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UAL news....We aint dead yet.

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Spoke with one of the Director's of the Banker's Investment group out of NYC today. They said that their "scuttle-butt" was that UAL was going chap. 7 by the end of April...

Wish it wasn't so, but with the impending war and the fact that no one at UAL can agree on a course of action, it is looking like reality at this point.

I think I'm seeing writing on the wall....arghhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!
 
UAL selling Jet-A to Chataqua

Any ideas why UAL is selling Jet-A to Chataqua? Speaking from albeit the limited frame of reference that my baggage pit affords me I find it curious that they are selling jet A to gas up Chataqua's jungle jets.
 
"quote:
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Originally posted by Mr.Aviation
REST IN PIECE UAL!! BYE BYE!!
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Where are your manners?"

Probably the same place he left his spelling book!!
 
Let's not forget that the day after the first Gulf War started, Eastern closed its doors for good. I truly hope that UAL will survive simply because it is one of the great AMERICAN franchises. In March of 2000, United seemed to be hitting on all cylinders and anyone who was looking to get hired by a major airline loved the new contract the pilots negotiated. Now UAL management is trying to abrogate those contracts. This is bad for everyone who flies airplanes for a living. A lot will change over the next 48 hours.....god bless our military.....see ya'all in the desert in the very near future...

#1W
 
FO LUV,

According to CSFB analyst, UAL has not made an aircraft payment since the chapter 11 filing. In his words, “this is of course unsustainable”. Add back in aircraft payments and cash flow is in the red again big time.

Good luck to UAL.

Splert…:cool:
 
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VMA214 said:
"quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Mr.Aviation
REST IN PIECE UAL!! BYE BYE!!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------




Where are your manners?"

Probably the same place he left his spelling book!!

I believe that was intentional as a double entendre. As in, the company will end up in pieces. I certainly hope not, however, that will be bad for any pilot who earns a paycheck.
 
Rough Ride Ahead...

Either way, UAL pilots are in for a rough ride. Either lose your jobs during a liquidation and fight with 10,000 other pilots for scant jobs, or have pay whittled down and your quality of life diminished through extended flight hours to bolster productivity... That situation is disasterous! I know so many UAL pilots, many of whom are furloughed now, who passed-up job offers at Southwest, UPS, Fedex and even Jetblue in its early stages for that "coveted" UAL position... I guess hindsight really is 20/20. Of course, nobody could have ever predicted 9/11 which broke the camel's back.

Good luck to all... UAL will change for the WORSE no matter what...
 
UAL pilots quiting

Another "I know a guy" thread....but:
Got a friend who is UAL 737 capt. Said he knows about five UAL pilots that have quit (not furloughed, not Mil leave, not early retirement) to take engineering jobs, banking jobs etc. Said that the one thing that made the job worthwhile is pay and work hours (condensed version there) to put up with being gone as much as they are. "That's all changing or gonna change for the worse" he said...they felt it just wasn't worth it anymore, regardless of whether UAL hangs on or not.
My thought...what is normal attrition rate for airline pilots to leave the industry...is this unusual or standard??
 
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Duckman,

I don't know the normal attrition rate for the Majors, but at Delta we MIGHT have a large exodus around May 1st. Apparently, there MIGHT be up to 600 retirements on May 1st alone at Delta. I have heard the big hang up is the April 15th check. Apparently if the pilot waits until after April 15th----the banked Vacation time can be added to the FAE, thus boosting their retirement. A lot of the senior guys can see that we probably will be taking some pay cuts, and their retirement is based off of their best 3 CONSECUTIVE years, not their LAST 3 years. So, they might have already HAD their best three years, and now they might bail. Some people might ask if that would hurt the Delta retirement funding? The answer is no---it is 82% funded, and it could take a large hit. There have been reports about how underfunded our retirement program is----by $4.4 Billion etc. Well, that is really dependant on stock price. If the Stock Market rises only 10% total, that underfunded portion would be wiped out. We need this War to get over fast and the economy to go up again.

Bye Bye----General Lee;) :rolleyes:
 
Interesting General Lee

Wow...interesting General...makes good sense (cents?) that those senior pilots would call it quits and retire if pay drops and hours start to increase. That would also really help the furloughees as well, eh?

