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Ual / Erp

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It's a P.O.S.........

I have looked at some of the details and it fails to address many of the outstanding grievances the company has violated along the way. Our Master Chairman initially stated that these issues needed to be resolved before any deal could be reached......Regional flying by the UAX carriers, furloughed pilots, minimum # of pilots on the active seniority list......What happened??????? It doesn't appear any of this stuff will be resolved according to our contract. Also it was stated that for the pilots to deal, all employee groups would need to participate for an agreement to be reached. WTFO?????????

Seems like all it offers to the pilots are stock options in exchange for a 10% pay cut and having the contract extended a few years.

I think this thing will not even get approved by the UAL MEC and therefore won't even make it out for a vote amoung the pilots. Even if it did it would get shot down hard. I have lost all confidence in the words of our Master Chairman at this point, we need to get someone else in there.
 
It addresses all of the issues. ALPA agrees to withdraw the greviences, and the company agrees to take no further "force majeure" actions. The issues of RJ's and minimum fleet size are redefined and new goals set. The pilots take a 10% paycut, but the A plan and disability benifits are protected at "book rates", plus there's a defined end of the program with significant payrate increases starting in Sept '03. They even throw us furloughed guys a bone with pay longevity for our time on the street. Certainly not a perfect deal, but if the other groups go along, then it might be a good push to move UAL in the right direction.


What's the deal with the US Airways code-share comments at the end?
 
furlough-boy said:
It addresses all of the issues. ALPA agrees to withdraw the greviences, and the company agrees to take no further "force majeure" actions.

Calling dropping the greivence as addressing them o.k.The company will continue to do as they wish anyways...they are already illegally furloughing folks along with the rj issue.

The issues of RJ's and minimum fleet size are redefined and new goals set.

Reduce mainline from 625 to 534 and increase rjss to 133 2002, 224 2003, and 243 2004. Mainline increas of 12 wide / 1 narrow in 2004.. nice goal..more time on the street

The pilots take a 10% paycut, but the A plan and disability benifits are protected at "book rates", plus there's a defined end of the program with significant payrate increases starting in Sept '03.

even with increases still below whats in the contract now.

They even throw us furloughed guys a bone with pay longevity for our time on the street.

Will come in handy with more time on the street with the rj increase and the blanket Airways codeshare.

Certainly not a perfect deal, but if the other groups go along, then it might be a good push to move UAL in the right direction.

More money for Dutta, and management to blow on mismanagement...In the top 100 worst managed company is saying something for these clowns.

What's the deal with the US Airways code-share comments at the end?

Its called giving them a blank check to do with as they wish. "The parties will work to develop a mutually-acceptable
agreement concerning a US Airways code sharing program promptly as practicable following the conclusion of this Term Sheet."


Calling this ERP a POS is being polite. Taking paycut, lose jobs, stay on street longer , buy stock at a yet to be determined price(another bone for the new guys) great deal
 
Not US Air again!!

Yes, it's interesting how they slipped in the part about US Air right at the end, especially with such open ended language. I see a serious job protection issue here as a result of any US Air code-share.

Now we have US Air with jobs for RJs AND we have more UAX RJs as a result of this deal. Instead of just shipping off mainline flying to UAX, management will now be shipping it off to US Air. This could make it years before UAL mainline springs back to its pre 9/11 size, if ever.

This is obviously a huge punch in the gut the poor furloughed slobs.....and of course for that many more for RJ pilots who will now never make it to the majors....
 
Not gonna Pass

This deal won't even make it past the MEC. If it does it will be voted down overwhelmingly. Has anyone been over at the UAL ALPA board? Hundreds of responses and not one is positive twords this agreement. The company will retaliate by furloughing more pilots if it is voted down, but at this point who cares because if this deal passes the furloughees will never be coming back anyway. I mean if this deal passes the minimum fleet number at UAL is allowed to shrink while RJ growth is allowed up to 243 by 2004 and a proposed domestic code share with USAirways (whose pilots and employees will make considerably less when their concessions are given). Guess where UAL growth will go? Thats right RJs and USAir. This deal is DOA.
 
Piece of shizzle, bizzle!

As a furloughee I sometimes wonder why I don't read the ALPA website and I don't follow UAL stock. Now I'm reminded why. This recovery plan is garbage, Is the company or the union ever going to put anything out that brings a smile to my face. It's not hard to make me smile, but it's been a long time since the word UAL has brought a smile to my face. God help us all.
 
It is a sad commentary on our union leadership that they even negioated a proposal like this. I think they are out of touch with the members at large.
 
out of touch?

Out of touch?

In my humble opinion, it's a majority of the line pilots that are out of touch with reality. The MEC just endorced the ERP. The MEC has access to the company's financial records. They have consulted with the best financial and legal advisors money can buy and they think that it's in the pilot groups best interests in approve the plan.

The RJ issue is something that ALPA needs to develop a plan to deal with. We can restrict UAL from having RJ's up until the day all the other majors with them put us out of business.

The economic reality of the industry has changed, and the pilots (as they always have) will have to lead.

The US Airways statement just says that they will try to develop a plan that is acceptable to the pilot group. Doesn't say they have to. The NWA/CO codeshare has been benifitual to both companies, so a correctly structured agreement could benifit the UAL pilot group.

Just my opinion
 
Hey gang,

Being furloughed from another carrier that seems to be trying to fly RJ's everywhere, that United deal sucks. Lets see give up 10% pay shrink mainline (which means a bigger paycut or at least quality of life) almost unlimited growth of RJ's, stop all possible greviances that could help the cause, and


SELL THE FURLOUGH GANG DOWN THE RIVER WITH NO END IN SIGHT!

That sure does not sound to good to me for some stock options that are not worth anything now.

I hope your pilots don't vote for that, and when it comes to concessions, how about giving something on mgmt side.
 

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