xjt going at it on their own...

[ratherbeflyen]

What a surprise, there's people who don't know anything about whats going on except that they don't like it. Pull up a couple of supporting facts and boom! the sky is falling. Why aren't we saying things like an end to the whipsaw or race to the bottom. Is that too much good news?

 

[FLYBOYMATTHEW]

I hate to burst your bubble... but an E-145 is nothing like an E-190 inside. It's kind of like comparing a C182 to a King Air. Besides...let's be honest with ourselves...there just isn't any money to be made in the domestic market. There is far too much competition, and the economics of the aircraft just don't add up. Hell, MESA could do it for less, and they probably will if it means an opportunity to snuff out some competition. If I worked for XJT...I would be putting those paychecks in the bank for a "rainy day".

Are you familiar with the 2 fleets Jetblue operates? I also hate to point out the obvious, but one of them is an RJ.

 

[Alchemy]

If I worked for XJT...I would be putting those paychecks in the bank for a "rainy day".

You know what? This is good advice for anyone at any company in any field. But at least XJT's management has given it's employees a fighting chance to keep their jobs, rather than handing over 69 planes to Bedford like CO and RAH wanted them to.

I think the real reason a lot of people on here are poopoo-ing this venture is that they don't want to see the increased competition.

Well, I don't want to see it either, but CO and RAH really gave XJT no choice, now did they? Is shrinking your company by 25% over the period of 1 year really a better business plan? Answer me that. They still have the option to shrink next year if this doesn't work out.

 

[FLYBOYMATTHEW]

Well, admittedly it really isn't competition for my company. That being said, I don't envy the position of any company having to survive in the U.S. regional airline industry right now. If this is what must be done...so be it. I wish the pilots well, but question management's strategy.

 

[txpilot1974]

I hate to burst your bubble... but an E-145 is nothing like an E-190 inside. It's kind of like comparing a C182 to a King Air. Besides...let's be honest with ourselves...there just isn't any money to be made in the domestic market. There is far too much competition, and the economics of the aircraft just don't add up. Hell, MESA could do it for less, and they probably will if it means an opportunity to snuff out some competition. If I worked for XJT...I would be putting those paychecks in the bank for a "rainy day".

It looks like FI has its newest TOOL on board.

Best of luck XJT!!

 

[pianoman]

You'd think people would be hoping this takes off. Do you want to see one of the top paying "regionals" starting cutting away at the contract, hurting everyone else's chances of a raise?

 

[LIGHTDRIVER]

You know what? This is good advice for anyone at any company in any field. But at least XJT's management has given it's employees a fighting chance to keep their jobs, rather than handing over 69 planes to Bedford like CO and RAH wanted them to.

I think the real reason a lot of people on here are poopoo-ing this venture is that they don't want to see the increased competition.

Well, I don't want to see it either, but CO and RAH really gave XJT no choice, now did they? Is shrinking your company by 25% over the period of 1 year really a better business plan? Answer me that. They still have the option to shrink next year if this doesn't work out.

Just wait until CAL says goodbye to the next batch. Don't think it's going to happen?

 

[mckpickle]

Dont you think that UAL will put an RJ on those same markets? They will charge $5 less per ticket and triple the frequent flier miles. What I found out from the I-Air problem, is that the customers are loyal to their ff mileage airline. UAL (or any airline) is not loyal to their employees or business partners, but the customers are very loyal to their mileage. Some of you might be old enough to remember Legend Air. DC9s from Dallas Love to IAD/ORD/LAX. AA took a few F100s, and reconfigured these planes for 56 (?) seats, and put Legend Air of of business. Legend Air had "live TV". AA had frequent flier miles. As soon as Legend was gone, AA pulled out of those routes. Amazing how that works.

Again, good luck to you, but dont go buying the new boat just yet.

Hmmmm yup, so imigine if XJT were able to "code share" with another airline out there. Maybe that would work.

 

[BankAccount=0$]

You'd think people would be hoping this takes off. Do you want to see one of the top paying "regionals" starting cutting away at the contract, hurting everyone else's chances of a raise?

Truer words could not be said my friend. While these toolboxes continue to argue about the "economic viability of a 50 seat RJ in the domestic market", they miss the big picture which is that XJT has a great contract (for a "regional"). Unless you're sitting at one of the other 3 airlines with a contract that is somewhat comparable to XJT's you should be focused on figuring a way to increase your compensation and work rules to at least match if not exceed those that the XJT pilots work under. And for those who still wave the growth for concessions flag, well look how well that worked for the Comair pilot group..........

 

[skiandsurf]

Hmmmm yup, so imigine if XJT were able to "code share" with another airline out there. Maybe that would work.

It can work. As I understand this, CAL has given you no other option (sounds familiar). The problem is when the Legacy Carriers with there FF mileage perks come in and match the flights, lower the fares and offer triple mileage. NWA did this to I-Air. As did Delta (Comair). AA did this to Legend.

