Would you vote for Bush if..........

[atafan]

There seems to be an opinion that GW through the invasion of Iraq has created terrorists. The terrorists have been taught since infants to hate the Americans and to die for their cause is a life long mission, albiet short life. Iraq has become a killing field for terrorists. I am proud and thankfull of our American Soldiers and George Bush for taking the battle away from our shores.

We still will see terrorist activities on our soil but the question to all liberals is what would you have done? Kerry/Gore would have gone to the International community and formed even more proclamations, lobbed a few cruise missles and talked about much while doing very little.

GW is a leader who made the toughest decisions and did something he felt was necessary against tremendous pressure, a true leader. We will debate for years whether Iraq was the best decision but inactivity is also a decision.

Can anyone tell me what should have been done? Can anyone tell me one successfull UN involved military action with sustainable positive results? Can America wait and take the liberal defensive position, reacting to the terrorists?

You may disagree with me but might makes right when your talking about my family and my country!

 

[atafan]

I just read this on our ATA Website, posted by one of our pilots. I wanted to share this with you here....

War Hero?

The liberal news media is touting John Kerry as a hero of the Vietnam war!
I personally take great exception to this. As a Vietnam era United States Navy veteran, I feel Kerry is a significant catalyst of the treatment I received whenever I returned to the States. I remember walking down the corridors of airports, in uniform, and literally being shunned. People would stare, and walk to the opposite sides of the halls. Individuals like John Kerry and Jane Fonda were responsible in a huge degree for this inappropriate treatment. I was proud to be a part of the military and continue to be so.

If one wants to look at someone as a hero, lets use some real role models with which to compare. Individuals like my Dad and my Father in law; who served in the United States Navy in WWII. Being in most of the major actions in the Pacific, they came home feeling proud of what they and their shipmates, as well as the rest of their military brothers had accomplished. No one received a medal for a splinter or took an easy out of country after only three months in that day. Every single individual who took part in that conflict is a hero in my book, as well as the many who served honorably in the Vietnam conflict. I have never met a single individual who would have thrown his medals or any representations of his service to his country on the White House lawn.

John Kerry who only used the situation for his political goals and aspirations does not deserve the title of Hero.

News that isn’t being broadcast or printed by the liberal media is the statements by Kerry’s superiors from Vietnam speaking out about the loose cannon, and sub-standard sailor he really was. All one has to do is visit the web site these individual have taken the time and money to create: http://swiftvets.com/ or http://www.swiftboatsbrotherhood.com/ which tell the true story of John Kerry and his service in Vietnam and the damage he did when returning to the states after his brief service.

I for one refuse to fall subject to the rhetoric of the Democratic Party, and the very untruths they orate. They who falsely accuse President Bush of lying, and are willing to facilitate any and every falsehood they or anyone else can dream up about him.

John Kerry is not a hero. He did as many, serve his country however, and to this I give him due. But I, and many of my peers are tired of the false pedestal he is being put upon. Lets tell it like it is, this is after all an election of the President of the United States.
The individual who will lead us for the next four years against a hidden and aggressive enemy. A leader who we will rely on to stay stead fast on the course and not succumb to the petty political pressures we are now seeing thrown about so feverishly.

I would never tell someone how vote, after all I served so everyone would have this freedom. All I would ask is that one would search the truth and their hearts for the true leader we need at this time in our history.

Posted by an ATA Pilot.

 

[DonVerita]

A President must excel on all fronts, he must be multi-faceted, and he must NOT be on a single track but rather be working on multiple levels to achieve the goals that benefit this country and our people. Who is going to level the playing field against the multi-national corporations? Who is going to insure your right to be treated fairly on the job and to unionize if that is what you and your peers desire? Who is going to run this country with the fiscal responsibility most of us hopefully practice in our own homes? Who is going to repair the damage from our arrogant policies around the world in the form of rejection of the Kyoto treaty and our unrelenting destruction of natural resources? Who is going to concentrate on the real threat - Al Queda - rather than spending time, money and unfortunately, lives, on a country (Iraq) that is no worse than the underworld figures living in Saudi Arabia, a country which has the Bush Administration in their back pocket-bought and paid for. And finally, who is going to be looking out for the advancement of the common individual rather than the filthy rich CEO's of companies such as Enron and Halliburton?

