Why I hate MESA!!

[Catbird]

Jeffery Dahmer wrote-
" I interviewed with Florida Gulf back in summer of '92, and at that time there was no mention of any pay for training. If I had been hired, I would have gone to class at JAX without putting up any cash."

Yea, I bet you were eager to fly them airliners for welfare qualifying pay and 22day lines. You could tell mommy and daddy the 30k they spent to get you a job was great. Even had a nice costume with interchangeable wings for one airline to another. Just depended upon which group of union pilots they were attempting to lowball.

Mesa- dba-Florida Gulf was established in the Florida market to break a imminent strike form the ALPA pilots at Henson/Piedmont in the early 90's. Larry Risley and Usair had the strike breakers ready with Florida Gulf if the Union pilots struck. These fine aviators are flying the Sky's as Mesa CRJ Ca today. They always profess ignorance or refute the Truth but the Truth is in the establishment of Florida Gulf / Mesa in the Commuter ranks as a strike breaking, low cost, screw the profession group of **sholes. Babbit welcomed them into Alpa. He was paving the way to reintroduce the scabs from Continental years later and knew they would appreciate socializing with fellow scabs.

 

[typhoonpilot]

Boo:

Okay, I'll admit, maybe I am wrong about the PFT at Mesa in the early 90s and am confusing it with their PDP. I'll also admit I wasn't sure about Florida Gulf, it must have been they required seniority resignation, but something made me cross them off my list as well.

Now, as for my current carrier, you are correct, they don't pay for a ticket to the interview. However, they put you up in a five star hotel for four nights and pay for your meals the entire time you are there. Then when you get hired you start on full pay from the day you get on an airplane to come to class, which is usually four or five days before the class date. The ticket to the interview is something of a test to see if you are really interested. It is a serious airline with massive expansion plans and they can't be bothered interviewing people who are not serious about coming to work for them.

It still remains that Mesa Air Group, notice I didn't say Mesa pilots, put WestAir out of business and adversely affected their pilots. That is the reason I hate Mesa which is the title of this thread.

Typhoonpilot

 

[JBcrjca]

Hey Catbird, what's with your attitude? And the Jeffery Dahmer reference? You lost me on that one. I was merely illustrating the point that FG did not have PFT in the summer of '92 when I interviewed, and you start bashing me?? What a numbnutz.

I don't have to justify myself to anyone, but in this case I'll take a stab at it. I didn't have a rich mommy and daddy to pay $30K for my ratings. I started when I was 15 and got each license/rating as my age and $$ would allow. I built time by instructing, ferry flying, a bunch of renting, whatever time I could get. Eventually I was flying single-pilot 135 freight in a Baron. The industry was in the crapper in the early '90s, I remember it very well. I didn't really want to work for FG for several reasons, but interviews were hard to get back then. If nothing else, it was good practice for future interviews. I'm sure that most guys on this board would have gone to the interview as well. I consider myself lucky to have been turned down, and I ended up flying the Baron for a total of 3 years. I'm pretty sure I've paid my dues.

But the plot thickens...in late '93 I got hired by Allegheny, checked out on the 1900 based in BGM. I was at the bottom of the seniority list. After 4 months and 30 hrs of flying, we heard rumors about being overstaffed. Of course, I was one of the first guys to get the call from the chief pilot letting me know that I was being furloughed. But the main reason for the furloughs was that Mesa/FG was buying many of the routes/assets of ALG. All of the 1900s and SD360s went to FG. Only the Dash 8s remained. So there we were, furloughed apprentice ALPA members... some were hired by FG, others chose to go elsewhere. I chose the latter. ALPA did send us furlough-assistance packets filled with useless outdated information... very nice of them. Shortly thereafter, the 9 ALG 1900s were sold to Ameriflight, and the SD360s were disposed of. I guess FG just wanted the routes and facilities, but none of the fleet.

My point is this, Catbird...maybe you should think about the facts behind the story before you start spouting off like that. I'm guessing that you work for one of the USAir WOs and you were threatened by Mesa/FG and you still hold a grudge. Maybe you should visit a professional to help you deal with your anger, or just spank your inner child.

My apologies to all for the length of this post.

 

[stillaboo]

So, I got the essence of FG. Anyone know why 'Desert Sun' was started? Another Mesa Air Group subsidiary, I believe they had F-100's, and assume they were in and around PHX in the early 90's. All I know is most of the guys who went there were intergrated back into the Mesa list and lost some seniority in the deal (they were all really senior at Mesa). Most of the guys who went to Desert Sun and stayed with Mesa (fools) were the first guys to volunteer to go over to Freedom. Like I said, fools. Anyone know why it was started, and why it failed?

