Will ATN/ALPA force this on their pilot group?

[frqntflyr]

Seriously????? I thought it was all rainbows and sunshine over there. So after 6 years you want me to be stapled so I can enjoy that. Presently I'm holding 19 off all weekends and holidays - making 110k a year. So how is this new deal a windfall for the aai pilot?? Answer - It Ain't!!!!

6 yrs and you are only making 110k? Don't you get some sort of base protection for too long? Anyway, I'm on your side. Vote No.

 

[Kharma Police]

So does this mean no more roundups?

I sure hope they do! I think there might be more than one Phantom $hitter next time in ATL.

 

[SWA/FO]

Originally Posted by Max Powers
Seriously????? I thought it was all rainbows and sunshine over there. So after 6 years you want me to be stapled so I can enjoy that. Presently I'm holding 19 off all weekends and holidays - making 110k a year. So how is this new deal a windfall for the aai pilot?? Answer - It Ain't!!!!

Hold the line, money only pays bills, buys food and pays mortgage. That is a lot of cash.

 

[PCL_128]

I don't see you suing ALPA....SWA and Swapa are another story. Your undying loyalty for ALPA at some point will reach a conflict of interest if you want to be a Swapa pilot. (as if it's NOT already...)

SWA and SWAPA don't hold a duty of fair representation towards the AirTran pilots. There isn't anything to sue them for.

And I fail to see how supporting ALPA will be a conflict of interest after I'm a SWAPA member. Can't I support both?

 

[dicko]

SWA and SWAPA don't hold a duty of fair representation towards the AirTran pilots. There isn't anything to sue them for.

And I fail to see how supporting ALPA will be a conflict of interest after I'm a SWAPA member. Can't I support both?

It Pays To Be A Scab At ALPA

At AirTran ALPA our non members; Scabs and the Management pilots that have abused the employees are profiting the most in this SLI.

The have not paid ALPA dues, yet they are the most senior AirTran pilots on the new SWAPA seniority list.

ALPA has ensured that crossing a picket line, not paying union dues and management abuse pays well in terms of seniority.

This paragraph, is the exclamation mark at the end of the story of AirTran ALPA.

Bu Bye

 

[slaquer5]

It Pays To Be A Scab At ALPA

At AirTran ALPA our non members; Scabs and the Management pilots that have abused the employees are profiting the most in this SLI.

The have not paid ALPA dues, yet they are the most senior AirTran pilots on the new SWAPA seniority list.

ALPA has ensured that crossing a picket line, not paying union dues and management abuse pays well in terms of seniority.

This paragraph, is the exclamation mark at the end of the story of AirTran ALPA.

Bu Bye

That is a good point. Why are we even taking them. They are not part of the AT alpa seniority list. They have not paid any dues.

 

[PCL_128]

At AirTran ALPA our non members; Scabs and the Management pilots that have abused the employees are profiting the most in this SLI.

The have not paid ALPA dues, yet they are the most senior AirTran pilots on the new SWAPA seniority list.

Just so the SWA guys know, this isn't really true. Although there are some scabs near the top of our list, most of the pilots on the top did not cross the line. The number one guy on our list was a full-term EAL striker, and wouldn't cross a picket line if his life depended on it.

 

[PCL_128]

That is a good point. Why are we even taking them. They are not part of the AT alpa seniority list. They have not paid any dues.

Many of the scabs do pay dues.

 

[Sacha]

Just so the SWA guys know, this isn't really true. Although there are some scabs near the top of our list, most of the pilots on the top did not cross the line. The number one guy on our list was a full-term EAL striker, and wouldn't cross a picket line if his life depended on it.

Now that there is funny. When he went to Valuejet many of us were shocked. But the shock was replaced by disgust because he would go on and on about how great the Valuejet scabs were and just misunderstood ad nauseum. Of all the Eastern scabs ,most that ended up at Valuejet were the worst of the worst.
They were the small group of 250 or so that crossed on Day 1. Years before the strike they were for the most part intensely disliked throughout the airline for being jerks. In fact, many had been terminated by the company for egregious behavior only to have ALPA get their jobs back. Ironic. We called them "Superscabs" and they were proud of the title. So while yes, this individual did not cross the line, there is a reason why the Superscabs hired him at Valuejet. I would let him ride in the back, but there is no way in h$&ll I would trust him on my jumpseat. Another side of the story for someone who knew him in Atlanta.

 

[Max Powers]

[/I]

Hold the line, money only pays bills, buys food and pays mortgage. That is a lot of cash.

It isn't AAI who is holding the line. We are more than willing to compromise. It is SWAPA that is "holding the line". Their arrogance appears to be destroying their chance at a negotiated settlement and now we will face inevitable Arbitration. In arbitration I would bet that AAI pilots will at a minimum get better than a staple, which is what SWAPA is offering now for pilots with over 35% relative seniority or 6 years - That is SWAPA "holding the LINE". Wow you SWA guys had so much to gain but you got sooooo Greedy - well that isn't the first time and it won't be the last time for pilots and over playing their hand.

