Type Rating Question 61.157(g)(ii)(A)

planedriver

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I am a furloughed regional pilot and I have found out that I may be eligilble to get a 737 type rating paid for through workforce development. I have 1300 total time and 550 turbojet and no military time. I have an SIC type rating in an EMB 145.

The referenced FAR states:
Hold a type rating for a turbojet airplane of the same class of airplane for which the type rating is sought...

It does not specify that the type rating you currently hold must be PIC. Am I subject to the pilot in command limitation for supervised flying as noted in 61.157 (8) and (9)(i)(ii) with just an SIC type rating and not PIC?
 

A Squared

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I am a furloughed regional pilot and I have found out that I may be eligilble to get a 737 type rating paid for through workforce development. I have 1300 total time and 550 turbojet and no military time. I have an SIC type rating in an EMB 145.

The referenced FAR states:
Hold a type rating for a turbojet airplane of the same class of airplane for which the type rating is sought...

It does not specify that the type rating you currently hold must be PIC. Am I subject to the pilot in command limitation for supervised flying as noted in 61.157 (8) and (9)(i)(ii) with just an SIC type rating and not PIC?

Unfortunately, this "SIC type rating" foolishness has created a huge mess, because it bends the definition of "type rating" and the other regulations have not reflected this change. Eventually, this (hopefuly) will all get straightened out. In the meantinme, consider that the "sic type rating" is not a type rating at all and has absolutely no significance unless your certificates are being examined by an official of a foreign country where the SIC is required to be "rated" Other than that the "SIC type rating" counts for nothing, not even bragging rights. If you keep this in mind when considering the question, I think you;ll arrive at the correct answer. (or at least I'd hope so, I'd hate to thing that a half century of the significance "type rating" would suddenly be ditched because somone invented a "SIC type rating" which is essentially a paperwork exercise)

YMMV
 

I_Love_Lamp

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I am a furloughed regional pilot and I have found out that I may be eligilble to get a 737 type rating paid for through workforce development. I have 1300 total time and 550 turbojet and no military time. I have an SIC type rating in an EMB 145.
Why not get a citation type rating or something that you might actually find a job flying?
 

planedriver

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Why not get a citation type rating or something that you might actually find a job flying?
I already have a job lined up but I would like to go to SWA someday and if I could get this done now that would save me from having to pay for it myself down the road.
 

planedriver

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Why not get a citation type rating or something that you might actually find a job flying?
Also, a citation type rating is more expensive than a 737 type rating (at least at those training providers approved under the program) and the training program will not pay near the full cost of the type rating. I originally was looking at trying to get a citation or lear type.
 

JAFI

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Do you plan on getting the type in the aircraft or simulator and have you looked into the requirements for each?
 

landlover

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one problem i see is that you only have 1300 hours,which means you don't hold an ATP. Which in turn means if you get a 737 type it could only be at the commercial level. not much good in my opinion.
 

A Squared

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one problem i see is that you only have 1300 hours,which means you don't hold an ATP. Which in turn means if you get a 737 type it could only be at the commercial level. not much good in my opinion.

Doesn't matter, really. If and when he gets his ATP the type rating will still be there, with full priveliges. THere is no such thing as a "commercial priveliges only type rating" on an ATP certificate.
 

landlover

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Doesn't matter, really. If and when he gets his ATP the type rating will still be there, with full priveliges. THere is no such thing as a "commercial priveliges only type rating" on an ATP certificate.
learn something new everyday!
 

JAFI

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Well yes you can have a Commercial Type rating on a ATP if the aircraft (as an example) was a VFR only DC-3 that you took the exam in or you took the Type ride as a VFR only type rating. To have a ATP type rating you have to prove you can fly the aircraft IFR.
 

A Squared

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Well yes you can have a Commercial Type rating on a ATP if the aircraft (as an example) was a VFR only DC-3 that you took the exam in or you took the Type ride as a VFR only type rating. To have a ATP type rating you have to prove you can fly the aircraft IFR.
Not the same thing. A "VFR only" limitation is not the same as a "commercial priveliges only" type rating, and you are correct that if you have a "VFR only" type rating on your commercial (or private) certificate, it will still be "VFR only" after getting an ATP. This also is addressed in 61.157(d). Except for type ratings with a "VFR only" limitation, there aren't different levels of type ratings. The standards for type rating tests are the same regardless of wherther you have a Private, Comm. or ATP pilot certificate. The priveliges you may exercise in that plane is determined by the grade of pilot certificate you have, not something about the type rating.
 
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Seadogrun

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one problem i see is that you only have 1300 hours,which means you don't hold an ATP. Which in turn means if you get a 737 type it could only be at the commercial level. not much good in my opinion.
If he is that close to ATP times it would be much better to build the 200 hrs and take the written before the type rating. Then upon completion of the Type ride he would get his type and ATP in one shot. The type ride will be to ATP stanadards reguardless. To me it would be silly to get a type rating then 200 hrs later take a seperate check ride for the ATP.
 
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FO4life

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A free type is a free type regardles of aircraft. my 2 cents.
 

planedriver

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I'm in a hiring pool somewhere so I was trying to do this before I get called for class because once that happens I will no longer be eligible. I would love to get the ATP along with the type but I don't have the money to pay for 200 hours of flying on my own and again, once I start the new job and flying again, I will be ineligible for the WIA funds.
 

Amish RakeFight

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If he is that close to ATP times it would be much better to build the 200 hrs and take the written before the type rating. Then upon completion of the Type ride he would get his type and ATP in one shot. The type ride will be to ATP stanadards reguardless. To me it would be silly to get a type rating then 200 hrs later take a seperate check ride for the ATP.
I was gonna suggest it too.

...but yeah, the TYPE on a COMM is good for when you acquire your ATP. It transfers, like ASqrd said. As a matter of fact, I recall one of the questions in the ATP bank addressing this as a question.
 

Fearless Tower

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Unfortunately, this "SIC type rating" foolishness has created a huge mess, because it bends the definition of "type rating" and the other regulations have not reflected this change. Eventually, this (hopefuly) will all get straightened out. In the meantinme, consider that the "sic type rating" is not a type rating at all and has absolutely no significance unless your certificates are being examined by an official of a foreign country where the SIC is required to be "rated" Other than that the "SIC type rating" counts for nothing, not even bragging rights.
A Squared, based on what you just said, what is the purpose of an SIC rating supposed to be and why does the FAA offer it?

I was recently reading about SIC ratings being offered in the DC-3.....now, in an aircraft like the DC-3 that requires 2 pilots and meets the criteria for requiring a type rating, is the SIC 'type rating' a valid credential for the second pilot or not?
 

A Squared

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A Squared, based on what you just said, what is the purpose of an SIC rating supposed to be and why does the FAA offer it?

I was recently reading about SIC ratings being offered in the DC-3.....now, in an aircraft like the DC-3 that requires 2 pilots and meets the criteria for requiring a type rating, is the SIC 'type rating' a valid credential for the second pilot or not?
Some other countries requre both pilots in an airplane to be "rated" in the aircraft. A few years back, some started enforcing this on US airline crews. In response, the FAA created the "SIC type rating" to meet that requirement. The rating has absolutely no significance if you don't fly outside of the United States.
 

Fearless Tower

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So, in an aircraft such as the DC-3, both pilots need to be PIC type rated, or am I misunderstanding the FARs?
 
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