which should be MAJOR concern to all of us. Why why why.

Financial gain? Inside deal with management? Red herring in effort to confuse/distract hoping to keep line bidding??

My guess is someone over there has a financial interest in getting this software. Again, Joe isn't making this up, and neither is the ASA MEC.

The fear mongering is amazing....really. Get a clue. If you don't know any of this information already, you have nobody to blame but your own ASA MEC....ask why, why, why?

If you're legacy ASA, and want an explanation of SmartPref....PM me and I'll send it to you. Otherwise, quit spreading the uneducated fear.

 

[Cpt Oveur]

The fear mongering is amazing....really. Get a clue. If you don't know any of this information already, you have nobody to blame but your own ASA MEC....ask why, why, why?

If you're legacy ASA, and want an explanation of SmartPref....PM me and I'll send it to you. Otherwise, quit spreading the uneducated fear.

I get the impression that the XJT MEC and company have been testing and investigating the Flica software to a higher degree and longer time than even the ASA MEC did. What is the harm in the ASA MEC spending time to investigate smartpref? One should keep in mind that prior to ASA using Flica, only GoJet was actively using it, and Virgin America signed on during the process.

It's also critical to remember that even though the vendor might be the same, the final software used is also very much tailored to the contract/work rules associated with it. Right?

 

[sweptback]

Since when does the union make their own people sign a confidentiality agreement? And why is this acceptable to us? It's common practice to sign a confidentiality agreement for the company, because you will be viewing proprietary info such as CPAs or financial info, but there's nothing on the ALPA side that should warrant that.

 

[BoilerUP]

Lots of airlines have been using FLiCA for years.

Personally, the interwebs would lead me to believe the XJT MEC is doing all this to root out the leaks in the confidentiality agreement and maybe, as a side benefit, piss off certain lifer ASA pilots.

 

[crazy8]

I get the impression that the XJT MEC and company have been testing and investigating the Flica software to a higher degree and longer time than even the ASA MEC did. What is the harm in the ASA MEC spending time to investigate smartpref? One should keep in mind that prior to ASA using Flica, only GoJet was actively using it, and Virgin America signed on during the process.

It's also critical to remember that even though the vendor might be the same, the final software used is also very much tailored to the contract/work rules associated with it. Right?

The XJT scheduling committee tested literally every PBS software system out there and concluded that SmartPref had the highest potential to improve QOL out of any system out there....Flica included. It's all in an extensive report compiled by our committee.

...and yes...no matter the PBS system, it's ALL about the work rules.

All the ASA conspiracy theorists should ask their own MEC why this report hasn't been published for the CRJ side to see.

In all seriousness....if you don't know what it's about...see for yourselves. There's really nothing secretive here for all you tin foil hat types.

http://www.crewingsolutions.com/content/smartpref-preferential-bidding-system-how-it-works

 

[sweptback]

Lots of airlines have been using FLiCA for years.

Of course they have... but we're talking about Flightline's PrefBid and not FLiCA.