On Nov. 2, my vote will proudly go to Kerry/Edwards.

 

[SDF2BUF2MCO]

A President must excel on all fronts, he must be multi-faceted, and he must NOT be on a single track but rather be working on multiple levels to achieve the goals that benefit this country and our people. Who is going to level the playing field against the multi-national corporations? Who is going to insure your right to be treated fairly on the job and to unionize if that is what you and your peers desire? Who is going to run this country with the fiscal responsibility most of us hopefully practice in our own homes? Who is going to repair the damage from our arrogant policies around the world in the form of rejection of the Kyoto treaty and our unrelenting destruction of natural resources? Who is going to concentrate on the real threat - Al Queda - rather than spending time, money and unfortunately, lives, on a country (Iraq) that is no worse than the underworld figures living in Saudi Arabia, a country which has the Bush Administration in their back pocket-bought and paid for. And finally, who is going to be looking out for the advancement of the common individual rather than the filthy rich CEO's of companies such as Enron and Halliburton?

On Nov. 2, my vote will proudly go to Kerry/Edwards.

That's a real hoot. We don't need Kerry/Edwards we need Bill Clinton....and thank you for shopping at Chinamart.

 

[zonker]

A President must excel on all fronts, he must be multi-faceted, and he must NOT be on a single track but rather be working on multiple levels to achieve the goals that benefit this country and our people. Who is going to level the playing field against the multi-national corporations? Who is going to insure your right to be treated fairly on the job and to unionize if that is what you and your peers desire? Who is going to run this country with the fiscal responsibility most of us hopefully practice in our own homes? Who is going to repair the damage from our arrogant policies around the world in the form of rejection of the Kyoto treaty and our unrelenting destruction of natural resources? Who is going to concentrate on the real threat - Al Queda - rather than spending time, money and unfortunately, lives, on a country (Iraq) that is no worse than the underworld figures living in Saudi Arabia, a country which has the Bush Administration in their back pocket-bought and paid for. And finally, who is going to be looking out for the advancement of the common individual rather than the filthy rich CEO's of companies such as Enron and Halliburton?

On Nov. 2, my vote will proudly go to Kerry/Edwards.

And which administration will wipe its collective ass with the U.S. Constitution year after year?

Oh wait...that's W's.

I'll be voting for Kerry.

 

[farmboy]

all the civilians guys are voting kerry. am i the only civilian guy that has a clue?? ..the farmboy

 

[atafan]

Who is going to level the playing field against the multi-national corporations? Who is going to insure your right to be treated fairly on the job and to unionize if that is what you and your peers desire?

How did Clinton vs both Bushes do better at this? I think you are buying into the typical feel good speaches that the libs do with no substance. Let's not forget how many years the Dems controlled the Houses, what glorious changes did they accomplish?

What we really need is a strong third party, to be honest I'm sick and tired of all the BS that both parties blow.

 

[vc10]

Your profile says civilian. I'd rather take a military man's point of view on this subject. If you do not know this as fact, please don't post it. You are entitled to your opinion though by starting your sentence.."In my opinion..".

Uh, how about Colonel David Hackworth:

"The mighty sword that Rumsfeld and Myers inherited four years ago – the finest military force in the world – is now chipped and dulled. And the word is that it will take at least a decade to get our overextended, bone-tired soldiers and Marines and their worn-out gear back in shape. "

see: http://www.sftt.org/hackstarget.html (article of 6-28-04).

You'll remember that, among others, then Chair of the Joint Chiefs Shinseki said that Iraq needed many more troops to hold (as opposed to conquer) before the war. And was ridiculed for his pains. And now we're screwed. Which ready reaction force you gonna send if something falls apart elsewhere in the world? (Hint, they're all pretty much tied down or in need of significant R&R).

