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UAL 2 quarter losses bigger than last years

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UAL78 said:
Hmmmm...the only ones who are making threats are the flight attendants. "Will not be tolerated" is simply making your position clear. I may be incorrect, but I believe the pension issues are done deals. Why are they thumping their chests now? What do they expect to accomplish?

Got to wonder how many mechanics might still be on the property (if they wanted to be) if they'd been a little more in the mood to play ball in the early stages.

Just a thought.

"Will not be tolerated" sounds like a threat to me. What can the company do, fire them? What I'm getting at is this is a poor approach to managing your labor. People with any backbone (and very little to lose) tend to stiffin their resolve when this kind of language is used. Of course the FA threat will probably also stiffen management resolve (also people with guaranteed pensions and golden 'chute--very little to lose).

What the hell do I know, I'm just a regional slave--chained to a soon-to-be-bankrupt master. But I do have friends at United. I guess I have to ask when is enough, enough?
 
WillowRunVortex said:
" It said it would do whatever necessary to ensure the continued smooth operation of the company."

1.43 Billion in losses?,,,real fu_ckin smooooooth operation.

There is still no guarantee of future success here. However, to clarify what you might be thinking of a 1.4 billion loss:


Yesterday we released our financial report for the 2nd quarter. I am
sure most of you have seen the headlines in the newspaper this morning
that focused on our net quarterly loss. But if you go beyond the
headlines, you get a better picture of our financial situation.

· Most importantly, we generated quarterly operating earnings of $48
million, a $41 million improvement over the period last year,
despite a $262 million increase in fuel expenses.

· Our mainline unit revenue was up 5 percent and competitive with our
leading network competitors.

· Our cost per available seat mile (CASM) was up 6 percent including
fuel costs, but was down 3 percent if fuel is excluded - even though
capacity decreased 3 percent.

· Our unrestricted cash balance improved by $295 million for the
quarter to $1.7 billion. Including restricted cash, we now have a
total cash balance of $2.6 billion.

There is also more to the story of our net loss of $1.4 billion. $1.39
billion of that loss is reorganization expenses that will be resolved as
part of the bankruptcy process and settled for a minor fraction of the
amount of the charges. These are non-cash charges, and are common for
companies progressing through Chapter 11, particularly as restructuring
work nears completion.

Hope this helps. Now flame away.
 
What the hell do I know,

Palerider, doesn't seem like very much on this subject. With the exception of the CEO's package that got him to United, the management at UAL all had their pensions turned over to the PBGC, same as the FAs. So when you say "people with guaranteed pensions," it is because you don't know what you are talking about.

The reason they are threatening to fire the FAs is because there is no real precedent for this situation, and a CHAOS action could very well be ruled illegal. I'm sure they will fire them if it comes up, and let the court decide. Regardless, less than 1% participated in the informational picketing - doesn't seem like a lot of support. What it does seem like is part of an on-going negotiation with the FAs, where mgt is going to posture just like the union.

1.43 Billion in losses?,,,real fu_ckin smooooooth operation.

If that is what you take away from the quarterly results, you have absolutely no understanding of how this process works and the numbers in the report.
 
b737drivr said:
One analyst – airline consultant Michael Boyd - said United's cost cuts in Chapter 11 have made it viable, but that the company needs a change in management if it is to compete long-term with key rival AMR Corp's American Airlines. America last week said its second-quarter profit rose to $58 million.

Hey, Boyd might actually be right about something for once....
 
Dangerkitty...not picking a fight but...

Seems to me pensions are a huge cash drain on AMR. I don't advocate them going away but the folks over at Eagle work awful hard and for allot less.

No matter how much the Allison 3007's burn per seat, it is hard for me to fathom that they havn't contributed in a favorable way to AMR's bottom line.

Seems to me its just a number shuffle...makeup for the pig
 
Dangerkitty said:
It's not cooking the books. Since Eagle has obtained the RJ's they have been nothing but a huge cash drain on AMR.

Actually I am suprised that it was only a 66 Million dollar loss.

So does this mean that American should have taken the CRJ700's? I have always felt that regional affiliates should have been restricted to 50 seats and we wouldn't be seeing the proliferation of the regionals while mainline, where the career positions can be obtained, are shrunk.
 
Dangerkitty said:
It's not cooking the books. Since Eagle has obtained the RJ's they have been nothing but a huge cash drain on AMR.

Actually I am suprised that it was only a 66 Million dollar loss.

Same at NWA. RJs have been a huge vortex of cash. After the subsidies for fuel and landing fees, not to mention "forgiven" 15 million dollar debts, the ink is pretty red despite the bottom drawer wages.

This doesn't even include midnight "revenue" flights with no passengers because they couldn't find a FA just so they can get their handout from the mothership. Oh yea, NWA has to pick up the tab for putting up the stranded pax for the night as a bonus.

The only things revenue positive at either of the Airlinks are the Saabs.

It's right in the 10k if you want to look it up.

Nu
 
Gofish said:
Dangerkitty...not picking a fight but...

Seems to me pensions are a huge cash drain on AMR. I don't advocate them going away but the folks over at Eagle work awful hard and for allot less.

No matter how much the Allison 3007's burn per seat, it is hard for me to fathom that they havn't contributed in a favorable way to AMR's bottom line.

Seems to me its just a number shuffle...makeup for the pig

Gofish,

1. Pensions are not a huge drain on AMR right now. The "A" fund that AMR contributes to is as of right now about 75% funded. Much much better than any other legacy carrier. The "B" fund HAS to be contributed to each month. Infact AA and the APA have been lobbying Congress to not do a thing about Pension reform. This is the exact opposite tactic than the other legacy carriers are enganged in. While NWA, DAL, and UAL lobbyists are trying to get Congress to leglislate some type of pension reform, AA is asking them not to. That to me states that the Pension situation is fine at AA.

2. The APA Board of Directors was given a VERY VERY detailed briefing by Michael Boyd on the problems with the RJ's. Luckily it was recorded so that the pilot group could see it as well. To say it was eye opening is an understatement. Like him or not Michael Boyd does his homework and he is right many many more times than he is wrong.

He gave detailed analysis on why the RJ's cannot and will not work in the manner in which Eagle has employed them. He stated that AMR should get rid of everything except the EMB-145 and the CRJ-700. And then have maybe a MAXIMUM of about 100 RJ's total. In most cases the RJ is nothing more than a huge cash hole for AMR. So much so that they have actually cancelled most if not all of their RJ options.

3. Finally this isn't a slam at Eagle or any of their pilots. I was a Regional Pilot for almost 4 years. I know how hard these guys work and how little they are paid. But the fact is Eagle has become something that it was never intended to be. Regional or Commuter airlines were started to provide feed to Mainline from small markets where bigger aircraft could not be justified. Now you can fly almost coast to coast and not see a Mainline aircraft.

Until RJ's are put back into their intended role the cash drain will continue.

I could be wrong but I have seen some very convincing evidence that leads me to realize that I am right.
 

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