UAL Furloughees... We're supposed to have jobs

Skippy

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well, how about this schit: a grievance has been filed-?--- they have met with the UX mgmnt and come to an impasse? ARE you freaking serious? Got this from our official MEC rumor control website---- i think this is kicking furloughees in the nuts or vajayjay when their down-- but hey, geauxjet has a class on sept 8th and no i'd never go there. UFB

SKIPPY




Rumor: What happened to the jet for jobs clause in our contract? I was under the impression that when we agreed to the 70 seat RJs, furloughed pilots would flow into the right seat at second year pay if the UA express carrier were hiring. During the first furlough in 2001 we had this provision. What has changed during this round of furloughs?

Truth: What you are referring to is LOA 03-22 “Job Opportunities for Furloughed United Pilots” which provides job opportunities based on deliveries of "qualifying aircraft" and is not a really a "flow back". As stated in an earlier Straight and Level, GoJet is the only Express carrier hiring pilots, and as of 3 August 2009 there have been three new hire classes at GoJet that have had furloughed United pilots hired under the terms LOA 03-22. The next available class at GoJet is scheduled for 8 September 2009 and will be filled based on FCOL preferences submitted as of 4 August 2009. Further information concerning LOA 03-22 is available on the "Jobs" page under the "Furlough" pull down on the MEC website. The other participating carriers are currently not hiring, Mesa and Shuttle America have both furloughed and SkyWest has offered SPLOA in an attempt to avoid furloughing. Both Shuttle America and SkyWest have continued to take delivery of qualifying aircraft since September 2008. We have met with the company at their request as prescribed under LOA 03-23 "Participating Carrier Meet and Discuss" concerning Shuttle America's and SkyWest's non-compliance and after several meetings we have come to an impasse. A grievance has been filed concerning the non-compliance under LOA 03-22 by the company as well as Shuttle America and SkyWest.
 

ewrord

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As a UAL furloughed pilot myself, I am not interested in any regional jobs. I was on the street for 6 months before I found a job and never once seriously considered any regional. Hopefully, you can find something other than those regionals with that lousy pay. I figure if I am going to work for as little as they pay, I may as well be home. Good luck.
 

rajflyboy

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As a UAL furloughed pilot myself, I am not interested in any regional jobs. I was on the street for 6 months before I found a job and never once seriously considered any regional. Hopefully, you can find something other than those regionals with that lousy pay. I figure if I am going to work for as little as they pay, I may as well be home. Good luck.
80 G for captain pay for an RJ??

Not too shabby when you look at the median wages for employee's in this country.

A captain job at a regional isn't horrible if you get with the right company (this is very hard to find I will admit)

FO pay >> Now thats a completely different story. It needs raised up big time.
 

aircowboy

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80 G for captain pay for an RJ??

Not too shabby when you look at the median wages for employee's in this country.

A captain job at a regional isn't horrible if you get with the right company (this is very hard to find I will admit)

FO pay >> Now thats a completely different story. It needs raised up big time.
Who hires captains again genius?
 

ASA_DFW

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As a flowback, you would not be a captain but a FO. 2nd year pay as a FO at GoJets would be $30 per hour, 74 hour guarantee. That averages out to be 2,220 per month and 26,640 per year.

I would rather stay at home and collect unemployment for 79 weeks.
 

SpyFlysDOTs

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SkyW hired over 100 UAL furloughees back around 2003-2004.
Most went back to UAL.
Some even upgraded to Captain.
Since SkyW hasn't hired since this newest wave of furloughs, how could it be in violation of anything?
 

Dumb Pilot

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Who hires captains again genius?
Now perhaps, but a few years back several regionals where hiring DEC's. My last three years at a regional I was averaging 90K a year (with my checkairman pay override that is) Not stellar but better than Home Depot
 

contrail67

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well, how about this schit: a grievance has been filed-?--- they have met with the UX mgmnt and come to an impasse? ARE you freaking serious? Got this from our official MEC rumor control website---- i think this is kicking furloughees in the nuts or vajayjay when their down-- but hey, geauxjet has a class on sept 8th and no i'd never go there. UFB

SKIPPY




Rumor: What happened to the jet for jobs clause in our contract? I was under the impression that when we agreed to the 70 seat RJs, furloughed pilots would flow into the right seat at second year pay if the UA express carrier were hiring. During the first furlough in 2001 we had this provision. What has changed during this round of furloughs?

Truth: What you are referring to is LOA 03-22 “Job Opportunities for Furloughed United Pilots” which provides job opportunities based on deliveries of "qualifying aircraft" and is not a really a "flow back". As stated in an earlier Straight and Level, GoJet is the only Express carrier hiring pilots, and as of 3 August 2009 there have been three new hire classes at GoJet that have had furloughed United pilots hired under the terms LOA 03-22. The next available class at GoJet is scheduled for 8 September 2009 and will be filled based on FCOL preferences submitted as of 4 August 2009. Further information concerning LOA 03-22 is available on the "Jobs" page under the "Furlough" pull down on the MEC website. The other participating carriers are currently not hiring, Mesa and Shuttle America have both furloughed and SkyWest has offered SPLOA in an attempt to avoid furloughing. Both Shuttle America and SkyWest have continued to take delivery of qualifying aircraft since September 2008. We have met with the company at their request as prescribed under LOA 03-23 "Participating Carrier Meet and Discuss" concerning Shuttle America's and SkyWest's non-compliance and after several meetings we have come to an impasse. A grievance has been filed concerning the non-compliance under LOA 03-22 by the company as well as Shuttle America and SkyWest.
The problem with the whole thing is that if a person is furloughed at United they should flow to the Captains Seat at the regional....but they have it as going to the FO's seat....just shows the weakness in the Union.
 

