US Airways Calls

[wanabe_fo]

Just curious if the guy that interviewed with you was from a wholly owned. Thanks

Yes he was

 

[greed]

So bummed out, just got the call! offered an interview but I will be out of the US (current position is on a rotation as an EXPAT) on the only date that is currently available.

Talk about timing, I wish I could just call in sick and go, but not possible from where I am. I was told that my current application status will remain the same and I will get another call later in the summer.

Hopefully someone else will get the good call.

FWIW- I don't have any internal rec's and never worked for a fully owned. I applied during the first and second postings and not the last one.

Blue skies!

 

[acaTerry]

So is it still about $36,000 a year for new hires?

 

[CFIfornow]

So is it still about $36,000 a year for new hires?

Yup, $36,000 ($3000/month salary) on anything other than the E190. E190 is $38,300 ($42.05/hour * 76 hours short call guarantee * 12 months.) First year pay is going down around September when American comes out of bankruptcy. New first year pay on all equipment will be $35,000 ($40.00/hour * 73 hours reserve guarantee *12 months.) This will be the same for those who end up getting hired at American too.

 

[greyskyracer]

I know the MOU is a good thing overall, but it's still a bit of a bummer to reduce firt year pay even more.

 

[johnnyb]

being a Captain in15 months will ease the pain?

 

[acaTerry]

being a Captain in15 months will ease the pain?

Free advice for those about to bite: Never count on projected upgrade time when planning your future.

That $35,000 is enough to keep me away. That is yesteryear's mentality. A major airline is no place to be working for those wages. They were invented when new hire pilots were wet behind the ears. These days with all the stagnation, (and this will sound out of character for me to say) there are not many pilots who have not paid their dues. Sitting right seat at a commuter for what, 7 years, is not enough? Even in the "old days" commuter upgrades happened fast. The kids today have paid for the most part.

 

[Smoke Toliet]

Is there any word on August class dates?

 

[LittleDeuce]

Class Dates

Is there any word on August class dates?

Membership Services just put out an e-mail 10 minutes ago- 2 classes a month until November and 1 in December...

 

[LittleDeuce]

Free advice for those about to bite: Never count on projected upgrade time when planning your future.

That $35,000 is enough to keep me away. That is yesteryear's mentality. A major airline is no place to be working for those wages. They were invented when new hire pilots were wet behind the ears. These days with all the stagnation, (and this will sound out of character for me to say) there are not many pilots who have not paid their dues. Sitting right seat at a commuter for what, 7 years, is not enough? Even in the "old days" commuter upgrades happened fast. The kids today have paid for the most part.

acaTerry,

Feel free to stay away with that attitude. I just flew with a guy that was hired in Feb. 2012. He starts upgrade training on the E190 soon.

So he will be a captain with American Airlines this fall.

Could the new hire pay be better? Of course. That's what I made in 1999. Look at the big picture Bubba...

The upgrade time at US Airways is LITERALLY shorter than most Regionals.

 

[acaTerry]

acaTerry,

Feel free to stay away with that attitude. I just flew with a guy that was hired in Feb. 2012. He starts upgrade training on the E190 soon.

So he will be a captain with American Airlines this fall.

Could the new hire pay be better? Of course. That's what I made in 1999. Look at the big picture Bubba...

The upgrade time at US Airways is LITERALLY shorter than most Regionals.

I understand what you are saying, but to gamble so big on what MAY happen is financial suicide. Aviation being what it is, the smart man plans on the worst case, and plots his career according to how deep a pit he can emerge from.
When I was hired at Trash States, the upgrade was about a month. It never happened. When I got hired at NJA, it was a matter of weeks, and yet here I am in my 9th year as an FO. I can see the FOs at AA taking the E190 PIC spots in droves with the merger (the details are not cast in iron just yet) and all those hopeful FOs who are hired now getting stuck in pay that is just plain insulting to any major airline pilot while Doug continues to add airlines to a list of pilot groups that will NEVER have a contract completed.
All I am saying is that to go to US Airways thinking "Oh it's only $35,000 for a year and I will then be a captain so I'll gamble my life on it" is a fool's roll.
I wish I were in a position to take that chance, but I'm not, so it's not worth the risk to me. I'd advise the same caution to anyone else.

