TSA and the Fractionals?

[skyaddict]

Personally I find most TSA checkpoints let me take all the liquids (water, gels, hotel shampoos or mouthwashes I have thrown into my bag to go, etc.) that I want whenever I am in uniform. The same goes for all my assorted junk in my carryon/FOM bag- ANR headset, flashlight, phones and charger, a little digital camera, MP3 player, yada yada. Ironically, CMH is the exception where they are like Nazis towards uniformed NJA pilots when it comes to water and going through all the stuff with a fine tooth comb.

Out of uniform on personal travel, at DCA, a TSA mental midget told me that I had to remove my tiny number of toiletries (a mini shampoo and a toothpaste) from my gallon ziploc bag because that bag was too big, and to transfer it into their smaller bag.

However, in uniform by and large they are very polite to me most of the time, I gotta hand that to them. The analness and inconsistency is truly a product of the redundant, reactive TSA bureacuracy rather than the rank and file bag checkers, who have to follow the playbook that is basically like that SNL TSA-training skit.

 

[DLF8108]

RE: TSA and Fractionals

To answer the question directly:

Even though traveling in uniform you are a ticketed passenger: pack accordingly or be ready for TSA to enforce the regulations. (As conveyed by NJA's own security staff.)

Any deviation/laxness from this policy by TSA, is strictly either a personal courtesy (your HBA and they know you), a professional courtesy, or a lack of knowledge.

 

[bailey3083]

In uniform I have not had problems at most the larger airports but the small ones OMG watch out. In SYR I had a TSA agent call his Sup over because he did not recognize the uniform. This lead me to be pulled to the side and be interrogated for 15 mins as to who I was and how I got a crew badge. UGH! Then in ICT I ended up in an argument because the TSA tried to tell me only 121 guys could carry liquids on the A/C but after debating the Station manager for 20 mins I won but missed my flight so can you say overtime day! YEA! But the worse was in Monterey, CA where I had a a book called " The Greatest Story Ever Sold: Bush administration failures from 9/11 to Katrina". The TSA agent actually took the book from me saying that it was "leftist terrorist" type propaganda that was inappropriate to have on a plane! I am still waiting for a response from TSA in DC to see if I am getting my book back.

 

[Dep676]

But the worse was in Monterey, CA where I had a a book called " The Greatest Story Ever Sold: Bush administration failures from 9/11 to Katrina". The TSA agent actually took the book from me saying that it was "leftist terrorist" type propaganda that was inappropriate to have on a plane! I am still waiting for a response from TSA in DC to see if I am getting my book back.

That is beause you were in CA, you got that book taken away. If you have had a Hillary or Nancy book they would have let you right through. You know out there in la-la land they do not like Bush.

 

[clueless]

Then in ICT I ended up in an argument because the TSA tried to tell me only 121 guys could carry liquids on the A/C but after debating the Station manager for 20 mins I won

I'm not flaming, but the fact of the matter is that when you frac guys ride in the cabin of a 121 airplane on a paid ticket, you are passengers, plain and simple...just the same as the person you're sitting next to. You are subject to the same security regulations as everyone else.

Yes, you are professional pilots. But you are private employees flying privately owned airplanes. You are not airline pilots (as you so happily admit to ad nauseum on this forum). You can't ride in the cockpit of a 121 airplane, you can't jumpseat (with a few exceptions), and you gotta put your gels in a plastic bag.

Any place you don't have to do the TSA dance is either a professional courtesy or due to the fact that the screener can't tell the difference between an airline employee and a frac pilot. DLF8108 had it right in his post.

 

[Dep676]

I'm not flaming, but the fact of the matter is that when you frac guys ride in the cabin of a 121 airplane on a paid ticket, you are passengers, plain and simple...just the same as the person you're sitting next to. You are subject to the same security regulations as everyone else.

Yes, you are professional pilots. But you are private employees flying privately owned airplanes. You are not airline pilots (as you so happily admit to ad nauseum on this forum). You can't ride in the cockpit of a 121 airplane, you can't jumpseat (with a few exceptions), and you gotta put your gels in a plastic bag.