Skippy

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The problem with the whole thing is that if a person is furloughed at United they should flow to the Captains Seat at the regional....but they have it as going to the FO's seat....just shows the weakness in the Union.
I agree but it's not how it was negotiated.



Both Shuttle America and SkyWest have continued to take delivery of qualifying aircraft since September 2008. = positions furloughees should be in at that time-


it says it right there


im not saying flowing back to fo is right or wrong, but coming from TSA, ill take the higher road and not go to gojet. I would consider a skywest or shuttle america. I have been sitting back doing the unemployment thing-- but i believe im in the extension period now. But that's not the point. The UX carriers involved rec'd qualifying aircraft and they arent putting the mainline furloughees in the seats-- that is unacceptable- whether there are enough positions that reach me or not-- it's wrong and is probably causing some sort of loss of income or benefits to one or more individuals and i think there should be repercussions and compensation to the affected pilots.



SKIPPY
 

AA717driver

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The problem with the whole thing is that if a person is furloughed at United they should flow to the Captains Seat at the regional....but they have it as going to the FO's seat....just shows the weakness in the Union.
Ask the AA Flowbacks at Eagle how that's working out. LOA died and--viola! Back to the FO seat on the ERJ.

Be careful what you wish for...

TC
 

JimmyKool

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thanks for passn it up skippie my boy. i never should have gone to ual!
 

surplus1

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The problem with the whole thing is that if a person is furloughed at United they should flow to the Captains Seat at the regional....but they have it as going to the FO's seat....just shows the weakness in the Union.
For what reason should a furloughed pilot go to the Captain seat? What is it that you think entitles you to bypass other pilots at another company? Would you let furloughed pilots from another airline go to the left seat at UAL? What makes you "entitled"?

Any pilot group that gives you that privilege should only be classified as fools and suckers.
 
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SSDD

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The deliveries that Skywest is taking are one for one Brasilia replacements. No net gain in the number of airframes. No pilot hiring.
 

spitfire1500

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For what reason should a furloughed pilot go to the Captain seat? What is it that you think entitles you to bypass other pilots at another company? Would you let furloughed pilots from another airline go to the left seat at UAL? What makes you "entitled"?

Any pilot group that gives you that privilege should only be classified as fools and suckers.
agreed!
 
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PCL_128

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For what reason should a furloughed pilot go to the Captain seat? What is it that you think entitles you to bypass other pilots at another company? Would you let furloughed pilots from another airline go to the left seat at UAL? What makes you "entitled"?

Any pilot group that gives you that privilege should only be classified as fools and suckers.
Good to see you posting again!

In a situation where there is a net gain in airframes and pilot hiring is taking place, allowing furloughed mainline pilots to take the CA slots would be beneficial to your group because the slots that are being created as permanent, while the furloughed pilots filling them are only temporary. When the furloughee returns to his mainline carrier, those slots are all yours. Of course, this is only beneficial if the net gain in aircraft is conditional upon accepting the furloughed pilots into the left seats (ie. J4J). If you would be getting the airplanes either way, then you're in a great bargaining position and would have no reason to accept it.

The deliveries that Skywest is taking are one for one Brasilia replacements. No net gain in the number of airframes. No pilot hiring.
Reading the LOA, it never specifically states that a net gain in aircraft is a requirement. It only refers to "qualifying" aircraft being added to the fleet at the feeder carrier. On the other hand, there is language referring to position being added as "the normal course of business," which seems to imply that if positions aren't being created with hiring, then the LOA doesn't apply. I doubt they'll win the grievance, but they do have a shot.
 

JoeMerchant

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Yet another example of ALPA's scope failure. Flowbacks and J4Js don't work....never have....
 

Mr.B

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As a UAL furloughed pilot myself, I am not interested in any regional jobs. I was on the street for 6 months before I found a job and never once seriously considered any regional. Hopefully, you can find something other than those regionals with that lousy pay. I figure if I am going to work for as little as they pay, I may as well be home. Good luck.
What he said.

Its the regional express feed we (ALPA) needs to shrink and return our jobs to us at mainline.
 

PCL_128

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contrail67

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thanks for passn it up skippie my boy. i never should have gone to ual!
And when all the retirements kick in....you will still be out. Skippy will be well on his way moving up the ladder at UAL....you won't.
 

waveflyer

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No- alpa and alpa pilots definitely failed. Joey just takes it to the wrong conclusions.

UAL furloughees should be in the skywest seats and skywest pilots should be on the street. Sorry, but if you replace Brasilia w/ qualifying RJs that doesn't relinquish OO from having UA pilots in the seats.

All the RJs should have been on mainline property in the 1st place. The dynamics that are in place bc they aren't ARE a complete failure by the pilots involved
 
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