And what about those poor bastards in the National Guard who signed up to protect their community in the event of an emergency who now find themselves on garrison duty for over a year, losing their businesses, filing for bankruptcy? That's a great way to thank someone... Our president's incompetence ruining the lives of innocent Americans (not to mention all those families who've lost loved ones, for what?)

 

[Papa3Charlie]

For those of you who think Bush has not done so well in his handling of our country, compare his record to other key points and facts of U.S. history. Learn these facts before election time !!!

There were 39 combat related killings in Iraq during the month of January.....
In the fair city of Detroit there were 35 murders in the month of January.

That's just one American city, about as deadly as the entire war torn country of Iraq.

When some claim President Bush shouldn't have started this war, state the following .

FDR...
led us into World War II.
Germany never attacked us: Japan did.
From 1941-1945, 450,000 lives were lost, an average of 112,500 per year.

Truman...
finished that war and started one in Korea, North Korea never attacked us.
From 1950-1953, 55,000 lives were lost, an average of 18,334 per year.

John F. Kennedy...
started the Vietnam conflict in 1962.
Vietnam never attacked us.

Johnson...
turned Vietnam into a quagmire.
Vietnam never attacked us.
From 1965-1975, 58,000 lives were lost, an average of 5,800 per year.

Clinton...
went to war in Bosnia without UN or French consent,
Bosnia never attacked us.
He was offered Osama bin Laden's head on a platter three times by Sudan and did nothing.
Osama has attacked us on multiple occasions.

In the two years since terrorists attacked US!
President Bush has ...
liberated! two countries, crushed the Taliban, crippled al-Qaida, put nuclear inspectors in Libya, Iran and North Korea without firing a shot, and captured a terrorist who slaughtered 300,000 of his own people.

The Democrats are complaining about how long the war is taking, but...
It took less time to take Iraq than it took Janet Reno to take the Branch Davidian compound.
That was a 51 day operation.

We've been looking for evidence of chemical weapons in Iraq for less time than it took Hillary Clinton to find her Rose Law Firm billing records.

It took less time for the 3rd Infantry Division and the Marines to destroy the Medina Republican Guard than it took Ted Kennedy to call the police after his Oldsmobile sank at Chappaquiddick, drowning Mary Jo.

It took less time to take Iraq than it took to count the votes in Florida!!!!

Our Commander-In-Chief is ! doing a GREAT JOB!

The Military moral is high!

The biased media hopes we are too ignorant to realize the facts.

 

[DenverDude2002]

Great post Papa, Im going to email that to everyone I know

By the way, keep up the great job over there in Iraq

 

[vc10]

Stupid post. Germany never attacked us, but it did declare war on us. It was also an ally of Japan, which did attack us. Germany also attacked a large number of countries in Europe, many of which were democracies. We'd have been insane not to respond against Germany, and for two years we were insane and stood by and did next to nothing (from Sep 1939 to Dec 1941). Which party was isolationist by the way? Right, the Republicans. They wanted nothing to do with getting involved in that war. On the wrong side of history---again.

North Korea, of course, attacked S. Korea, a US partner. Also---and this is key---the war against N. Korea was led by... the United Nations. There was a UN Security Council resolution to attack North Korea (the Soviet Union was, at the time, boycotting the Security Council, they never made that mistake again...). The US fought under the UN flag in the Korean War. You'll remember, of course, that the UN did not endorse the US invasion of Iraq.

And of course, the Bush administration is trying hard to avoid people thinking that Iraq is another Vietnam. Personally, I think there are a lot of parallels---I guess you do too. What I don't understand is why you think that's a good thing.

Bosnia, of course, was a NATO operation. NATO is specifically tasked with the defense of Europe, among other roles. Let's see, Bosnia is where? Oh, right, Europe.

You can't even spell morale.

And the larger point is that pre-emptive attacks, in and of themselves, aren't necessarily wrong---in fact, sometimes they're necessary. STUPID pre-emptive attacks, those are wrong. Unfortunately this administration has discredited the doctrine of pre-emption because they have royally ****ed up in Iraq. That's too bad, because it make us hesitate in the future.