 

[GuppyWN]

And I fail to see how supporting ALPA will be a conflict of interest after I'm a SWAPA member. Can't I support both?

You're either with us or against us.

Gup

 

[Max Powers]

You're either with us or against us.

Gup

Dang, little boy you don't see the big picture here. By supporting the industry as a whole we all benefit the next time any of us go up to negotiate a new contract.

 

[jonjuan]

You're either with us or against us.

Gup

Poser. Max, she'll never get it. Too interested in herself.

 

[Fubijaakr]

Poser. Max, she'll never get it. Too interested in herself.

That's why she's the #1 poster on the "geezermeter" thread.

 

[OldManPilot]

Good luck Lear-
You've been good- and fine on the CYA- but at some point this culture means you join the team and don't argue and fight and bit pick every term- bc you know no one's trying to screw you- very few of you are as reasonable as you- and then you want acknowledgement for having to change bases, when that could have happened regardless- there's very little gratitude for being bought by us- and in fact- I'm called arrogant for suggesting you ought to be.
I've lived NUTS, I contribute- Ive changed bases for this career, including when I got on here- but you're spinning a very lucky good thing in your career and trying to say its a sacrifice, yes- pisses me off- there are way too many in this world who'd love to be in your position to give credence to that. It's dumb and ungrateful. You guys all want us to forget that you were getting pissed on and voted overwhelmingly to strike. And now swa buying you, somehow isn't good for you. I've actually read NUTS again since this-I volunteer, and I promise- I'm not your problem- you guys come in with the slightest humility and I'll argue for you, as I have in the past. It's AT pilot attitudes that are getting an appropriate response from me and our pilot group.

Your union delaying for delay's purpose, pisses me off- PCL and the alps conflict of interest manifesting itself so predictably, pisses me off- and now I'm seeing signs of you Lear, one of the good dudes there, going on to get along and getting influenced by what you guys think you deserve. Why do you think you have this kind of leverage? Why on earth have you convinced yourself that this is a "sacrifice" bc of some short term logistics you'll have to deal with.
Again- smallest violin... Get some perspective and come in EXCITED AND HAPPY- but you can't take take take from Swapa and say you'll be anything different with swa when your on the list.

And that's the part of the culture you guys don't seem to understand: YOU MUST GIVE IN ORDER TO RECEIVE.
Do you know that, in transition, on first year pay, new hires are fully expected to plan AND FUND the next new hire party- none of the guys making big money- it's on us! They want us to own this culture from day 1. Same day, we're fully expected, no matter what our finances, to donate $100/each to charity as a class. These are small gestures to an overall theme that it is not about YOU and YOUR selfish situation- you're job is to take care of everyone you see, and by default- you will be taken care of by everyone else. Selfishness breaks down over time- selflessness builds- it creates far in excess of what's put in. And 5 pilots in and around my class were let go bc they didn't have the attitude- and showed entitlement.
So though your pilots' and ALPA beliefs, attitudes, and actions may be totally appropriate if you were merging w/ any other carrier- but the me first ethic you guys are showing is the worst move you could make.
And I'm positive that's in NUTS.
So again- good luck Lear- everyone wants to help the beaten dog- until it shows too much a tendency to bite.

I am one of the 650 being stapled. I have read this post several times and I truly believe the sincerity and honesty of the post. I will be voting "YES" because of the exact things posted by waveflyer. I am willing to give to receive and am placing my trust in the SW culture. All I ask is to be treated as a brother and not as someone that is "not worthy". It's time to check our egos at the door and look toward a positive future.

 

[scoreboardII]

Lear, you'll love it over here, right after we finish with our suppository implant.

 

[Lear70]

Lear, you'll love it over here, right after we finish with our suppository implant.

Just take the Academy ring off first... and maybe the watch, too.

 

[SWA/FO]

Many of the scabs do pay dues.

but not all.

 

[PCL_128]

but not all.

The only ones who don't are the ones who ALPA has prohibited from being members (basically the guys who were ALPA members at EAL before the strike and still crossed). Everyone else is covered by agency shop, which means they are required to pay or lose their jobs.

 

[SWA/FO]

It isn't AAI who is holding the line. We are more than willing to compromise. It is SWAPA that is "holding the line". Their arrogance appears to be destroying their chance at a negotiated settlement and now we will face inevitable Arbitration. In arbitration I would bet that AAI pilots will at a minimum get better than a staple, which is what SWAPA is offering now for pilots with over 35% relative seniority or 6 years - That is SWAPA "holding the LINE". Wow you SWA guys had so much to gain but you got sooooo Greedy - well that isn't the first time and it won't be the last time for pilots and over playing their hand.

Say what?