Trans States to Receive 14 New RJ's

[jetexas]

Somebody correct me if I'm wrong on this..
I heard that the TWA deal was considered an 'aquistition' and not a flat out 'purchase' due to TWA being chapter 11 and borderline chapter 7 at the time the deal went through.
If that's the case, in an 'aquistion', prior contracts do not have to be honored.

 

[eaglefly]

rush - I'm sorry but you have been misinformed. In actuality, when AMR acquired the assets of TWA it DID NOT include contracts with any regional carriers. AMR had both the legal right to renew (or terminate) any or all of those agreements at their option. They chose to renew them (with interesting stipulations) because it was the least expensive way of maintaining feed at STL.

AMR is testing the boundaries to see how far it can go. AMR is doing this in steps.

STEP 1. - Original decision to renew STL contracts with former TWE carriers.

Legal argument - Eagle ALPA - Section 1 Job Security (B) Scope. Primarily involves the concept of "operational control" and the intent of this section to protect AMR from reestablishing a "whipsaw" network. Also as to who the "company" is as the President of Eagle is an AA employee. Additional argument is (F) Increased Flying Opportunites. A lot of paperwork is there from the original contract meetings to help the arbitrator decide on what promises were and were not implied in exchage for an unprecedented 16 year contract guaranteeing labor stability.

Potential ? 50/50. It must be noted the the concept of "intent" in our contract has been argued by AMR previously, so their is precedent as to its concept. No one knows how the arbitrator will rule because only a limited number of people understand waht was presented during arbitration.

STEP 2. - Decision to "transfer" 14 jets flown by Eagle to new "alter-ego" carriers. Section 1 Job Security (D) Succesorship. Aircraft were originally intended to be "returned" to Embrear with Embrear to remarket those A/C for the best price and most secure financing to benefit Embrear. Instead AMR has apparently "cooked-up a backroom deal" to benefit AMR (and Embrear) at the expense of the Eagle pilots and their CBA. Potential ? Eagle ALPA special meeting in Herndon this week. Look for declaration of "major dispute" which would mean lawsuit or possible job action. STEP 3. - Attempt by AMR to start "funneling" these and future A/C thru current Eagle hubs. Then there would be little doubt that this would violate the Eagle CBA which stipulates that the transfer of our operations MUST includes the transfer of our pilots AND contract. Stay tuned. Total showdown is inevitable.

 

[Draginass]

Such is the danger of working for an outsourcer company . . . . someday you're going to get dragged into the middle of a really nasty battle. Those who want to work for outsourcers take note.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I didn't think TSA had any routes of their "own." They were outsourcers for TWA et al. Any contracts, routes, or anything to do with TWA went into the circular file when TWA was bought on the courthouse steps.

The salient point is that any slight-of-hand "reverse" code sharing business is a clear violation of the AE and APA scope clauses. This will be proven in court.

Now . . . what is the unfortunate pilot at TSA to do? Well, first of all, stop the gloating of some of your compadres and admit collectively as a union that you don't like the position the company is placing it's pilots. Work to rule and don't do anything to inflame the situation any more. Work closely with AE and the APA for collective resolution. Striking is not an option right now. It would be an illegal strike, a violation of your contract with the company, and only damage yourselves even worse. Hopefully ALPA will grow some cajones and provide some legal and ethical guidance. This is big time politics and legalistics. I'm personally content to let the lawyers fight this out instead of our pilots. BUT, make no mistake about it, it's very important that the TSA pilot group make themselves VERY small during all this mess and not do ANYTHING to make it worse . . . legally or emotionally. This too shall pass and the majors will be hiring again. Don't do anything stupid to make yourselves persona non-grata at a future interview with the nation's largest airline.

 

[TWA Dude]

Somebody correct me if I'm wrong on this..
I heard that the TWA deal was considered an 'aquistition' and not a flat out 'purchase' due to TWA being chapter 11 and borderline chapter 7 at the time the deal went through.
If that's the case, in an 'aquistion', prior contracts do not have to be honored.

To be technical AA purchased TWA's assets out of bankruptcy court Chapter 11 Section 1113. However our pilot contract was still binding due to changes instituted after the Lorenzo/Continental debacle in the 80's: a company cannot go chapter 11 in order to void a union contract. ALPA remained the collective bargaining agent for the ex-TWA pilots until this past April, fully a year after the sale closed. The TW-ALPA chose to eliminate the Scope and Successorship clauses from our contract to preclude the possiblity of the bankruptcy judge abdicating our whole contract since it contradicted the APA's. That prevented forced arbitration from ever entering into the equation.

As far as the current discussion goes, as has been stated AMR re-negotiated all the code-sharing stuff anew.

 

[skippy22]

Think

Just a simple thing. Unless any of us are managment, I think we are all getting upset with the wrong people. I am furloughed from AE, and I have a friend who will get his job back b/c of this. I don't hate him at all! I understand that we are all just trying to do our jobs, and some lucked out with better companies. Some with bad ones. Don't be bad at eachother, realize whos doing this.

 

[rush]

TSA

Why should TSA pilot fill guilty and be called names. I did not break your contract. I fly airplanes, just like any other pilot, I am a member of ALPA just like the majority of airline pilots, I do my job day in and day out. I have no reason to be ashamed of what I do for living. If AE pilots can look TWA and AA pilots square in their eyes so can I. If AMR is doing what they always did, why are you acting like it is AX carriers fault. I might loose my job tomorrow so can you guys, I do not have control over my company actions neither do you over yours. If arbitrator agrees with you, great for you, I'll get another job or transfer to U side, untill then do not make your opinion a fact. Transfer and sale are two different things, althow if you want AE pilots to be transferred to TSA be my guest ( that would be a real sale). I do not like the whole deal any more then you do, and that includes AMR and U J4J ( no freaking way) we have to deal with. I do not know who did you hear gloating over this, there is nothing to gloat over. The memo we all saw from TSA is a copy of the memo I saw a year ago ( minus 4 jets). It never happened then it might not happen now. It does not affect me anyway, that said I am glad that at least some pilots are getting recalled, I wish that all of AE pilot would be back online where they belong, but if you think that being glad that you friends and co workers are comming back, is gloating, oh well sue me ( wait you already did)
I wish all the AE pilots the best, I know enough of you to know how it is there. Good luck . Fly safe.