 

[zymotic]

I understand what you are saying, but to gamble so big on what MAY happen is financial suicide. Aviation being what it is, the smart man plans on the worst case, and plots his career according to how deep a pit he can emerge from.
When I was hired at Trash States, the upgrade was about a month. It never happened. When I got hired at NJA, it was a matter of weeks, and yet here I am in my 9th year as an FO. I can see the FOs at AA taking the E190 PIC spots in droves with the merger (the details are not cast in iron just yet) and all those hopeful FOs who are hired now getting stuck in pay that is just plain insulting to any major airline pilot while Doug continues to add airlines to a list of pilot groups that will NEVER have a contract completed.
All I am saying is that to go to US Airways thinking "Oh it's only $35,000 for a year and I will then be a captain so I'll gamble my life on it" is a fool's roll.
I wish I were in a position to take that chance, but I'm not, so it's not worth the risk to me. I'd advise the same caution to anyone else.

I must make a few points:

190 Captain pay is essentially the same as narrow body F/O pay. This is the main reason for "quick upgrades". In reality, there are no quick upgrades here as of right now. However, none are necessarily needed due to the new pay rates. See next point:

The new pay rates are head and shoulders above the current East rates (as an F/O I will get a 26/hr raise at the merger date) but still lagging Delta and UA. Jan 1st, 2016, the rates are the average of Delta and UA.

US Airways will soon pay the same as UA and DL. One has to ask themselves should they turn down a job at the majors if they want to work there just because of the first year pay. As for completing a contract, these payrates are already set in a written agreement. Joint contract negotiations are forthcoming and foot dragging by any party will not be allowed. A timeline has been agreed upon in writing and any open items at the end of the timeline must go to an arbitrator.

In my opinion, staying at a regional is considerably more risky as a long term career choice vs. coming to a major. (I think you work at netjets so that's a different story).

 

[weasel_lips]

I understand what you are saying, but to gamble so big on what MAY happen is financial suicide. Aviation being what it is, the smart man plans on the worst case, and plots his career according to how deep a pit he can emerge from./QUOTE]

Yes, play it safe and stay where you are! Nothing like the "job security" at a regional or a fractional. NOT

Its an interesting phenomena that those that make posts about not taking a job at a major do not even work for a major.....

Those that get on now or in the near future at the new American are going to have an awesome career. New airplanes, new pilot contract, massive and I mean massive retirements.

 

[acaTerry]

I understand what you are saying, but to gamble so big on what MAY happen is financial suicide. Aviation being what it is, the smart man plans on the worst case, and plots his career according to how deep a pit he can emerge from./QUOTE]

Yes, play it safe and stay where you are! Nothing like the "job security" at a regional or a fractional. NOT

No argument there, not exactly in the best career for long term, but NJA is like gold handcuffs. So it comes down to $104,000 in the hand is better than $35,000 and hope in the bush.
If I was a gambling man (and depending on the next contract I might become one), I'm gambling on DAL and UAL. Or maybe I'm missing something....I'm going by what's on airlinepilotcentral.

 

[pave driver]

I understand what you are saying, but to gamble so big on what MAY happen is financial suicide. Aviation being what it is, the smart man plans on the worst case, and plots his career according to how deep a pit he can emerge from.
When I was hired at Trash States, the upgrade was about a month. It never happened. When I got hired at NJA, it was a matter of weeks, and yet here I am in my 9th year as an FO. I can see the FOs at AA taking the E190 PIC spots in droves with the merger (the details are not cast in iron just yet) and all those hopeful FOs who are hired now getting stuck in pay that is just plain insulting to any major airline pilot while Doug continues to add airlines to a list of pilot groups that will NEVER have a contract completed.
All I am saying is that to go to US Airways thinking "Oh it's only $35,000 for a year and I will then be a captain so I'll gamble my life on it" is a fool's roll.
I wish I were in a position to take that chance, but I'm not, so it's not worth the risk to me. I'd advise the same caution to anyone else.

Everything you wrote here is incorrect information regarding US Airways/ American. To all that read the above post, please disregard it in it's entirety.

 

[zymotic]

No argument there, not exactly in the best career for long term, but NJA is like gold handcuffs. So it comes down to $104,000 in the hand is better than $35,000 and hope in the bush.
If I was a gambling man (and depending on the next contract I might become one), I'm gambling on DAL and UAL. Or maybe I'm missing something....I'm going by what's on airlinepilotcentral.

Yes you are missing something; starting with the fact that you would make a career decision based on first year pay.

 

[CapnVegetto]

this is correct. I'm 3rd year at JetBlue. If USAir calls me, I will be there faster than you can blink.

1st year pay.....who gives a crap??? suck it up and deal with it. it's part of the game. 104K a year? You'll be back to that in 3-4 years at the most, so who cares? yank gear for the next 30 years and you'll still do better than 104K a year. But you HAVE to look at the big picture.