Turns out that even if you were going to invade a country on the grounds of links to terrorism and Al Qaeda it wasn't Iraq---it was IRAN! Dang, Iraq, Iran... those Middle East countries can be s-o-o-o-o confusing...

Ya see, the issue isn't really whether we have a Republican or a Democrat as president. The issue is competency. A Chinese leader once said that it doesn't matter whether a cat is black or white, what matters is whether it catches mice. This president is incompetent. Time for different cat.

For those of you who think Bush has not done so well in his handling of our country, compare his record to other key points and facts of U.S. history. Learn these facts before election time !!!

There were 39 combat related killings in Iraq during the month of January.....
In the fair city of Detroit there were 35 murders in the month of January.

That's just one American city, about as deadly as the entire war torn country of Iraq.

When some claim President Bush shouldn't have started this war, state the following .

FDR...
led us into World War II.
Germany never attacked us: Japan did.
From 1941-1945, 450,000 lives were lost, an average of 112,500 per year.

Truman...
finished that war and started one in Korea, North Korea never attacked us.
From 1950-1953, 55,000 lives were lost, an average of 18,334 per year.

John F. Kennedy...
started the Vietnam conflict in 1962.
Vietnam never attacked us.

Johnson...
turned Vietnam into a quagmire.
Vietnam never attacked us.
From 1965-1975, 58,000 lives were lost, an average of 5,800 per year.

Clinton...
went to war in Bosnia without UN or French consent,
Bosnia never attacked us.
He was offered Osama bin Laden's head on a platter three times by Sudan and did nothing.
Osama has attacked us on multiple occasions.

In the two years since terrorists attacked US!
President Bush has ...
liberated! two countries, crushed the Taliban, crippled al-Qaida, put nuclear inspectors in Libya, Iran and North Korea without firing a shot, and captured a terrorist who slaughtered 300,000 of his own people.

The Democrats are complaining about how long the war is taking, but...
It took less time to take Iraq than it took Janet Reno to take the Branch Davidian compound.
That was a 51 day operation.

We've been looking for evidence of chemical weapons in Iraq for less time than it took Hillary Clinton to find her Rose Law Firm billing records.

It took less time for the 3rd Infantry Division and the Marines to destroy the Medina Republican Guard than it took Ted Kennedy to call the police after his Oldsmobile sank at Chappaquiddick, drowning Mary Jo.

It took less time to take Iraq than it took to count the votes in Florida!!!!

Our Commander-In-Chief is ! doing a GREAT JOB!

The Military moral is high!

The biased media hopes we are too ignorant to realize the facts.

 

[jhill]

I feel so much safer with bush at the helm.

Lets see - attack Iraq, a non-terror nation and create a breading ground for terrorists. A non-terror nation? There is abundant proof Iraq financed terror and even offered a safe haven to bin laden.

Spend Billions and increase our defecit to 600 billion dollars so we can help a bunch of crazys live in democracy when they aren't ready for it. Why don't you just say what you really mean. A bunch of lesser human beings. Last count was over 40 milloin people free to start living a decent life with dignity.

Ruin our international credibility? You must be French. Our credibility has never been higher. Nations know Bush means what he says and the French and Russians don't get to run our foreign policy. I'm sure Clinton can hook Kerry up with some Chinese though.

Bush wants cabotage so foreign subsidied airlines can come over here and take our flying. Nothing but bullsh!^. This is a lobbying effort mainly by FedEx and UPS so they can fly more freely over the world. It will never happen with pax only freight if anything and this started under Clinton Dumb_a$$. At least know what your'e talking about when you whine like this.

Almost up to 1000 of our troops killed why????????? Its obvious you know little of the world but it happens to be a dangerous place. Do you really beleive the men running our country right now would send these young men to die unless they knew it was completeley necessary? We didn't attack Iraq for the hell of it or to settle any score. They were a serious threat to the entire western world. A fact even France agreed with. Unlike the Socialist in the UN, Bush and his admin were not afraid of taking on what needed to be done so go watch a Mikey Moore film and soak up moore of his crap.

