What international airlines hire Americans?

[kingsize]

I'd be interested in an international job in a few years, say Hong Kong, New Zealand, Japan, Australia, etc.
What is the general attitude of foreign airline companies of hiring Americans?
Is the pay as good as US companies?

 

[X man]

American Expats

Singapore Airlines, Cathy,(depending on your experience), Saudi, Emerates,(sp) Gulf Air, Some hiring in Japan now, Korean Airlines, etc. Hook up to Pprune, they have sections there on the Middle East, Sout East Asia etc. You get the overseas tax break, housing is usually involved in the MIddle East, Singapore pays a subsidy on housing .

Plus its international flying which is a great education.

Good Luck

 

[Check 6]

I believe that India also accepts all ICAO member states (includes US).

 

[Simon Says]

Are'nt all Americain pilots a bunch of cowboys? We don't have any skills and cannot handle this thing called flying.

 

[typhoonpilot]

Are'nt all Americain pilots a bunch of cowboys? We don't have any skills and cannot handle this thing called flying.

I know you said that as a sarcastic comment, but it is an impression that is made by Americans who fly overseas. Not in regards to skills, but in regards to lack of procedural discipline and a general lack of knowledge.

I would put the skills of an American pilot against any other in the world and the American will generally win, hands down, especially in regards to hand flying skills. I wouldn't, however, put an American in a knowledge contest against a European or Australian/Kiwi Pilot as the cracker jack box ATP exam is a joke in comparison to the theory that those pilots must learn.


TP

 

[Galaxy]

I agree with you but theory will not help you at all when your Airbus loses all power over the atlantic and you get to deadstick it into a small island. Knowledge of the systems and performance have saved far more lives than being able to rebuild a VHF Radio with spare parts from the galley. Was it not all that long ago a Heavy Airliner from the Far East declared an emergency due to an autopilot failure? An inconvienence-Yes and a RVSM disqual but an emergency? Nice theory there..

 

[B-J-J Fighter]

I agree with you but theory will not help you at all when your Airbus loses all power over the atlantic and you get to deadstick it into a small island. Knowledge of the systems and performance have saved far more lives than being able to rebuild a VHF Radio with spare parts from the galley. Was it not all that long ago a Heavy Airliner from the Far East declared an emergency due to an autopilot failure? An inconvienence-Yes and a RVSM disqual but an emergency? Nice theory there..

WORD!

 

[filejw]

That 737 rating will get you work in a lot of places right now if you have a bit of time in type.

 

[typhoonpilot]

I agree with you but theory will not help you at all when your Airbus loses all power over the atlantic and you get to deadstick it into a small island. Knowledge of the systems and performance have saved far more lives than being able to rebuild a VHF Radio with spare parts from the galley. Was it not all that long ago a Heavy Airliner from the Far East declared an emergency due to an autopilot failure? An inconvienence-Yes and a RVSM disqual but an emergency? Nice theory there..

You might have chosen a different example. First they were Canadian and second, they lost power in that Airbus because the didn't recognize a fuel leak and didn't quite understand the fuel system well enough. They opened a cross feed to place more fuel into the leaking side. After that major screw up they saved the day by dead sticking in. Pilot error was listed as one of the factors in the incident.

Your Far East example is nice, but nowhere did I say the Asian pilots had better skill or knowledge than Americans. That is clearly not the case.

As an American who flies overseas my observations are backed up with many examples. When speaking in generalizations, as we are, there will always be examples to argue the other side, but in general Americans are better at hand flying and Euros/Aussies have better knowledge.


TP

 

[Golden Falcon]

well...the technical knowledge required to pass the theory exams for initial certification in these countries might be tighter, that tends to be theory, and not necessarily practical knowledge..I would say a pilot's skills and knowledge are an individual thing, not one of nationality or licence origin....the anti-american side of piloting comes from ignorant individuals protecting their own little overseas feifdoms, and not from fact or otherwise...in fact bar very few..American licences and American pilots are accepted on equal terms as most other expats....many of them at my overseas-based airline myself included!

as far as employment...Europe requires "right to work" much as we do in the USA

Australia same, and the market is a bit tight there as well...a bit of history in 1989 America West..owned by Ansett aus (25%) sent quite a few "replacement pilots" to operate ansett flights during a dispute...so a bit of bad blood there...

Brunei...still convinced by some ignoramus' only the New Zealand, or British CAA licence is acceptable

There may be a couple more...not too sure...

 

[b757driver]

I'd be interested in an international job in a few years, say Hong Kong, New Zealand, Japan, Australia, etc.
What is the general attitude of foreign airline companies of hiring Americans?
Is the pay as good as US companies?

In answer to your question:
Yes, there are jobs out there. Indeed, far more than there are in the US and generally speaking, you don't need "buddies" to bat for you and there is less ************************* footing around. They either want you or they don't. No need to wait years for a response or play silly, time-wasting games. That's why there are many American pilots (furloughed or otherwise) working overseas.
I would suggest you do a search on aviation websites, either the airline of interest or the usual agencies: parc, direct, rishworth, wynnwith. You can find them all on Google. I would also recommend pprune as you can read and "talk" to may of these pilots already working at foriegn carriers.
As for pay being as "good" as US companies? That made me smile !!! I rcently had 2 interviews with US companies and turned them down flat. Why? Because I would have had to take an IMMEDIATE 50% (or more) paycut for the privilege of flying the SAME aircraft in the SAME seat but spend more time at home. Enough said...........

 

[mobie]

Watch What You Wish For

I hope we (here in the US) do not open the door for all other pilots to have the "right" to fly here for any job opening as some think we should be able to world wide.

