Why is AT&T losing its pilots?

[rumrnr78]

oh horse puckey. when companies get rid of people, it's just that. they don't want them back.

You maybe right in some cases. In ours, we were told that we would be brought back (some unknown list) as staffing needs warranted. We weren't fired. We received a generous severance package. There may have been some that would not be asked to return but not all 19.

Anyway, it's academic at this point. AT&T was a good job when I was there but I wouldn't have returned due to my opportunity overseas. it would be hard to leave a great G550 gig to go back to T.

Cheers-

Rum

 

[LegacyDriver]

Exactly, Rum. In fact at least one of "the people they didn't want back" to paraphrase the false assumption posited previously....actually got pulled off the surplus list before the move because one guy who was kept decided not to move to Dallas. I would say virtually every pilot furloughed is worthy of recall. There are some great people in that list. Many are better off, so that's good. Not sure about all though.

It was a numbers game for most who were let go, especially the bottom 12 or so. Politics was well above the junior third of the group. It had no bearing on things for that bunch (it sure helped Slats, Heyyyy, and one or two others though). When you wipe out half your fleet overnight, well....

If the fleet had not been cut nobody would have been let go. And, yes, they did let a guy go long before the furlough because he wasn't up to the job. The list had much less to do with the quality of the people on it than it did seniority, at least until you got to the higher part of it.

My point is they would be better served recalling the good guys like you, CRJ, JO, etc. than street hires. Not that you would take it... Good people are leaving there in big numbers. Make of that what you will.

 

[GLEXPilot]

The legacy is a crappy plane.

 

[LegacyDriver]

The list had much less to do with the quality of the people on it than it did seniority, at least until you got to the higher part of it.

Let me clarify as I do not wish to insult anyone on the higher end of the furlough list, either. Good people there, too, clearly.

".....(H)igher part of it where politics played a larger role."

 

[semperfido]

You maybe right in some cases. In ours, we were told that we would be brought back (some unknown list) as staffing needs warranted. We weren't fired. We received a generous severance package. There may have been some that would not be asked to return but not all 19.

Anyway, it's academic at this point. AT&T was a good job when I was there but I wouldn't have returned due to my opportunity overseas. it would be hard to leave a great G550 gig to go back to T.

Cheers-

Rum

yes, I too was "let go" from a similar job and with a great severance pkg, it's semantics. I was fired, so were you. and no, I wouldn't go back either.

 

[Turtledriver]

The story is nobody was fired. All were told the would be able to comeback as others left. One guy asked the CP, and was told no. HR wouldn't allow it because of the severance package. Then a guy who quit, actually quit, calls his buddy Asst CP, and they do some secret Navy hot bunking and poof, no HR problem. Guess it didn't sit well with a lot of people.

 

[Turtledriver]

If anybody was on the fence about staying at At&t they probably are looking now. Raises or lack of raises for most came, out and it was pretty bleak. Management doesn't like pilots discussing such matters, but everyone e talks. Senior guys got zilch to very little. The young guys got a couple percent. This is after they got zero raises a few years ago. Folks are liviid.

 

[rumrnr78]

Like I wrote before, I remember thinking I was mid to low paid Falcon pilot in my fancy Brooks Brothers. I figured I would be ok since I was with a Fortune company. How wrong I was! Thank God for being "surplus"...

Lesson here, always have a resume ready to go out in a day. Keep your logbook updated and copies of your current training!

 

[jonjuan]

If anybody was on the fence about staying at At&t they probably are looking now. Raises or lack of raises for most came, out and it was pretty bleak. Management doesn't like pilots discussing such matters, but everyone e talks. Senior guys got zilch to very little. The young guys got a couple percent. This is after they got zero raises a few years ago. Folks are liviid.

Spirit, UAL and Spirit are hiring, FYI. Sounds like they won't give raises until most people decide to quit. Good luck.

 

[Newkem]

Spirit, UAL and Spirit are hiring, FYI. Sounds like they won't give raises until most people decide to quit. Good luck.

Don't forget UAL and Spirit and UAL.

 

[hammer2]

Is AT&T hiring?