 

[SMOE]

Just wait until CAL says goodbye to the next batch. Don't think it's going to happen?

We fully expect Larry the Bean Counter to kick us in the sack the next time around. Which is precisely why now is the time to branch out and try to change the regional model for our benefit. Thank God we have the management we do and not the Rev. Bedford or J.O.!

 

[cobalt]

Since when are 145LR/XR's weight challenged? No problems taking 50 + 2 jumpseaters and 2000+ lbs of cargo 99% of the time. The only problems occur when you have a very distant alternate, you run into a landing structural limitation.

man, i must be bad luck... people must love to pack heavy on the flights I work...


I have seemed to run into a ZFW issue with the LR a lot more lately it seems. and also 52 people and 2000 cargo is not really possible in the LR, (unless you have many 1/2 weights)... that is 11828 payload.... 39462 MZFW - 11828 = 27634 and the BOW on the LRs usually around 28000 from my memory.

and as far as the alternate... hmmm.... we had CLL as an alt the other day, weight restriction to 48... changed it to EFD and good for 50 people. CLL isn't very distant, in my opinion.


i'm with you, though, XRs are usually not a problem.

 

[ratherbeflyen]

It can work. As I understand this, CAL has given you no other option (sounds familiar). The problem is when the Legacy Carriers with there FF mileage perks come in and match the flights, lower the fares and offer triple mileage. NWA did this to I-Air. As did Delta (Comair). AA did this to Legend.

I thought people only cared about saving saving 10$ on a ticket and didn't care who they flew on. I'm sure I could quote that from 1000+ other posts on this board.

 

[skiandsurf]

I thought people only cared about saving saving 10$ on a ticket and didn't care who they flew on. I'm sure I could quote that from 1000+ other posts on this board.

This is what surprised me too. This might be the case for the people that fly once every two or three years, but think about all of the people that carry AA or UAL mastercards trying to get those airline points. After a 15 year "relationship", UAL dumped ACA like nothing. UAL treated their own employees like sh*t, made all of their vendors renogiate contracts, but there customers kept coming back. They wanted those FF miles.

 

[XPOO]

When I read the title of this thread, I thought the XJT pilots were doing "manual" flight plans, if you know what I mean.

 

[Master Shake]

There's too many of you naysayers to respond to individually, but let me spell my feelings out.

I'd rather try this and have it not work, then just give up and hand the planes over the CHQ. Secondly, why all the negativity? Are you all really that miserable and spiteful that you'd like to see us fail? If we don't get something else going, we'll be in big trouble in two years when CAL tries to take another 25% of our fleet and hand it over to CHQ.

 

[asdzxc]

Heard this from higher ups. XJT will be flying to 24 cities by July 1 with the initial flights starting on Apr 2. XJet.com opens on Feb 1 for ticket sales. Flights will offer free XM radio, meals on most flights, one dollar for beer and 3 for wine and spirits. Freq Flier program will also be available and possible tie in with another legacy ff program. Look for routes which currently have no nonstop service. They are not advertising as an LCC!! Thicker seat cushions are being added to make the experience even more pleasing. The service is meant to bypass hubs and NOT compete directly with the big 5. Anyway, it will be a noble effort to try something different. Sales will be through all the big GDS guys such as Sabre, Travelocity and Orbitz. Good luck fellows, this just may be what the US transportation system needs!!

 

[skiandsurf]

I'd rather try this and have it not work, then just give up and hand the planes over the CHQ. Secondly, why all the negativity? .

This is the way that the ACA employees thought about Mesa. They went on their own and then went out of business. This is why I am out of the airlines and happy at NJs.

This is what all of you regional pilots can expect for the rest of your career in the regionals. They will continue to grow one, while shrinking another. Whats going on at Comair, ASA, Mesaba, etc. But people are sending their apps into Compass. The cycle continues.

Good luck with the airline. For your sake, I hope it works, but dont think you wont have competition.

 

[The_Russian]

You'd think people would be hoping this takes off. Do you want to see one of the top paying "regionals" starting cutting away at the contract, hurting everyone else's chances of a raise?

It's not that we aren't hoping for it. We do give moral support to the pilot group. However, most people know that it's just not a good business move. There is no money to be made it this. Also, they aren't offering anything "new", "special", or "revolutionary" to the industry. On top of all that, it's almost like they are going to be competing with themselves. Why wage war within your own koffers? You are just going to hurt employees and stockholders. Not to mention, their relationship with their airlines.

 

[ERJFO]

It's not that we aren't hoping for it. We do give moral support to the pilot group. However, most people know that it's just not a good business move. There is no money to be made it this. Also, they aren't offering anything "new", "special", or "revolutionary" to the industry. On top of all that, it's almost like they are going to be competing with themselves. Why wage war within your own koffers? You are just going to hurt employees and stockholders. Not to mention, their relationship with their airlines.

Because you know so much about business... Was paying to fly for GIA a good business move?