US Airways Jul 16 recall class

[FurloughedAgain]

Actually i'm trying to rationalize staying here because it is clearly better for my family, when what I truly want if I were self-centered, and cared nothing about my family would be to go back there and fly 4-day trips.

Going from 121 to corporate is hard. Airline folks are not terribly popular in the eyes of corporate chief pilots.

Going from 121 to corporate twice if I were furloughed by USAir again, is probably not possible.
(speaking of Fortune 500 corporate, not charter)

Thanks for your advice everyone. I'll continue to participate on the thread and let you know what we decide.

 

[Boeing747Driver]

Actually i'm trying to rationalize staying here because it is clearly better for my family, when what I truly want if I were self-centered, and cared nothing about my family would be to go back there and fly 4-day trips.

Going from 121 to corporate is hard. Airline folks are not terribly popular in the eyes of corporate chief pilots.

Going from 121 to corporate twice if I were furloughed by USAir again, is probably not possible.
(speaking of Fortune 500 corporate, not charter)

Thanks for your advice everyone. I'll continue to participate on the thread and let you know what we decide.

Mike it is a tough decision. If I could get a job flying a piper tomahawk that paid $100,000 a year I would quit.
Just keep in mind this is not the USAIR we worked for before. The reserve system on the east stinks. You must touch holiday and weekend trips now with the bid sheet. Medical coverage is lacking. Pay stinks and you don't get those high quality crew meals on the East.

Moral is low and employees are pissed.

Now for the bright side. The place is making money. If we can get past the seniority issue we have a chance to gain in the compensation area. I have zero doubt that a new merger is in the works. So this could end up being something bigger and better or just a bigger mess.

If your heart is truly with USAIR go for it.

Jeff Z

 

[FurloughedAgain]

Thanks Jeff. I'm 90% sure i'm going to stay where i'm at -- just want to make sure I look at it from all of the angles.

 

[Boeing747Driver]

Thanks Jeff. I'm 90% sure i'm going to stay where i'm at -- just want to make sure I look at it from all of the angles.

It s a tough call, but it is ultimately up to you.

I will miss seeing you stir the pot at union meetings if you don't return. LOL

I am not taking my East recall due to the fact I am currently a rookie, backpack, inexperienced pilot on the West side.

 

[FurloughedAgain]

Even if i'm gone, Courtney B. will be back after his hold at PSA is up. I trust Courtney to be at EVERY union meeting trying to wade through the muck and make sure the junior folks don't get screwed.

Thanks for the kind words though

 

[Boeing747Driver]

Even if i'm gone, Courtney B. will be back after his hold at PSA is up. I trust Courtney to be at EVERY union meeting trying to wade through the muck and make sure the junior folks don't get screwed.

Thanks for the kind words though

When is his hold up at PSA?

 

[FurloughedAgain]

I haven't talked to him in a few weeks, but I think he told me November. I don't honestly remember.

 

[Swaayze]

Actually i'm trying to rationalize staying here because it is clearly better for my family, when what I truly want if I were self-centered, and cared nothing about my family would be to go back there and fly 4-day trips.

Going from 121 to corporate is hard. Airline folks are not terribly popular in the eyes of corporate chief pilots.

Going from 121 to corporate twice if I were furloughed by USAir again, is probably not possible.
(speaking of Fortune 500 corporate, not charter)

Thanks for your advice everyone. I'll continue to participate on the thread and let you know what we decide.

I gotta admit I've been expecting that you will go back, even if it's questionable intellectually, because your heart is clearly there. The mind can often only rationalize away some of what the heart feels.

I do think you're right on wrt the corporate opportunities. Whoever said there's always a corporate job looking for an airline pilot is way off base if my corporate search is any indication. I'm sure you probably could find something again, but probably not nearly as stable and family friendly as what you have now.


Good luck!

 

[Swaayze]

I am really having a hard time figuring out how you think retiring from a career flying a 17,000 lb Lear around for a living can be construed as a failure. PHXFLYR

I know exactly what he means, though I'm not quite as inflicted with the BJS (Big Jet Syndrome) as he seems to be. I have no problem flying a RJ, or a PC12 for that matter, but I'm tired of not commanding a decent wage and it feels a lot like failure.

