Will DAL/NW Merge? Yay or Nay?

[737 Pylt]

So what you're all saying is, none of you has a clue whats going on and your all getting bent out of shape aver no real solid information??

Finally someone with a rational thought!
Thank you superpilot92!:beer:

737

 

[Andy]

So what you're all saying is, none of you has a clue whats going on and your all getting bent out of shape aver no real solid information??

Uh, HELLOOO! We're pilots. Sniping, gossippy housewifes have nothing on us.

Now stop talking while 'As The (airline) World Turns' is on. And pass the bon bons.

 

[Schwanker]

Do I have to hold your hand while you get that chip off your shoulder too?

No hand-holding required. No chip.

The only problem is DAL's belittling perspective of our career expectations. We certainly don't need this mediocre raise that bad. If they don't move from their absurd position, there won't be an agreed upon SLI. It ain't worth getting screwed on a B.S. SLI for a couple year pay raise.

We'll get our pay. We sold out this time in BK to keep the pension. The bottom 1/2 the list was sold out. Next time, they have nothing to hold over our heads. In addition, thousands will be retiring enjoying $150K+ pensions. They have little to gain to work past 60.

Schwanker

 

[737 Pylt]

No hand-holding required. No chip.

The only problem is DAL's belittling perspective of our career expectations. We certainly don't need this mediocre raise that bad. If they don't move from their absurd position, there won't be an agreed upon SLI. It ain't worth getting screwed on a B.S. SLI for a couple year pay raise.

You keep flapping about this, where is this list presentation? Please explain!

We'll get our pay. We sold out this time in BK to keep the pension. The bottom 1/2 the list was sold out. Next time, they have nothing to hold over our heads. In addition, thousands will be retiring enjoying $150K+ pensions. They have little to gain to work past 60.

Schwanker

Great, now can you pease explain this SLI that "screws" the NWA pilots? Or are you continuing to talk out of your arse?

737

 

[Noserider76]

The only problem is DAL's belittling perspective of our career expectations. We certainly don't need this mediocre raise that bad. If they don't move from their absurd position, there won't be an agreed upon SLI. It ain't worth getting screwed on a B.S. SLI for a couple year pay raise.

Schwanker

What is the absurd position you speak of?

 

[Schwanker]

Keep Delta your Delta

I'm tired of all the NW jumpseaters trying to sniff our seats. What is it with you guys? I step to the back for just a second and.....

Don't get too worked about the rumors. We're pissed at you and your arrogant pilot group as well for trying to take the top 500 spots and staple our bottom 3000 guys. See, it works both ways.

Staple the bottom 3000? You really believe that? How about the NWA guys asking for the top 500?

Before it was spinned it, folks from your union said the bottom 3000 would be in last 1/3 of a combined list.If you took the time to do the math, you'd find out the guy 3000 up the current DAL list has a DOH over a year later than the NWA guy behind him would. Have you been briefed on DAL's idea of an SLI? Here's to keeping delta your (and GL's) delta.

Schwanker

 

[Noserider76]

Staple the bottom 3000? You really believe that? How about the NWA guys asking for the top 500?

Before it was spinned it, folks from your union said the bottom 3000 would be in last 1/3 of a combined list.If you took the time to do the math, you'd find out the guy 3000 up the current DAL list has a DOH over a year later than the NWA guy behind him would. Have you been briefed on DAL's idea of an SLI? Here's to keeping delta your (and GL's) delta.

Schwanker

No, I don't believe the top info. I was using an example of rumors and info taken out of context then people (me included) getting spun up.

No, I haven't been briefed on DL's idea for the SLI. That's why I asked. On the contract, I have some good info. Nothing really on the SLI. Can you enlighten me with specifics? I assumed ALPA merger policy would lay the framework. I didn't see DOH anywhere in the policy.

I'm all for keeping DL the way it is now. Believe me, I would like nothing better. It seems to be the universal sentiment here now. The problem is, no matter what they say, I don't think it's our choice. Somewhere along the line we'll either cooperate or be pissed for the rest of our careers like the red and green book guys. I guess you guys are already used to a company that runs like that. We're not.

 

[propdog]

No, I don't believe the top info. I was using an example of rumors and info taken out of context then people (me included) getting spun up.