Bush is an idiot!!!!!! Bush is arrogant!!!!!!!! Bush can't think for himself!!!!!!! he only believes in big business and thinks they have the answers to everything. You sound like a 10 year old girl throwing a temper tamtrum. Grow up and take some self responsibility. While you watching the Moore flick make sure you watch some of Kerry's "polotical ad" tapes he made in Vietnam. Yep thats right. He actually made films of battle reinactments for his future politacal carreer. I'll bet he edits out all the Jane Fonda clips.

After 9-11 we were a unified nation and the rest of the world was completely with us and supported us. Now the nation is divided and the rest of the world thinks we are a bunch of go it alone cowboys. Working with others is the grease that makes the world go round. You mean Russia and France are mad because we srewed them out of illegal Iraqi oil.

VOTE KERRY!!!!!!!

Its one thing to have opposing political views but your childish attacks are unbelievable by anyone with an IQ over 80. Try arguing some specific points and you will be an asset to your canidate rather than a bumbling idot who makes yourself and John Kerry sound like Cry-baby Al Gore. Now go smoke some dope and come with something a little deeper.

 

[freighterfreek]

repeat after me: we're labor (duh!!!)

if you're voting republican, congratulations, you've been "bubbafied." it's a brilliant strategy, throw in some social issues like guns, god, homosexuals and a little fear and you'll reel in the masses. in the mean time, big business will flourish and labor (yes, that's you) will suffer. Oh yeah, I think McDonalds is hiring.

what do you think george w's stance is on winner-take-all, binding arbitration on workers covered by the RLA? (he supports it) do you think he replied to the AFL-CIO, Transportation Trades Departments (TTD) questionnaire on important labor issues? uh, nope. (www.ttd.org)

for a little history read:
http://www.alpa.org/alpa/DesktopModules/ViewAnnDocument.aspx?DocumentID=4892

again, repeat after me: we're labor. (after 20-years it still amazes me that many pilots don't get it)

 

[SDF2BUF2MCO]

repeat after me: we're labor (duh!!!)

if you're voting republican, congratulations, you've been "bubbafied." it's a brilliant strategy, throw in some social issues like guns, god, homosexuals and a little fear and you'll real in the masses. in the mean time, big business will flourish and labor (yes, that's you) will suffer. Oh yeah, I think McDonalds is hiring.
again, repeat after me: we're labor. (after 20-years it still amazes me that many pilots don't get it)

Freighter, what do you think about the proliferation of jobs leaving the US during Clinton's watch, especially to China? The trial lawyers (mostly Dems), burdensome gubernment regulations, bowing to the almighty dollar business people, politicians who are for sale to the highest bidder, and perhaps "expensive" labor have all given cover for businesses to leave to make the stuff outside the US but turn around and sell to the same people who are out of a job or at the very least a lesser job.
BTW, Walmart/Chinamart's (Arkansas based company where Clinton was the Guv) rise happened during Clinton's watch. Maybe it is just a coincidence. So again, are Dems really pro labor? To me neither party is pro-labor, they just have different ways of approaching it.

VC10, I agree we need a competent President however, I speculate you supported Clinton and will support Kerry (could be wrong on both though). But if you did, isn't that an oxymoron?

 

[KingKong]

POSTED BY JHILL



"Its one thing to have opposing political views but your childish attacks are unbelievable by anyone with an IQ over 80. Try arguing some specific points and you will be an asset to your canidate rather than a bumbling idot who makes yourself and John Kerry sound like Cry-baby Al Gore. Now go smoke some dope and come with something a little deeper."

I was wondering if anyone could help me with what is meant by "childish attacks" in this posting?