I have worked overseas, but only when there were no local pilots the job at that time.

What you think if we would open a direct entry Capt. slot here to a typed B777 DAL seat that came open?

Sorry it works both ways.

Mobie

 

[Golden Falcon]

Suppose if there were no "local" pilots available then it might happen...not too likely...never has been said on this forum anybody thinks they have a right to work overseas...I sure don't have a right to be here, I am a guest and will leave when my services are no longer needed....

 

[mobie]

You missed my point, what I was trying to say was not to let anyone open the seat to just the lowest bidder.
​

 

[kingsize]

In answer to your question:
Yes, there are jobs out there. Indeed, far more than there are in the US and generally speaking, you don't need "buddies" to bat for you and there is less ************************* footing around. They either want you or they don't. No need to wait years for a response or play silly, time-wasting games. That's why there are many American pilots (furloughed or otherwise) working overseas.
I would suggest you do a search on aviation websites, either the airline of interest or the usual agencies: parc, direct, rishworth, wynnwith. You can find them all on Google. I would also recommend pprune as you can read and "talk" to may of these pilots already working at foriegn carriers.
As for pay being as "good" as US companies? That made me smile !!! I rcently had 2 interviews with US companies and turned them down flat. Why? Because I would have had to take an IMMEDIATE 50% (or more) paycut for the privilege of flying the SAME aircraft in the SAME seat but spend more time at home. Enough said...........

b757driver, thanks for the good reply! I was waiting for someone to actually give a useful answer lol
So I'm tracking that there are many more overseas flying opportunities than in the US, and that they generally pay significantly more. Sounds like a good deal to me. I looked at some of those foreign airlines...i forget which ones, but the requirements for application were pretty steep, like 5000 hours.

Here's a followup question. I have a few years before I'll even be free to fly for the airlines. With all the growth in China, what advantages would I have if I learned Chinese? Would an international company like Fedex pay a premium for an american pilot who speaks Chinese and is willing to be based in China?

 

[Golden Falcon]

Think FEDEX uses locally based operators for Chinese operations within China, but China Airlines is open to expats...as are many asian carriers...try singapore, Cathay Pacific, Emirates, Gulf Air...all require heavy jet time, and most substantial time on type, or similar type...and trust me mobie, while we're not sky-kings on astronomical salaries...we are here on the going rate, not cheap replacements expats are overseas to fill the gaps created by not enough local pilots..period we would not be here if there were no shortage trust me...and there is no such shortage in the USA, so I wouldnt worry about it, at least not in the jet airline level

 

[typhoonpilot]

Here's a followup question. I have a few years before I'll even be free to fly for the airlines. With all the growth in China, what advantages would I have if I learned Chinese? Would an international company like Fedex pay a premium for an american pilot who speaks Chinese and is willing to be based in China?

Not likely, the language for aviation is English. A pilot doesn't need to know the language of a local airline, unless of course it's a French speaking airline uke: .

I speak pretty decent Mandarin and even I have a hard time understanding the controllers in mainland China when they are speaking to the local boys. You'd have to be pretty fluent for it to make any difference it regards to flying, and to what end ? About the only benefit you would have for being fluent in Mandarin would be for ground based jobs where you have to interact with the locals on a daily basis. Language skills in and of themselves would not be enough, you would have to fully understand the culture there for it to really make a difference.

I wouldn't say that overseas flying jobs pay more than the better jobs in one's home country. They may be about equal, but in general are lower than the carriers like Fedex, UPS, SWA, etc. The advantage is in a tax free compensation and housing allowances which allow you to save most of your salary.

In my present job I make the U.S. equivalent of the now, much lower, legacy widebody rates. I do not even come close to Fedex rates though.

Overseas carriers and contract work are really better for those of us furloughed from majors or who have had a rocky career. I wouldn't encourage a 25 year old to pursue a job overseas. When you are 35+ and stuck in a dead end position is when it starts to make more sense. We have a lot of guys in their 40s joining my company as F.O.s because they have the potential here to reach their career goals. Something that is not possible in their home country.

TP

 

[FL420]

Overseas carriers and contract work are really better for those of us furloughed from majors or who have had a rocky career. I wouldn't encourage a 25 year old to pursue a job overseas. When you are 35+ and stuck in a dead end position is when it starts to make more sense. We have a lot of guys in their 40s joining my company as F.O.s because they have the potential here to reach their career goals. Something that is not possible in their home country.
TP

Do you or any of the other valuable contributors to this thread have any info on overseas carriers who hire those of us unfortunate enough to have had a rocky career and then run afoul of the Smith/Quesada Age 60 rule?

 

[Say Again Over]

kingsize, Nowadays the controllers speak pretty good English in China, on the subject of total time, I don't think it's too bad at CX, someone in our forum got hired on the whale with less than 3000 hours, ex USN fighter pilot.

typhoonpilot, thanks for bringing up th point about Airbus systems knowledge and common sense (or lack thereof).

When speaking in generalizations, as we are, there will always be examples to argue the other side, but in general Americans are better at hand flying and Euros/Aussies have better knowledge.
by Typhoon

IMO your statement is total crap, I spent three good years working and training with the Brits, that's great that they have a harder exams, so what, pilots in the states have something they usually don't have, that's at least 1500 hours experience! Enough of that lame debate, my British counter parts were excellent pilots, hand flying and otherwise, I saw no difference in flying capabilities compared to us Yanks. By the way, when the Brits conduct an LPC / OPC, most of it is with the automatics off, not like a check ride in the USA, lol.

 

[QueensPilot]

What about Air Atlanta Icelandic? I've heard that they hire Americans, and could be some interesting flying.