 

[Turtledriver]

Sounds like the will be soon. They have mismanaged the pilots so badly that they can barely cover trips, ie. Atlas Air Pilots have a better schedule and better pay. An asst chief wont be able to scream at his kid anymore as he will retire shortly. But then again, he hasn't flown in months. There are some others that may have to retire soon, and expectations that a couple more are so disappointed at at&t they are just waiting on phone calls. But as of today, no.

 

[Turtledriver]

Let the hiring begin, as another pilot is fed up and retires. Will they call back any of those they let go?

 

[Turtledriver]

Sounds like the CP and Pompous A still can't do the right thing. Director has no input as he is still completely clueless about anything aviation related. Instead of keeping their promise, they have found some new people, to hire. 2 off the street.

 

[sleepy]

Sounds like the CP and Pompous A still can't do the right thing. Director has no input as he is still completely clueless about anything aviation related. Instead of keeping their promise, they have found some new people, to hire. 2 off the street.

After all that has been said here, why would anybody want to go back to ATT?

 

[ksu_aviator]

After all that has been said here, why would anybody want to go back to ATT?

After all that is said on here, why would they want the "furloughed" pilots back? FI isn't anonymous, no matter how hard you try to hide it, they know who's trashing them and who's not.

 

[Turtledriver]

Is it trashing or peeling back the curtain? A department in such disarray isn't a place many people want to fly for. Unless its building time or in a holding pattern for a good job.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

Is it trashing or peeling back the curtain? A department in such disarray isn't a place many people want to fly for. Unless its building time or in a holding pattern for a good job.

Oh don't worry, they wont have a problem finding pilots to fly their corporate jets.

I'm sure they have issues like any big department, but 99% of people reading this thread interpret it as a few laid-off, disgruntled pilots (signing on with multiple user names?) that cant move on.

Every large place uses cutbacks to get rid of their problems. There's no such thing as a "furlough", this isn't a regional airline. Behind all the fake goodbyes and empty promises be assured....it was all orchestrated in advance and they couldn't be happier...and c'mon, do you think they really care what people are saying on pilot message boards?

Anyhow....AT&T does not sound like the right fit for some, hopefully they went on to better places for their careers.

Its just a job, life is way too short to be so bitter and unhappy.

 

[Turtledriver]

You are correct, they won't have a problem filling these spots. Fast food places also have the ever present "Now Hiring" sign in the window. Everyone wants to fly their first Jet sometime. The problem with that and one that should concern all of us in corporate aviation is this. When the passengers see an ever rotating mix of new faces, what separates a corporate department from a fractional. Both will get you from A to B. Corporate departments sell intangies. Increased security (unless the entire security firm is fired after a certain asst cp swore how good they were, and how he would trust his family with the to the pots who dared question their value. Egg on the face?). But also the security of conducting company business within company employees. Fractionals want that business and can always do it cheaper (maybe). So when a department goes into the downward spiral, and long time pots are jumping a sinking ship, others should take notice. The last guy to leave was nowhere near retirement age. Just fed up and left. That is significant.

As far as not calling back those they chopped. That is simply poor management. I doubt many were nothing more than being on the wrong end of a purchased companies pots wrongly placed on top of current employees. No master plan to weed out bad people. No organized effort to clean the sheets. The just lost -5 or 6 airplanes and had to reduce their pilots. They chose very poorly. Asst chief pilots sold out those they were supposed to support for their kids. Didn't work out but they put all their effort into that instead of helping those under them. Another asst chief flat out chose anyone that worked at Cingular over those who had been with the purchasing company. But his kid stayed so they could have family arguments in the cabin. One of the reasons the last guy left was he just couldn't stomach on of the little Bell South guys being selected as the next yes man and being given seniority over him. Guy had over 25 years and some guy that is seen as a yes man is chosen for less resistance.

The place is on life support. And yes. They do read the board and are very concerned. Not because they want to fix a thing But because they can't stop the exodus

 

[CorpCaptain]

After 12 pages I think its safe to say the curtain has been pulled back, torn & burned to ashes. Enough already. Move on folks.