-Boo!

 

[wscrj]

F-70's

Actually, they were F-70's. Up to 6 at one time. You are correct, the guys that went over to Desert Sun lost a bunch of seniority when they were merged back in as part of MESA's first CBA.

THey were PHX based.

 

[bobbysamd]

Mesa liars

Once upon a time there was a good little commuter airline in California called WestAir . . . . Can't remember the exact date, but lets call it a couple of years later, Mesa Air buys WestAir. WestAir is a unionized carrier with decent wages for a regional. Mesa, at that time, is a non-unionized carrier whose new hire pilots must pay $10,000 or so to be a first officer on a Beech 1900 at crappy wages. Slowly observers see Mesa Beech 1900s flying WestAir routes in Southern California. To make a long story short this cancer spreads until WestAir folds in the late 1990s, a shell of it's former self. All because of Mesa . . . . That is why I hate Mesa, not necessarily the pilots, but definitely the company.

(emphasis added)

Good history lesson, especially about WestAir/United Express. My first regional interview was there.

I interviewed at Mesa in 1990, about two months after my WestAir interview. I was rejected. Ten years ago, I had suffered a termination from a subsequent job. I applied to MAPD as an instructor, was interviewed, and was hired. I disclosed fully my problem at my previous job on my app and at my interview. I was very excited about being hired by MAPD, because the real deal for MAPD instructors back then was being sent to ground school to become 1900 FOs. I thought that after five-plus years of futility in trying to get a regional airline job that I would get my chance.

Not so. After I had moved one-thousand miles and reported to Corporate, I was asked for a five-year job history. I provided all details of my previous job and termination, which, again, I explained fully to the Chief Instructor and Gary Risley, the corporate counsel, at my interview. The personnel lady then said that I might not be eligible for hire at all because of my termination. She said it was Mesa's policy not to hire pilots who suffered terminations. Shock was not the word, especially after I had just moved a thousand miles for a job I thought I had. The personnel lady then went back and talked to her boss, and everything was straightened out, to the extent that I would be hired at MAPD.

The Chief Instructor told me a day or two later that I could work for MAPD but I could not be considered for hire as a Mesa Airlines pilot because of my termination. He said he was not aware of a terminated pilot no-hire policy. To this day I do not believe him. And, surely, the Corporate Counsel must have known of this policy.

This experience, among other reasons, is why I do not like Mesa.

I know I push MAPD quite a bit on these forums. I like the program because of the potential and training it offers for new pilots. Students pay a bunch of money for their training, but it is not P-F-T because they earn ratings and a degree. I certainly would not recommend Mesa for a long-term career because of my experience there and for reasons others above enumerated. I realize that Frank O. (intentional) and not the Risleys are in charge, but, as the expression goes, the more things change the more they stay the same.

 

[skydrvr]

Mgmt that does not care. And then those that will work for free to a point where an industry standard that was fought long a hard for by an unforgiving airline known as Comair now means nothing. Thanks Mesa for making our jobs that much easier for a lessor wage!

 

[bobbysamd]

<Sigh>

[T]he lowest seniority Freedom guy . . . was hired at Skywest and put some derogatory stuff up in the breakroom while there . . . Sounds like a real winner, huh?

It's unbelievable how the least deserving so often get the most breaks. I tried for years to get a SkyWest interview. That would have been an almost-perfect career situation for me. Had Mesa worked out for me, it would have been a good situation, too.

B/c he was an MAPD instructor . . . he knew about Freedom, and went there. Freedom hired him on the spot . . . . Mesa has interviews and would never have let this guy work with them, but JO was perfectly happy with Freedom doing it.

(emphasis added)

Clearly, when he needs them, Frank O. likes those who crawl on their bellies instead of those who stand up and walk on their two feet.

There was a certain Mesa check airman and DE whose name I spotted on the Freedom list when it came out. What a surprise. <big sigh> I will not give names on a public board, but MAPD ATP trainees and long-time Mesa pilots will know who I mean.

 

[colored_airman]

No, I dont hate Mesa but I pitty the fool
And I will destroy any airline who tries to take what I got.

My prediction is PAIN !!!!

 

[WhiteCloud]

No, I dont hate Mesa but I pitty the fool
And I will destroy any airline who tries to take what I got.

My prediction is PAIN !!!!

"Remember where you came from. Remember what it took to get you here. You remember what he did to you last time right?"