Unneeded pain and cost for Pinnacle Corp. Airlines

[Smarta$$]

You idiots will be the downfall of Pinnacle, as you were the downfall of Mesaba, MAIR, etc.

How? You don't know ONE DAMN THING about Mesaba's finances or it's trip through BK. The bankruptcy was INTENTIONALLY caused by NW and MAIR. Period. They were profitable and stable until NW filed BK and withheld payment. MAIR took their millions and hid it under the pillow. The pilots NEVER had anything to do with it.

And you wonder why this entire industry thinks Pinnacle pilots are a joke. Keep up the good work...

 

[gojo]

How? You don't know ONE DAMN THING about Mesaba's finances or it's trip through BK. The bankruptcy was INTENTIONALLY caused by NW and MAIR. Period. They were profitable and stable until NW filed BK and withheld payment. MAIR took their millions and hid it under the pillow. The pilots NEVER had anything to do with it.

And you wonder why this entire industry thinks Pinnacle pilots are a joke. Keep up the good work...

You need to learn to ignore flyprdu along with a couple of others on here. He's a juvenile idiot, and I don't believe they represent the entire Pinnacle pilot group. If I'm wrong, God help us all

 

[Flyprdu]

How? You don't know ONE DAMN THING about Mesaba's finances or it's trip through BK. The bankruptcy was INTENTIONALLY caused by NW and MAIR. Period. They were profitable and stable until NW filed BK and withheld payment. MAIR took their millions and hid it under the pillow. The pilots NEVER had anything to do with it.

And you wonder why this entire industry thinks Pinnacle pilots are a joke. Keep up the good work...

Boy, you're pretty pious now that you've moved on. Since you've got absolutely no dog in this fight, I suggest you move on to your greener pastures.

My point was that it's XJ's absolute inflexibility that is intentionally causing a partial system flush - costing the company hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of dollars in unnecessary opportunity and training costs. It's not hard to imagine that the pilots caused some of the fiscal hardships of their former company.

A lot of the XJ guys are speaking of bankruptcy as a joke, meanwhile absolving themselves of any responsibility in it. It strikes me as cavalier and oblivious.

Lastly, Gojo, I suppose you would like to have us Pinnacle guys lay down and play nice while you railroad us with your displacements. I'm sorry, but I can't do that. What is happening isn't right. It isn't equitable.

XJ is like a man who fell out of a window and grabbed someone as he went out... making sure that the other guy cushioned his fall.

 

[CptMurf]

Boy, you're pretty pious now that you've moved on. Since you've got absolutely no dog in this fight, I suggest you move on to your greener pastures.

My point was that it's XJ's absolute inflexibility that is intentionally causing a partial system flush - costing the company hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of dollars in unnecessary opportunity and training costs. It's not hard to imagine that the pilots caused some of the fiscal hardships of their former company.

A lot of the XJ guys are speaking of bankruptcy as a joke, meanwhile absolving themselves of any responsibility in it. It strikes me as cavalier and oblivious.

Lastly, Gojo, I suppose you would like to have us Pinnacle guys lay down and play nice while you railroad us with your displacements. I'm sorry, but I can't do that. What is happening isn't right. It isn't equitable.

XJ is like a man who fell out of a window and grabbed someone as he went out... making sure that the other guy cushioned his fall.

The reason these provisions were in the contract, was to protect from massive shifts like this within the assumed "one" airline. Of course it was designed to cost the company money, this is the protection for us from losing QOL. The company should have seen this cost up front. Before they decided to do this "Asset Transfer." You point fingers at the XJ pilots, who wrote a provision to protect their QOL, but you you give no blame to our former management for this deluded plan to merge 3 airlines into 2. Nor do you recognize that 9e and 9L guys voted for and ratified this contract too, in it's entirety. Instead you blame XJ pilots, and further your insult by saying XJ pilots were the demise of MAIR and XJ. Not true at all. XJ was profitable the day it went into BK, which was solely due to NWA not paying XJ for services rendered. XJ has also brought enough revenue to PNCL Corp. to essentially pay for itself. This never was, or is a failing airline. The plan to merge the 3 airlines is solely to blame for any financial hardships we see now.

I have no problem negotiating an LOA for temporary relief of contract provisions to help the financial impact of the merger, but I have no intentions of endorsing routing these provisions from the contract. They are there for a reason. As you gain seniority, or as some face the reality of possibly being a lifer here, they will want these provisions intact. The idea that they shouldn't be there because you won't be here in 5 years, is very myopic and extremely selfish.

 

[gojo]

Boy, you're pretty pious now that you've moved on. Since you've got absolutely no dog in this fight, I suggest you move on to your greener pastures.

My point was that it's XJ's absolute inflexibility that is intentionally causing a partial system flush - costing the company hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of dollars in unnecessary opportunity and training costs. It's not hard to imagine that the pilots caused some of the fiscal hardships of their former company.

A lot of the XJ guys are speaking of bankruptcy as a joke, meanwhile absolving themselves of any responsibility in it. It strikes me as cavalier and oblivious.

Lastly, Gojo, I suppose you would like to have us Pinnacle guys lay down and play nice while you railroad us with your displacements. I'm sorry, but I can't do that. What is happening isn't right. It isn't equitable.

XJ is like a man who fell out of a window and grabbed someone as he went out... making sure that the other guy cushioned his fall.

Take your blinders off and try looking at the whole picture. No one at Xj wanted this and it was not our decision to park the Saabs. XJ was and still is a safe and profitable airline, and up until recently had very good performance. Your anger is misdirected, and it's not doing anyone any good.

 

[bri5150]

My point was that it's XJ's absolute inflexibility that is intentionally causing a partial system flush - costing the company hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of dollars in unnecessary opportunity and training costs. It's not hard to imagine that the pilots caused some of the fiscal hardships of their former company.

A lot of the XJ guys are speaking of bankruptcy as a joke, meanwhile absolving themselves of any responsibility in it. It strikes me as cavalier and oblivious.

Our "inflexibility" in the past has gotten us the work rules and pay rates you now enjoy. It also gotten the scope letter we had in our contract so that we didn't all end up at year one pay with this mess. "Inflexibilty" is not a bad thing, most of the time. I do agree though, we should have an LOA to bypass this provision until the Saab guys are all moved.

 

[Flyprdu]

Im curious if you guys are serious about offering relief, or if it's lip service.

The first Pinnacle downgrades start training Oct 3rd. If you're serious, encourage your MEC to approve a temporary relaxing to allow those Captains to stay in their seats.

Afterall, it's your MEC and front office that's running the show these days.

 

[mesaba13]

There is no mesaba anymore and thus no mesaba provsions. The JCBA was agreed to by all parties right?

 

[bri5150]

Im curious if you guys are serious about offering relief, or if it's lip service.

The first Pinnacle downgrades start training Oct 3rd. If you're serious, encourage your MEC to approve a temporary relaxing to allow those Captains to stay in their seats.

Afterall, it's your MEC and front office that's running the show these days.

I did before I even started this thread.

 

[WMUSIGPI]

It is and always was and will be about protecting the most senior, the rest of us are just fodder....