I think the problem is that we all started our careers with intensity and sacrificed a lot, we have been extremely driven, to achieve a particular dream. It's not in our nature to just let it drop easily, and right or wrong there are definitely many second guessings and feelings of failure on at least some level. For me personally, not going back would mean throwing in the towel on not only being a major airline pilot (which really isn't that important to me now), but moreso on sticking with it and not letting this beat me. If I don't go back to LCC I probably won't progress anywhere else (as I have limited my options severely in order to do what's best for my family) so it becomes a bit of an unwelcome acquiescence. Additionally, it would mean accepting that we will probably always struggle with money (I'm just not "that guy" who can get into other ventures/jobs/networks and rebound effortlessly), which in turn means I give up many other significant dreams for my family as well. It's kind of a snowball effect in my mind. So even though we know that we're not losers for doing the overall best thing for our families, it sure feels like abandonment and failure at a deep level stemming back to the days when the world was our oyster and we would not be denied.


Sorry for the melodrama; it helps to vent .

 

[reepicheep]

I do think you're right on wrt the corporate opportunities. Whoever said there's always a corporate job looking for an airline pilot is way off base if my corporate search is any indication.
Good luck!

Absent a rock-solid inside connection, my experience has been that you have a better chance of flying the space shuttle. Unlike what I read elsewhere on this board, there are not "always lear jobs out there" - rather "Please note in the body of your email the date of your last Lear PC" is the order of the day. A320/737 pilots need not apply.

 

[FurloughedAgain]

Agreed, with a little luck you might find a job flying charter in a light jet -- but anybody who has spent a little time sitting around the FBO lobbies at Signature or Atlantic will tell you that "corporate", "charter", and "fractional" are 3 very different animals despite the fact that they may all fly the same type equipment.

There may always be a Lear job out there but the quality of that job may be in question.

Swaayze: If we both end up giving up our numbers why don't you and the wife come up here and stay with us for the weekend? Let us show you around. Maybe we can change your mind on this place?

It's only a 5 hour drive from Dallas, quick upgrade, decent pay, home every night... You know you're tempted...

 

[PHXFLYR]

I know exactly what he means, though I'm not quite as inflicted with the BJS (Big Jet Syndrome) as he seems to be. I have no problem flying a RJ, or a PC12 for that matter, but I'm tired of not commanding a decent wage and it feels a lot like failure.

I think the problem is that we all started our careers with intensity and sacrificed a lot, we have been extremely driven, to achieve a particular dream. It's not in our nature to just let it drop easily, and right or wrong there are definitely many second guessings and feelings of failure on at least some level. For me personally, not going back would mean throwing in the towel on not only being a major airline pilot (which really isn't that important to me now), but moreso on sticking with it and not letting this beat me. If I don't go back to LCC I probably won't progress anywhere else (as I have limited my options severely in order to do what's best for my family) so it becomes a bit of an unwelcome acquiescence. Additionally, it would mean accepting that we will probably always struggle with money (I'm just not "that guy" who can get into other ventures/jobs/networks and rebound effortlessly), which in turn means I give up many other significant dreams for my family as well. It's kind of a snowball effect in my mind. So even though we know that we're not losers for doing the overall best thing for our families, it sure feels like abandonment and failure at a deep level stemming back to the days when the world was our oyster and we would not be denied.


Sorry for the melodrama; it helps to vent .

No problem.... glad to lend an ear. You guys are kinda going through what I did 10 years ago. Unfortunatly, I made the wrong call, put flying before family and have been living with the consequences of my actions since. We're still together but my choice has really put a strain on family life and there is nothing that can make up for that.Not money,not big jets. Nothing. Whats more,today's exactly 10 years to the day that I gave up my DASH 8 Capt seat right there in town for what I thought were greener pastures. And if you think there isn't a day that I wish I could turn back the clock,well guess again. The grass really isn't any greener on the other side. Especially in todays airline enviroment. Anyway,here's hoping that you guys make the decesion that's right for you and your family without making the same mistakes that I made along the way. And if you do finish your career flying a 17,000 lb Lear or Embraer around for a living (no shame in that,by the way) just remember what we used to tell our old girlfriends in High School..."size don't matterl" Good luck!!