No, I haven't been briefed on DL's idea for the SLI. That's why I asked. On the contract, I have some good info. Nothing really on the SLI. Can you enlighten me with specifics? I assumed ALPA merger policy would lay the framework. I didn't see DOH anywhere in the policy.

I'm all for keeping DL the way it is now. Believe me, I would like nothing better. It seems to be the universal sentiment here now. The problem is, no matter what they say, I don't think it's our choice. Somewhere along the line we'll either cooperate or be pissed for the rest of our careers like the red and green book guys. I guess you guys are already used to a company that runs like that. We're not.

Right on bro...I share the same sentiments from the NWA side. Like you said, I don't think we have too much of a choice in this merger. We either figure this out amicably or be ready to have something forced down our throat by an arbitrator.

 

[clippyrip]

Somewhere along the line we'll either cooperate or be pissed for the rest of our careers like the red and green book guys. I guess you guys are already used to a company that runs like that. We're not.

How much do you know about Red Book vs Green Book?

 

[Noserider76]

How much do you know about Red Book vs Green Book?

Well, I was a Blue Book DTW DC-9 FO at NW before I left to go to DL.

 

[FDJ2]

No hand-holding required. No chip.

The only problem is DAL's belittling perspective of our career expectations.

That belittling expectation thingy you're talking about is something you have conjured up in your own mind.


We certainly don't need this mediocre raise that bad.

Do you have a copy of what was agreed to by the negotiators?

If you think it's a mediocre raise, then, since we would all be working under the same contract, it would be a pay cut for DAL pilots.

If they don't move from their absurd position, there won't be an agreed upon SLI.

What's the Delta pilot position? Please specify and provide a source.

 

[clippyrip]

Well, I was a Blue Book DTW DC-9 FO at NW before I left to go to DL.

I guess this whole thing is coming full circle for you. If we do merge, I wonder if the SLI would be better for you had you stayed?

 

[Noserider76]

I guess this whole thing is coming full circle for you. If we do merge, I wonder if the SLI would be better for you had you stayed?

Me too. Either way, I'll live with it. This is just a job. If it has to happen hopefully we'll work for a long-term stable company and get back a bit of what was taken from us. Good luck.

 

[Superpilot92]

Me too. Either way, I'll live with it. This is just a job. If it has to happen hopefully we'll work for a long-term stable company and get back a bit of what was taken from us. Good luck.

Thats a great post and exactly what needs to be said by us all. As one solid group we can start getting things back to where they should be. :beer:

 

[JAM-BRO]

Dude, your posts are so full of crap. What displcements are u talking about? We are still hiring at NWA. We are parking 25 DC9s but we are keeping 10 319s that were supposed to be returned to the leasing co. That is 15 a/c. The staffing plans are accounting for this. We are getting a minimum of 18 787s. I heard over 30 when it is all said and done. Deliveries on those are up in the air but they are still coming. We are adding a bunch of european destinations this summer. Bottom line is, displacements???? I don't think so....

It is hard to say Yes, or No. The analysts are struggling with the same question.

There is little doubt a Delta NWA merger would be better for the combined airlines. The global reach of this combination would make it "one he11 of an airline." AirFrance's cash would be used to fund expansion.

It probably is good in the long term for the involved pilots once the pain of SLI is absorbed. The "Fair Plan" I posted seems like the most painless way to integrate for the pilots and the Company.

Both DAL and NWA will continue without this merger. It is not do, or die. However, fuel prices and open skies may force consolidation in the future at a point where the merger might not be as relatively painless as it is now.

Delta's internal rumblings are that planned 777 growth would more than absorb the displaced NWA pilots and there would still be new hires (recently revised upwards to 500).

I think the NWA pilots are walking away from a "once in a lifetime" opportunity. The Delta pilots' Reps seem to realize that this merger is better than the potential alternatives and have been working with management to try to get this deal done. The NWA pilots's Reps may not have been studying industry consolidation as long as their Delta counterparts and may still be at a different point on the learning curve.

Delta seems OK with walking away and reporting to the hedge funds that they gave Wall Street's merger push a good faith effort. Besides, the "synergies" Wall Street wants can be 99% achieved through partnerships and code share. It stinks for the pilots because it could easily result in whip saw where international flights are given to the lowest bidder.

Where you stand on this merger depends on your time horizon. I doubt anyone would say it is a good deal for the next 12 months. Starting with the ramped up 777 & 787 deliveries it would look like a pilots' paradise.