Get on the bottom of that list of OLLLLLLLD FARTS (meant affectionately). You will move up FAST. Merger with American? Great. More old farts. More movement, more base choices. Who cares if you are at the bottom? Few years, move up a few thousand numbers. If you are even remotely young, getting hired there right now mathematically will make you REALLY senior for a REALLY long time.

Of course, you have to just make a guess. Another 9/11, whatever, and you're screwed. So what? Deal with it then. The rest of us did. You already got screwed by the last 9/11, and guess what, you're still here, bitching on a message board.

There's nothing you can do but make a guess, flip a coin, rock paper scissors lizard spock, whatever. Base your guess on the available information. Right now the available information is: list of old farts + pilot shortage = good to go there. It's that simple. My money is on going to US Air, or any legacy for that matter. If I can just get one of 'em to call me......

 

[acaTerry]

Everything you wrote here is incorrect information regarding US Airways/ American. To all that read the above post, please disregard it in it's entirety.

Like I said (later---probably should have said so earlier) I am going by what is on airlinepilotcentral.
First year pay would not be a big deal, IF second year FO pay was in the 90's or darn close to it.
I have no beef with US Air or any of its pilot groups. Just saying that anyone jumping in feet first with the sole reason being TODAY'S upgrade time may be in for a big disappointment.
If I saw a much higher second year pay than I see on airlinepilotcentral, heck I'd be applying too. But after seeing so many things go "the other way" in this industry, I'm a little more (perhaps too much) cautious. Don't take my lack of enthusiasm about the upgrade time of TODAY as a sign of disdain toward US Airways....I'd be applying there too if I had a better war chest saved up.

 

[acaTerry]

You already got screwed by the last 9/11, and guess what, you're still here, bitching on a message board.

If I were to hit the Powerball this week, I'd still come in here. It's fun and its addictive.

If I can just get one of 'em to call me.....

If you're in the neighborhood, just hang out at PHX or CLT. I've talked to a lot of these guys and you'd be surprised how many just come up and offer to bring in your stuff after talking to you a while. Even since my commuting days of the mid 90's....I've never seen a more agreeable bunch of pilots as they have.

Answers above in red.

 

[vetrider]

I'm reminded of cousin Eddie's six years unemployed relative, 'holdin out for a management position.'

 

[acaTerry]

Cousin Eddie is AWESOME.

 

[zymotic]

Like I said (later---probably should have said so earlier) I am going by what is on airlinepilotcentral.
First year pay would not be a big deal, IF second year FO pay was in the 90's or darn close to it.
I have no beef with US Air or any of its pilot groups. Just saying that anyone jumping in feet first with the sole reason being TODAY'S upgrade time may be in for a big disappointment.
If I saw a much higher second year pay than I see on airlinepilotcentral, heck I'd be applying too. But after seeing so many things go "the other way" in this industry, I'm a little more (perhaps too much) cautious. Don't take my lack of enthusiasm about the upgrade time of TODAY as a sign of disdain toward US Airways....I'd be applying there too if I had a better war chest saved up.

Second year pay in January will 83/hr and in 2016 99/hr. Third year pay in 2016 120/hr.

Again, today's upgrade time is very long. 190 CA pays the same as bus fo so these 2 year guys are not making any additional money.

 

[acaTerry]

Second year pay in January will 83/hr and in 2016 99/hr. Third year pay in 2016 120/hr.

Again, today's upgrade time is very long. 190 CA pays the same as bus fo so these 2 year guys are not making any additional money.

That sounds more respectable...in that case I say go for it. I have been out of the airlines so long that all the info I get is airlinepilotcentral.

 

[ALGFLYR]

I don't think the numbers are as far apart as you may think. I think the following is what a new-hire can expect if hired right now:

The seat-lock for the 190 is 12 months. It's reasonable to expect being a group 2 F/O the second year. Let's assume an upgrade on the 190 doesn't happen (Note: The 190 CA does pay group 2 F/O rates at top of scale, but around the 2-5 years the 190 CA pays $10-15 more than group 2 F/O).

1st year pay: $40.00/hr.
2nd year pay: $83.76/hr.
3rd year pay: $104.36/hr.
4th year pay: $124.57/hr.

I don't think it unreasonable to expect to be able to hold group 3 or 4 F/O around 5 years which is close to $170.00/hr...

I think the low 1st year pay is greatly outweighed by the future earning potential. And I suspect around the 5 year mark, the pay will be basically the same as Delta and United. I think it's more reasonable to base a decision on QOL issues. How long will reserve last? Where will you be based? etc...