PHXFLYR

 

[Swaayze]

Thanks PHXFLYR, that actually helps. I think we know what we SHOULD do, it's just doing it that's hard. Any outside confirmation of our thoughts helps (me, at least).

I sincerely hope your family comes through this business happy and healthy!

 

[Swaayze]

Swaayze: If we both end up giving up our numbers why don't you and the wife come up here and stay with us for the weekend? Let us show you around. Maybe we can change your mind on this place?

It's only a 5 hour drive from Dallas, quick upgrade, decent pay, home every night... You know you're tempted...

Ahem, well, yes I'm tempted (but I'd have to fly a brand new jet, can't be wearing someone else's thong!), but I just don't see it happenin'. Perhaps we will stop by and bring you that bottle of JD (hopefully you'll share just one shot, or maybe a few if we're mixing Lynchburgs). I have no doubt that the area is nice, I did grow up nearby in the big city west of the state line, but the wife's family lives just around the corner so I don't think we're going anywhere too soon (Believe it or not it is a good arrangement. I actually get along with them quite well and they try to be scarce when I'm home.).

 

[FurloughedAgain]

I understand. You're welcome any time!

 

[flynAAvy]

I'd roll the dice and go back. If you have a Lear rating you can probably find a job anywhere if it doesn't work out. I wish I had a small jet type... nobody is looking for a dude with a 707 type now! We're (meaning the airline, of course) making big money and are hopefully growing. Come back and then jump ship if you have to. I, personally, like being on the people side of the airport, or I would have jumped to FedEx five years ago. My buddies there are making double what I make and I fly at night anyway! Again, I am the first to admit my idiocity. I still like our mom and pop airline though. We have a very good business model, in my humble opinion.

I hope to fly with an east metal Captain someday and put all of this behind us (drink a beer at Spondivits in Atlanta or Club 205 in Portland!). We will make it happen. If AA/TWA can do it, we can absolutely do it. Maybe even better.

Let's pony up boys and girls. We're the backbone of this operation and we can make it work, both east and west. Afterall, we're just dumb pilots.

Cheers. Fly safe.

 

[typhoonpilot]

Without the pension there is no point in going back unless it's a better job than you have right now. Don't go back with expectations of what might be in the future. A decision to go back should only be based on which path is better based on the situation at present.

A good saying applies here: Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.


Typhoonpilot

2 time furloughee that isn't going back.

 

[jmreii]

Really nothing has changed here except attitudes.

We all still bid in the same slots, we're finally running an upgrade class, we all still get paid the same as we did before.

It's easy to be down right now because of the way the East is handling the merger, but with all that said, THIS PLACE IS NOT EVEN CLOSE TO BEING MESA.

You guys and gals will always be America West(Cactus) to me. Life is a journey, enjoy the ride.

 

[PHXFLYR]

Thanks PHXFLYR, that actually helps. I think we know what we SHOULD do, it's just doing it that's hard. Any outside confirmation of our thoughts helps (me, at least).

I sincerely hope your family comes through this business happy and healthy!

Thanks,Swaayze..appreciate it. Same to your family,too!!

PHXFLYR

 

[get2flyin]

This isn't intended as flamebait, I promise. I am a little curious however...I think the West side thinks a lot of the East side guys are dead set on burning the house down right now. I want to believe that it isn't but, is that really the case? If it is and you're surrounded by guys who want to hate their job, won't USAir be a pretty crappy place to work?

Best of luck to all of you, East and West...

 

[Swaayze]

get2flyin,

Not being there I don't know really, but it sure sounds like things at East are pretty negative. Yes, it would be a crappy situation, and is one of the contributing factors in making my decision.