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What is your "oh Sh*t" moment?

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The reason I was interested in those comments is because you described a climb rate of 1,000 fpm in the 24D. That airplane should be doing 6,000 fpm, and it's quite capable of an initial climb close to double that...it's got terriffic climb performance. It's got great performance on one engine, too.

If you were able to manage a thousand feet per minute, then you were experiencing a considerable downdraft. The scenario you described sounds as though you were landing in close proximity to strong convective activity, and almost sounds as though you landed into the advance gust front of a microburst. In such a case, the risk of an overrun is preferable to the much higher risk of attempting flight in a severe downdraft.

You didn't state weather your airplane was equipped with T/R's or not, or if it had the drag chute, but both are available for just such an occasion. (If the winds are gusting hard, be sure to jettison that chute before long, however). The 24D has a limited form of antiskid: it's not fully modulating and the pilot still has the capability of locking up a wheel even if the antiskid is working correctly.

I can't judge what you did. I wasn't there, didn't see it, and don't know enough about it. But the circumstances as described sounded very much like a recipe for disaster. If that quantity of rain was coming down, it would have had a significant radar signature. This should have been a warning sign before ever attempting the landing, especially by panning upward with tilt to see what was coming down.

You stated that you'll be proud to see someone delay because of weather. This happens all the time, and the scenario you described sounds like a good time to re-evaluate weather a landing attempt or an approach is even advisable. With a strong return over or on the field, it's quite possibly a good time to be looking at holding until it passes, or at an alternate field.

I realize that the fuel gauge in the Lear 24D goes down so fast you can see it move, and this means that if you want to hold out and wait, you won't have much time. Therefore, giving strong consideration to an alternate is a good idea.

Standard practice calls for manual air ignition during an approach in that airplane, but as the life of the ignitors and plugs are limited, many pilots don't use them all the time. If this were the case, passage into heavy rain could have resulted in a dual flameout (it does happen) without those ignitors on. I'm guessing you probably followed SOP and had them on for the landing...but it's one more thing to consider.
 
I have read this entire thread and I have come to the realization that I haven't seen anything yet. The squirrels inside of me started running up the trees after I picked up about 1/8th of an inch of ice on an IFR cross country a few days ago.

After reading these stories, makes me wanna scoff at my scenario. But I won't, I don't like ice built up where it is not supposed to be. Especially in a 172, with a low time IFR pilot (me) at the controls by himself.
 
*Seat of my pants

It was an 82 degree day in mid-Fla.
I was sittin' right seat of a Warrior 161 and my 'double I' buddy that I was flyin' with just made the landing into the grass strip we were visiting for a few days. (There were actually 6 of us total visiting Airpark with 3 different airplanes.) The other 4 guys got to play observers in this Oh Sh*t moment.

Here goes: The 6 of us had been buzzin' around the Local area in formation, testing out various pvt strips of ppl we'd been in contact with days prior.

After landing the Warrior on (Rnwy 22) this particular strip we needed to gas up. We topped off the wings from the self-serve AV Gas tanker and began to taxi back to where our other two birds were parked. (At the opposite end of the sloped Rnwy 4/22)

Runway 4 is sloped uphill. My buddy (<- I call him that now, but after what he does next, I've reserved a much more deragatorty title) was at the controls. As we chugged along uphill, at max gross wt., on the active grass, he powers up the throttle to what seemed to be just a high speed taxi back to park; as were "my intentions." Mid- field of this 2800ft grass strip, he firewalls the throttle. I glance over at him wide-eyed as if the look on his face will explain to me what the heIl he was doing. I guess at this point it's pertinent to note the tail wind condition we were in and the 100ft tree line obstacle that lie ahead. I'm thinking "Oh Sh*t" "MIXTURE IDLE"...NOW! Too late, we've begun to rotate and are skiddishly climbing out with density alt. beating down on us.

We skirtted along, feet from the pine needles, stall horn blaring. Repeatedly, I'm chanting, nose level...ride it out, nose level, ride it out.

He did... and eventually we gained the airspeed needed to get up and out.
I honestly thought we were an NTSB report after the wheels left the ground.

We retured to land safely and I made a B-line to the restroom to change out my pants.
 
He'd have been eating his dinners thru a #@!^&*% straw for the next three months after I got him back down on the ground.

Minh
 
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I didn't read that part before...that's definately her style o' babbling. I can just see her in the CAP"uniform".

The glasses are killer.

Good find! How the hell did you come up with that one?

I guess the real question is, where is Jedi Inane?
 
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Are you guys reffering to the coments on the photopage? I think that written by someone else, look at the bottem it's signed by a Howard.

*shrugs*
 
It's disappointing that so much activity here is spent bashing others, instead of leaving well enough alone. It's a childish behavior: when nothing is left to offer, attack.

Why is that?
 
Yes, Iceman, it's definately the "primative subconsious [sic]"...it's definately that. Or the fact that she's a BSing know/done-it-all who is annoying as crap.
 
Iceman21 said:
it is easier to attack a person, than to make yourself vulnerable by extending a helping hand.

No, Iceman, that's not what's going on here. Frequently some low time pilot, student, or wannabe joins the group, and announces his presence. You'll find that to a person everyone bends over backward to make him or her welcome, encourage them, and answer thier questions, even the most basic and obvious of questions. No, there's plenty of encouragement, support and help for newcomers.

If jedi had quietly joined the group and contributed when she could and listened and learned, she would have been afforded the same respect. No, instead she plasters this and other forums with her claims that she knows more about flying than pilots with "decades sitting front seat of an airliner", how the "little things" like instrument and electrical failure in IMC "don't bother her anymore", her tales of the dozens of lives she's saved, and how she knows special secret instrument tecniques that are known only to her. Look, when a 700 hour pilot starts slinging such utter garbage, she's going to attract attention, and it's not going to be good. I know that a few people, myself included, politely suggested that she might tone down the fantasies a bit. She chose to ignore the advice. She's a bit like the kid who came on recently pretending to be a Concorde pilot. Her stories are about as credible, the difference is, the kid eventually admitted he was just blowing smoke and apologized.

Perhaps you are right, we should just ignore her twaddle, but be aware that this didn't happen in a vacuumn, no-one singled her out at random.

regards
 
She has an Eagle ATR on her web page. Anyone turned her in to the AMR trademark gods? You know how they pout about their chickens being posted without permission...
 
AMR Legal and I have already had an exchange of letters. Why don't ya find something unique to hammer on? Like high wings versus low wings?

Fly SAFE!
Jedi Nein
 
How about the pitch/power relationship? Self professed experts always seem to have a unique outlook on that...
 
**CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED**it, haven't I explained this enough yet?

Pitch controls how much damage there's going to be when you impact the earth.

Power controls how much noise is made when you impact the earth.

What more is there to know?

-Brian
 

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