Unbiased Verbiage for Ticket Factory

[harrier]

I am writing a survey as part of my thesis and beating my head against the wall on one point. I want to ask about 'certificate mills' or 'ticket factories' but I can't use those terms as they are obviously biased. How would you describe a school that is known in the industry as a ticket factory without bias?

One person suggested a 'part 141 flight school with testing authorization'. Someone else said a 'school devoted to accelerated training' or a 'school devoted to training future airline pilots'. All are basically correct, but if you read a survey, would you know it was referring to the certificate mills out there? What phraseology would make it clear to you?

Thanks in advance! harrier

 

[frog_flyer]

what sort of ... ticket factories are we talking about here.... ?


lets have some names

 

[harrier]

You know, like "Ticket Factories R Us", "You Ain't Need A Learn Nuthin, Just Give Us Cash" and "1 Day Pilot Licenses Guaranteed"

Haha I can't name real ones! Holy flame war batman!

 

[Metro752]

You know, like "Ticket Factories R Us", "You Ain't Need A Learn Nuthin, Just Give Us Cash" and "1 Day Pilot Licenses Guaranteed"

Haha I can't name real ones! Holy flame war batman!

You are the Grand Master Lurker. FOUR years on this board and 2 posts. HOW??

 

[minitour]

One person suggested a 'part 141 flight school with testing authorization'.

You do realize to obtain and retain examining authority there are several things that have to be in line.

One of those is the pass rate for students that have already taken the course over the past 24 months with a DPE/fed.

I fail to see how a school that obviously does a good job training, their students are passing, so they apply for and are granted examing authority (for two years) is a "certificate mill".

Training is as good as both parties (school/CFI and student) make it.

-mini

 

[SPilot]

I went to a part 141 school with license issue authority, and believe me: while it reduces the workload on the FSDO, it does not mean that the school is free to grant licenses as it so desire. FAA inspectors often sit in on the oral test without prior notice, and the instructors granted designated examining authority are thouroughly tested and in good standing with the FSDO. They are so to say just as much examiners as any other FAA inspector.

For license mills, I'd rather look out for FAA inspectors who focus more on being popular and getting lots of calls - business and money - than being tough on standards.

Only advantage for students at schools with examining authority is that if they fail the evaluation flight/checkride, it will not go on their FAA records, and they can try again many times.

From my personal experience with both FAA inspectors and the flight school's designated examiners, I'd say the inhouse testing is the most thourough, because they are so afraid of granting a license to someone who is likely to bust regs later, while the FAA inspectors are playing it more fair and focusing on the current safety issues. FAA examiners also have limited time, while inhouse tests can go on until the desired responses or standards are achieved.

 

[harrier]

Grad school leads to barely enough time to lurk! But once this %#@ paper is done, I'll fill the spaces!!

As you can see, my use of 'ticket factory' and 'certificate mill' lead to defensive responses. This is exactly why I don't want to use this terminology in my surveys. What I am looking for is attitudes towards the types of schools that get classified as 'ticket factories'. We all know what we mean by that, now how to define them in a short sentence without bias?

You've already given me some ideas, for example:
'Part 141 schools with license issuing authority test prospective student's more thoroughly than flight schools using FSDO and independant pilot examiners. Agree, Disagree, or No Opinion' (rough drafty question).

Simply by using the words 'ticket factory' it was assumed I was coming down on them. I am just the unbiased researcher see? This is why I need an unbiased description. Everyone knows what we mean when we use those terms, but what exactly is it (in a small phrase) that makes those schools different?

I have a question dealing with independant DE's and FSDO DE's, perhaps just adding the authorized testing instructors to those questions will cover my bases... By the way, the survey is actually focused on CFI training, not primary student, just for a bit of background.

 

[jim718181]

You talking about ATP?

 

[aussiefly]

one word --- gulfstream

 

[Tonala2k]

Just to make sure I understand, when you say "ticket factory" are you referring only to Part 141 schools with examining authority? Do you also mean part 61 schools who offer accelerated courses, but use FSDO and/or DPE's for examining? I'm part 61 and our chief pilot/CFI is a DPE ASEL Pvt, Comm, Instrument. The reason you're having such a tough time may be you haven't defined for yourself what you're exactly referring to. (Just a thought, not an accusation) I'm unfamiliar with the term. Help me out some and I'll try to help you out some.