Any place you don't have to do the TSA dance is either a professional courtesy or due to the fact that the screener can't tell the difference between an airline employee and a frac pilot. DLF8108 had it right in his post.

We are not wanting to "ride" in the cockpit or anything. We just want to go to and from work and not have to worry about some worth TSA agent taking our liquids. We have gone through the same background check as you 121 guys. I would bet that most of us have had more of a background check than the pinhead TSA people looking in my bag for contraband. My finger prints have gone to the FBI more than once for my frac job and for being a sheriff's department.

So just because we are not 121 does not mean we criminals. Why do you think you are better than us just because you are 121? I am here to tell you are not any better than anyone of us or any of the passengers. You just happen to drive the cattle cart, big frickin deal.

Explain that thinking of yours, you choose to post here, now defend your stupid post. Again we all went through the same background checks, probably more intense ones.

 

[bailey3083]

I'm not flaming, but the fact of the matter is that when you frac guys ride in the cabin of a 121 airplane on a paid ticket, you are passengers, plain and simple...just the same as the person you're sitting next to. You are subject to the same security regulations as everyone else.

Yes, you are professional pilots. But you are private employees flying privately owned airplanes. You are not airline pilots (as you so happily admit to ad nauseum on this forum). You can't ride in the cockpit of a 121 airplane, you can't jumpseat (with a few exceptions), and you gotta put your gels in a plastic bag.

Any place you don't have to do the TSA dance is either a professional courtesy or due to the fact that the screener can't tell the difference between an airline employee and a frac pilot. DLF8108 had it right in his post.

In reality when I get on a Commercial A/C I am the same as a 121 guy commuting to work. The TSA and FAA have both said that we at the FRACS are allowed to be consider crew members and so allowed the same exemptions as the 121 crews enjoy.

 

[honeycomb]

Dep676 ... buddy don't pop a vessel. It ain't worth it.

Now, as for the (so called) security.

I've worked for the DOD (Nuclear Power Officer onboard U.S. Navy Submarines) with a Top Secret and higher clearance.

I have worked 121 (for more than 10 years) and corporate (for more than 10 years as well).

I know for a fact that the Frac Pilots go through as invasive an investigation as the 121 guys/gals. And, more intrusive than the TSA background check.

So, TSA su^ks donkey b@lls. Go figure they couldn't catch our own government agents smuggling simulated guns/knives/bomb's/etc. any better than the previous group. But, they have to justify there more than 5 times the cost behavior.

They make up for their inadequacies by hassling the crews. Go figure.

If you don't like the TSA I recommend you change jobs or have your government representative have them removed and replaced by REAL security. I don't think you'll like the last one more than the first one.

Fly safe and just ignore the TSA security folks. The couldn't hit water if they fell out of a boat.

 

[Dep676]

I am just sick of the 121 guys thinking they are better than everyone else because they fly the cattle cart.

The TSA just needs to get some common sense. They will take the liquids and tweezers from grandma but they do not think twice about all the pens I have my bag. There are hundreds of ways to kill a person with a pen alone but hey you can not drink water on a plane.

 

[bailey3083]

I am just sick of the 121 guys thinking they are better than everyone else because they fly the cattle cart.

The TSA just needs to get some common sense. They will take the liquids and tweezers from grandma but they do not think twice about all the pens I have my bag. There are hundreds of ways to kill a person with a pen alone but hey you can not drink water on a plane.

Heck what about the magazines on the A/C. I can take some rubber bands and make one hell of a club with a rolled up magazine. Oopps better keep my mouth shut or rubber bands will be banned next!

 

[honeycomb]

I'm glad everyone has thier belly full of the TSA. But, really folks ... channel that anger towards the truth.

The TSA makes it possible for me to continue to have a job since my pax's will not subject themselves to it. They are the best device known to man for the continued growth and expansion of corporate aviation since the Wright Bro's.

Peace.

 

[clueless]

We are not wanting to "ride" in the cockpit or anything. We just want to go to and from work and not have to worry about some worth TSA agent taking our liquids. We have gone through the same background check as you 121 guys. I would bet that most of us have had more of a background check than the pinhead TSA people looking in my bag for contraband. My finger prints have gone to the FBI more than once for my frac job and for being a sheriff's department.