"Opinions are like hemorrhoids" right? "Sooner or later every ___hole has one."
So my hemorrhoid is that of all the Big 4 (United, American, Northwest, Delta) Delta has alway been and will continue to be in the best shape of the 4. Delta will be around long after others are dead and buried...if that happens. They've just done a better job of employee/management relations and fiscal caution.
With that said, I can't see them continuing with their present pilot contract, and may end up with a contract that is actually less $$ than the one before you started working the "match United" contract. Whatayathink??
 
Monday Hot Flash - March 17, 2003
News, Issues, & Reviews

Item: The Growing Shortage At United: Credibility

"While we have seen only the press reports, those figures do not come even close to adding up."
-CSFB Analyst James Higgins, CBS News, March 13,2003, regarding United CFO's claim of being cash-positive in January.

It's becoming sort of the reverse of crying wolf.

Last week, United's CFO got the airline some great press, announcing that United was cash-positive to the tune of $1 million a day in January. Great news. The media headlines trumpeted this achievement, taking the CFO's statement at face value. But there was a lot of skepticism in the industry, given the track record of weird data coming from United's executive offices.

Two days later, Credit Suisse First Boston came out seriously questioning United's claim: "Our only surmise is that United is not making payments on many items...we can think of no way that monthly cash flow could have been even close to positive ... such decisions not to pay are unsustainable."

What's also unsustainable how long this stuff will be taken seriously. Getting accused of playing word games by financial institutions like CSFB is not a good sign for United's senior management. Nor can it build confidence in the carrier's overall direction.

This comes fast on the heels of another sunshine story that left the industry underwhelmed. Two weeks ago United's senior management grandly announced that its new, substantially-lower business fares were "revenue positive" - i.e., the decline in unit revenues was being more than off-set by increases in the number of passengers. Other airlines - which have seen just the opposite - scratched their heads. Bluntly,a lot of folks didn't believe it. Then, just days later, United announced the lay-off of 900 more flight attendants because of lower passenger traffic. First, they tell the world their grand fare scheme is generating more passengers. Then they pink-slip hundreds of employees for low passenger loads.

As they say down on the farm, that cow don't moo. CSFB is right. Something here doesn't seem to add up.

United is not running out of money. It's much worse. It's senior management is running out of credibility. The track record is getting pretty clear. In November there was the embarrassing ATSB filing, with numbers that were zip codes away from reality. Then there was the flood of obviously advisor-scripted babble about "reconstituting margins" and "transformational models" and describing some passenger segments as "price-driven occasionalists," all of which seemed to indicate more smoke than substance in the front offices.

Stop Blaming Labor. This is one big reason United's labor unions are not rushing to agree to management's concessions. They have to ask, concessions to achieve what? They see shifting numbers, unclear direction, and what is unquestionably a fuzzy plan to simply start a parallel airline, with everybody at the bottom of the wage ladder. Regardless of how much management is paying its "advisors" and how aggressively its public relations department tries to get the media to write sunshine stories about management's great expertise and its heroic efforts, things seem to be getting increasingly cloudy at United.

There Is A Better Model. United's situation remains in stark contrast to that of US Airways. That carrier has so far progressed through - and hopefully, out of - a tough bankruptcy. They had a plan. They had employee support. They didn't rely on trendy crackpot panaceas like starting surrogate airlines. No leaked PowerPoint extravaganzas touting terms that seemed to come out of an Airline 101 class at some rural junior college. And unlike United, US Airways' numbers, data, and plan were believable to both the ATSB and outside investors.

To get out of bankruptcy, United will need the full confidence of employees, creditors, financial institutions and the flying public.

They need to work a whole lot harder in that direction.
 
Duckman,

Well, I also think that our pay rates are a little "high" now compared to the rest of the industry, and there probably should be some sort of small adjustment, like a 10-15% cut. But, we still would be the highest paid, and some of that pay cut could go to helping Delta buy some assets---like UAL's Asian routes. (along with some of their planes) With more widebodies (used to fly the Asian routes)---comes more upgrades and higher pay eventually. Then we should make sure that all of our furloughed pilots return ASAP, and then---if the economy does rise as expected eventually---start hiring again. (This might take a couple of years atleast) We would then welcome a lot of ASA pilots and probably others mixed in.

I also think Delta will be around after all of this is over, and hopefully we will grow and pay off all of our debt as quickly as possible. This is all speculation---ofcourse. Let's hope for a short War!!!


Bye Bye--General Lee:cool: :cool: ;) :rolleyes:
 
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