 

[freighterfreek]

Freighter, what do you think about the proliferation of jobs leaving the US during Clinton's watch, especially to China? uh, aren't they still going to China, India, the Phillipines, etc. -- I don't think Jorge Bushe has helped much, eh. the exportation of jobs from the US has increased over the past 3-years. more importantly, what's Jorge's stance on cabotage and foreign ownership of US airlines (he won't say). The trial lawyers (mostly Dems), burdensome gubernment regulations, bowing to the almighty dollar business people, politicians who are for sale to the highest bidder, and perhaps "expensive" labor have all given cover for businesses to leave to make the stuff outside the US but turn around and sell to the same people who are out of a job or at the very least a lesser job. so, republicans can't be bought? 2-words: haliburton. Is labor all that expensive? IN our industry, there are many comparisons between the cost of labor at LCC and legacy carriers -- has anyone compared the salaries of mgt vs. mgt at these airlines? BTW, Walmart/Chinamart's (Arkansas based company where Clinton was the Guv) rise happened during Clinton's watch. Maybe it is just a coincidence. yeap, coincidence. wasn't enron texas-based? So again, are Dems really pro labor? yeah, the last I checked, they're pro-labor. To me neither party is pro-labor, they just have different ways of approaching it. i'd guess that everyone has their own opinion (isn't democracy great), however, history has demonstrated that if ya want to hosed; vote republican. oh yeah, welcome to bubba-land.

 

[PBRstreetgang]

Besides, the economy is coming back strong. Obviously lower taxes has worked as advertised. For me, I got a huge refund for 2003 and I took my family on a great vaction this year because of it. Screw socialism, I'm voting for BUSH!

,
Let's see, 4TRILLION surplus, now we have a 4TRILLION deficit, sounds like your kids and grandkids will be paying for that wonderful Bush vacation.
Economy coming back? $43.00 a barrel, yup I guess so.
PBR

 

[46Driver]

,
Let's see, 4TRILLION surplus, now we have a 4TRILLION deficit, sounds like your kids and grandkids will be paying for that wonderful Bush vacation.
Economy coming back? $43.00 a barrel, yup I guess so.
PBR

Great. Blame Bush for China and India using vastly more amounts of petroleum, driving up demand and hence the price. That's pure genius.

As for the deficit, we went into a recession following the tech boom, had to rebuild the national defense, and then go into deficit spending to jumpstart the economy. Once again, blaming Bush for the cycles of capitalism.

 

[PBRstreetgang]

Great. Blame Bush for China and India using vastly more amounts of petroleum, driving up demand and hence the price. That's pure genius.

As for the deficit, we went into a recession following the tech boom, had to rebuild the national defense, and then go into deficit spending to jumpstart the economy. Once again, blaming Bush for the cycles of capitalism.

,
Nope,
I blame Bush for the instability in the world, due to his poorly planned imperialistic excursions. I do blame Bush for the cycles of the economy, the fluctuations are expected, the Clinton administration was heavily pro business, weighted towards corperate america, Bush came into office and threw even more bias towards corperate america, upsetting the balance and even causing wilder economic cycleing. I blame Clinton for NAFTA, which needed to be closely monitored to prevent abuse(loss of american jobs), I am a conservative centrist, who was a card carrying Republican. I am an airline pilot, and by definition LABOR. When I saw GWB at a campaign rally with his father and another guy huddling together and laughing, I knew we were in for trouble when the other guy was identified as Frank Lorenzo, "a long time family friend". This type of poor choice "family friend" is what influences my opinion. Some behavior is so heinous it preclude any assocation, no matter the length of time known. Do your own research.
http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/
PBR

 

[vc10]

Great. Blame Bush for China and India using vastly more amounts of petroleum, driving up demand and hence the price. That's pure genius.

As for the deficit, we went into a recession following the tech boom, had to rebuild the national defense, and then go into deficit spending to jumpstart the economy. Once again, blaming Bush for the cycles of capitalism.

There's at least a $5-10 premium per barrell because of political instability. India + China explains $30 oil, it doesn't explain $40 oil.

Of course, if you're a former oil man (like Bush) and you've got lots of friends in the oil bidnes (bidnes, you know, how they speak in Texas), high oil price ain't the worst thing in the world. Even if you lose the election you'll have a soft landing.

It's screwing over your own industry. But maybe that's OK with you.