So just because we are not 121 does not mean we criminals. Why do you think you are better than us just because you are 121? I am here to tell you are not any better than anyone of us or any of the passengers. You just happen to drive the cattle cart, big frickin deal.

Explain that thinking of yours, you choose to post here, now defend your stupid post. Again we all went through the same background checks, probably more intense ones.

Dude, chill out. I never said that I think 121 pilots are better than frac pilots. All I said was that when frac pilots ride on an airline, they are passengers and generally are treated as such by the TSA.

I know all about the background checks. Been there, done that.

When I ride on an airline while not in uniform, whether jumpseating or riding on some sort of non-rev pass, I am a passenger, too, even though I've got my airline ID with me. I put my gels in a bag and take my shoes off just like everyone else.

We just want to go to and from work and not have to worry about some worth TSA agent taking our liquids. So does the guy going to Boise for a business meeting. I am in favor of a "Preferred Traveler" program where folks can submit to a background check, combined with perhaps a biometric system like a fingerprint scan, and then pass through expedited security lines. Until that happens, we all have to live with the TSA Neanderthals.

 

[honeycomb]

(Clueless .... Read this with a bit of sarcasim.)

"Preferred Traveler" question.

We are in Uniform with a (stinking) badge. What more do you want from your "Preferred Traveler's"?

I wonder aloud as to what would make you or them happy. The Employee's of Airlines/Frac's already go through a more exhaustive background check than the TSA themselves. Maybe we should be checking them.....as my thoughts wonder.

So, again what would you need to do (that is not already done on our end) to become a "Preferred Traveler"?

No Passenger is ready to have the same level of scrutiny that we already go through. So, I'll ask again....Do you not think we should already be "Preferred Travelers"?

If not then I wonder what it would take to make Pax's "Preferred Travelers"?

I ask these things because we as CrewMembers are targeted regardless of the extra scrutiny that we go through. For what reason? I'll tell you becasue the TSA is on a Power Trip. It is un-called for to interogate CrewMembers in or out of uniform.

I for one think we should be able to by-pass security like the rest of the folks that have access to the aircraft. (Like rampers/catering/fuelers/etc.)

Now back to your program.

 

[HSDriver]

Tsa

What you have to keep in mind here is this. You are dealing with a government agency and it is never going to be efficient. No matter how much you want it to be. So just live with it...

HS

 

[walshsfly]

Ok lets just make it simple. If you are a uniformed crew member sitting in the back then you should be striped naked and reamed up the ass regardless of 121 or 135.

Now seriously what the 121 monkeys forget is that we go on the road for longer than they do at a time, and sometimes the adjustable quart size baggy the TSA wants or crap in isn't big enough. I've never heard of a Frac guy taking items through security like I have airline employees. Maybe TSA should focus on 121 folks more than anyone else.

 

[Dep676]

Also if you need more than some armpit stick, toothpaste and shaving cream then something is wrong.

 

[FLYLOW22]

Also if you need more than some armpit stick, toothpaste and shaving cream then something is wrong.

Oh come on! I need my facial moisturizer, hair gel, aftershave and cologne too!

It's ok. I got tagged yesterday by TSA. I was in uniform. The agent asked which airline I was with. I told him. He said, "You aren't a REAL pilot." I smiled with glee. I said, "I know. What do you want me to do?"

"No liquids." he says.

"Okidoak. I carry a TSA bag for situations like this." I say.

Everyone lived happily ever after and my TSA bag was waiting for me at destination.

You won't win if you fight this. The boa constrictor will just get tighter.

 

[Dep676]

You should have told them, you are not a real security screener either, just one of those TSA bozos. What frickin idiot. They continue to prove my point, that they are worthless, on a daily basis.

 

[DO-82 driver]

Grocery baggers with badges!!!!!

At least it gets them out of their trailer park for a few hours.

 

[fischman]

I am just sick of the 121 guys thinking they are better than everyone else because they fly the cattle cart.

Why do you care what the 121 guys think? Why do you care what I think? I don't care what you think. Be cool man.