US 3000 rumour

[kwick]

USA 3000 to fly Spirit routes?

Is USA 3000 taking delivery of
A320s to fly routes for Spirit?

If Spirit strikes, would USA 3000
pilots cross the picket lines to
fly Spirit routes?

 

[8vATE]

Don't think you need to worry about this "rumor".

USA 3000 Pilots are Teamsters and I seriously doubt they would cross a picket line.
Their fleet is shrinking... Morale is in the toilet... Wonderboy CEO Steve Harfst is doing his best to beat down the pilot group and torpedo the airline.

 

[GuinessGuy]

being a Teamster at USA3000 means absolutely nothing with regards to crossing or not crossing a picket line. I've seen my share of card carrying ALPA guys cross the line........Teamster pilots are no different.
Just ask a few of the guys that are at the top of the list at AirTran.......The funny thing is, it worked out well for them.....They crossed an ALPA line several years ago....now in the top 3% of a different ALPA carrier.
Picket lines will always be crossed..................

 

[macdu]

Would some of them? Absolutely! Most of who is left are the "independents", those who either have no allegiance to any U.S. airline or the U.S. itself, if you catch my meaning. The item of note is after April there will be only about 50 of them left. That can't be too big of a threat. I would say for those who are riding the gravy train there, that the track is about to run out.

 

[ttuite]

Would some of them? Absolutely! Most of who is left are the "independents", those who either have no allegiance to any U.S. airline or the U.S. itself, if you catch my meaning. The item of note is after April there will be only about 50 of them left. That can't be too big of a threat. I would say for those who are riding the gravy train there, that the track is about to run out.

Unfortunately, you are probably right. This was one of the best airlines that I have worked at. Great airplanes, well maintained, flight attendants were very cool and the passengers were in a great mood most of the time. Sad to see it go.......

 

[Intruder One]

I wouldn't worry to much about them.I believe they are down to 4 or 5 A/C and they are closing Ft. Myers the end of March which was one one their bigger bases.

Stick a fork in them they are done.

 

[NEDude]

Here is one furloughed U3K guy who would not take a recall to fly struck work.

One question though - if this is Apple Vacations contract flying that Spirit is doing, and U3K is owned by Apple, and we were furloughed due to Apple outsourcing our flying to other carriers, if Apple brings the flying back in house to where it belongs, where do we stand? Flying struck work, or U3K pilots getting back flying that belongs to them as Apple Vacations employees that was outsourced?

I think it is a legit question. If a major airline furloughs pilots and outsources routes to a regional, if that regional then strikes and the major wants to bring back the furloughed guys to fly mainline equipment back on their original routes, who is right in that situation?

Just for clarification though, I do not think this is going to happen, and I am employed at another carrier. Just curious for discussions sake.

 

[Mike man]

We don't do Apple Vacation contract flying as far as I know.

 

[need2fly]

We don't do Apple Vacation contract flying as far as I know.

Yes you do. DTW-CUN every week has a block of seats that Apple has bought.

 

[Mike man]

News to me...a seasonal DTW-CUN flight with a handful of seats, got it.

 

[Beetle007]

I think it is a legit question. If a major airline furloughs pilots and outsources routes to a regional, if that regional then strikes and the major wants to bring back the furloughed guys to fly mainline equipment back on their original routes, who is right in that situation?

When Comair went on strike, Delta refused to allow Delta aircraft to fly the Comair routes. If 3 757s and 2 CRJs flew a route....then when Comair went on strike ONLY 3 757s (or smaller Delta aircraft) were allowed to keep flying that route. In other words, Delta ALPA didn't allow their airline to increase frequency or size of aircraft to replace the comair flights. There were ALPA guys at the airport monitoring and telling Delta pilots which flights they were allowed to fly (or not fly)

 

[Beetle007]

Most good union airlines have it in their contract that they can't be forced to fly struck work or even stay at hotels with employees on strike. Even Republic pilots put this in their contract!

Spirit pilots didn't even bother putting this language in their contract so they don't have the right to get mad at another airline flying their routes.

 

[NEDude]

When Comair went on strike, Delta refused to allow Delta aircraft to fly the Comair routes. If 3 757s and 2 CRJs flew a route....then when Comair went on strike ONLY 3 757s (or smaller Delta aircraft) were allowed to keep flying that route. In other words, Delta ALPA didn't allow their airline to increase frequency or size of aircraft to replace the comair flights. There were ALPA guys at the airport monitoring and telling Delta pilots which flights they were allowed to fly (or not fly)

Ok, makes sense. But what if Delta had guys on the street at the time (they were hiring in spring of 01) and the flying had gone to Comair?

In other words, the higher paying job gets outsourced to a lower paid employees causing people to get laid off. Then the lower paid employees go on strike. If the company wants to bring back the original employees at their higher rate, are they then scabs?

BTW - not saying this is the case with Spirit and USA 3000. Just wondering what everyone thinks is acceptable.

I guess the analogy would be a unionized call center employee losing his job because it gets outsourced to India. Then the Indian call center employees go on strike and calling the original call center employees scabs if they take their jobs back.

 

[ttuite]

I think that NEDude has an interesting discussion. However the original question is moot. USA3000 would not be able to obtain aircraft, retrain crews and have them flying before the strike was over. I was told that the majority of Apple customers ride on other airlines. Apple uses USA3000 to negotiate lower ticket prices for transportation on the all inclusive vacation packages. If Spirit doesn't want to do the flying for Apple then I am sure that Delta, UsAirways, AirTran or someone else will pick up the tickets at a higher price than Spirit was charging.

 

[Beetle007]

Just wondering what everyone thinks is acceptable.

It wouldn't have mattered if Delta pilots were on furlough. They would never have accepted struck work because that is anti-union.

The goal of all pilots should be to increase industry standard wages. If management thinks they can just transfer flying when someone goes on strike....then it reduces a union's negotiation ability. It doesn't matter if the flying was contracted out or not....it is struck work!!

No union pilot should ever directly gain (or regain) a job as a result of another union going on strike. That is the bottom line.

 

[NEDude]

It wouldn't have mattered if Delta pilots were on furlough. They would never have accepted struck work because that is anti-union.

The goal of all pilots should be to increase industry standard wages. If management thinks they can just transfer flying when someone goes on strike....then it reduces a union's negotiation ability. It doesn't matter if the flying was contracted out or not....it is struck work!!

No union pilot should ever directly gain (or regain) a job as a result of another union going on strike. That is the bottom line.

How about this:

GoJets goes on strike (they are union) and Trans States sends out recall letters to all the furloughed pilots.

ttuite - I think you are correct, USA 3000 will never do that. Steve Harfst basically killed the airline, most likely at the direction of the Mullen family. Being used mostly, as you say, a bargaining chip when negotiating ticket prices with other carriers, and as a way to show losses on the books for tax purposes. Doubt it will grow above five airplanes ever again.

 

[rider850]

I only flew Apple Vacations at TWA. Once,we transitioned to AA,I flew the last Apple Vacation flight out of JFK. Early departure to Punta Cana. Full load of pax. They told us to leave them at the gate. We flew an empty plane down and picked up the pax from the previous week. That was the last of the contract. Next thing I know,I'm furloughed
and USA 3000 is doing Apple Vacations.

 

[smoknjoe]

USA3000 did that flying because they are owned by Apple.....They did not take AA flying when you were furloughed....

 

[rider850]

Did I say,take?

 

[ALPO]

No union pilot should ever directly gain (or regain) a job as a result of another union going on strike. That is the bottom line.

Have ya met the pilots of the US airline industry?