 

[Data]

Like I said (later---probably should have said so earlier) I am going by what is on airlinepilotcentral.
First year pay would not be a big deal, IF second year FO pay was in the 90's or darn close to it.
I have no beef with US Air or any of its pilot groups. Just saying that anyone jumping in feet first with the sole reason being TODAY'S upgrade time may be in for a big disappointment.
If I saw a much higher second year pay than I see on airlinepilotcentral, heck I'd be applying too. But after seeing so many things go "the other way" in this industry, I'm a little more (perhaps too much) cautious. Don't take my lack of enthusiasm about the upgrade time of TODAY as a sign of disdain toward US Airways....I'd be applying there too if I had a better war chest saved up.

Your advice is terrible. Aside from the basic premise that you take the first one that calls, the rates on APC don't factor in the increases, they're posting the rates based on this year's snapshot of the MOU. The rates increase each year until 2016.

Here's what you should be looking at...

Anybody hired since January will make, as a narrowbody FO, the following rates after the sacrifice of year one...
Year 2 - $83.76 and 16% in to the 401k
Year 3 - $104.36 and 16%
Year 4 - $124.57 and 16%
Year 5 - $127.65 and 16% and a Parity Review.

Who cares about upgrade, that'll come soon enough. Telling someone to stay at a regional or fractional until Delta or UAL calls is bad advice. Even under the current rates, Airways is a better option than any regional out there. Will Delta be the best in 3 decades? Who knows. Will American be the top in 3 decades? Who knows. They might not even be around. But to skip going to one place because of a $20/hr difference in first year pay while completely ignoring the number of retirements, movement, base options, and the hope that Delta will call is idiotic.

[Edit]Looks like I'm the 4th to post what the rates will be, sorry for the duplicate info...

 

[PGTB]

Why is anyone trying to convince anyone to go anywhere. If you don't want to go, don't.

 

[zymotic]

Why is anyone trying to convince anyone to go anywhere. If you don't want to go, don't.

I think some of us are just trying to counter some misinformation. I, for one, am not trying to convince anyone to come here. However, for those that are considering it, I'd like to see them have the facts.

Additionally, I think many of us have been at the top end of a regional seniority list and I think most of us would agree it was worth giving that up to come here.

 

[Jackie Moon]

I think some of us are just trying to counter some misinformation. I, for one, am not trying to convince anyone to come here. However, for those that are considering it, I'd like to see them have the facts.

Additionally, I think many of us have been at the top end of a regional seniority list and I think most of us would agree it was worth giving that up to come here.

Like I've said before I wouldn't go back to asa if they let me be the number 1 pilot at the top of the pay scale.

 

[acaTerry]

Your advice is terrible. Aside from the basic premise that you take the first one that calls, the rates on APC don't factor in the increases, they're posting the rates based on this year's snapshot of the MOU. The rates increase each year until 2016.

Here's what you should be looking at...

Anybody hired since January will make, as a narrowbody FO, the following rates after the sacrifice of year one...
Year 2 - $83.76 and 16% in to the 401k
Year 3 - $104.36 and 16%
Year 4 - $124.57 and 16%
Year 5 - $127.65 and 16% and a Parity Review.

Who cares about upgrade, that'll come soon enough. Telling someone to stay at a regional or fractional until Delta or UAL calls is bad advice. Even under the current rates, Airways is a better option than any regional out there. Will Delta be the best in 3 decades? Who knows. Will American be the top in 3 decades? Who knows. They might not even be around. But to skip going to one place because of a $20/hr difference in first year pay while completely ignoring the number of retirements, movement, base options, and the hope that Delta will call is idiotic.

[Edit]Looks like I'm the 4th to post what the rates will be, sorry for the duplicate info...

Remember I said I was going by ALPC. I was unaware of the seat lock only being 12 months, much less of therapid movement to other fleets. I was looking at yr 5 in the 190 at $^&...less than the guys are making at some of the regionals right now.
But I had bad info so it's a non issue now...read the last post I put up, where I stood corrected and said go for it. Finish the thread before posting.

 

[Flybywire44]

Remember I said I was going by ALPC. I was unaware of the seat lock only being 12 months, much less of therapid movement to other fleets. I was looking at yr 5 in the 190 at $^&...less than the guys are making at some of the regionals right now.
But I had bad info so it's a non issue now...read the last post I put up, where I stood corrected and said go for it. Finish the thread before posting.

Airbus Upgrade is projected at 5-6 years.