Total time/instrument ratio

[minitour]

If you have no clue as to what the airplane is doing without referring to you flight instruments, then it's instrument flight time.

well said...this seems the easiest way to sum it up...if you have no idea because you've got a hood on, then it's simulated...if you have no idea because you can't see anything but cloud in your window, then it's actual...

-mini

 

[typhoonpilot]

I agree with the 10% rule unless you are flying in the Southwest United States then it could be lower. I also agree with Kilobase in that over water at night with no moon is definitely instrument time. I just back from Singapore this morning, landing before sun-up. Took off at night and flew over the Bay of Bengal dodging thunderstorms for the first three hours then an hour plus over India followed by flight over the Arabian Sea until Muscat. I logged that as 5 hours instrument in 7.2 total. If it is a full moon or even a good partial moon and I can make out the horizon then I wouldn't log it that way but if you can't make out the horizon how are you keeping the wings level ? The only answer is by reference to flight instruments. In the whole 7.2 hours I didn't once penetrate a cloud, yet there it is, legally logable instrument time.

I was running at the 10% level until joining my present company, now I'm closer to 12 %.


Typhoonpilot

 

[Oakum_Boy]

Isn't all time on an IFR flight plan considered "instrument time"? I think in Europe that how it is done. I think it pretty silly to only log your time spent in the clouds...

'Ooh, there, I got another .05! Nice, now aim for that one so I can get some more...'

 

[AK737FO]

interesting post

This is an interesting post - I never realized that there was a general 10% rule floating out there about IMC time vs. Total time.
I am here to tell you that this 10% WAG is not accurate. I have spent my flying career driving around the Pacific Northwest and Alaska. If I am the pilot actually flying the airplane, and I am in a clouds, then I count it as instrument time. If I am in the sunshine on top, between layers or can see enough to keep the dirty side down or if I am the NFP - then it is not instrument time in my log book.
With that said, my log book shows about 20% of my time as IMC. I never had the number questioned in any interview. I suppose if a guy comes from Arizona he might have a red flag, but a web footed pilot from the left coast is always looking at the inside of a cloud.

 

[mattpilot]

Isn't all time on an IFR flight plan considered "instrument time"? I think in Europe that how it is done. I think it pretty silly to only log your time spent in the clouds...

'Ooh, there, I got another .05! Nice, now aim for that one so I can get some more...'

I'm from europe, and no... thats not the way its done.


You don't log going into one cloud for 5 sec. But say you spend 1-2 minutes in a cloud layer (climbing or descending through it) you round that up to .1

Again ... you are free to log whatever you want. The only thing that matters in the end is whether or not your insurance company/potential employer/FAA will accept it. You can have all the opinions from different people you want, but in the end, the only one that counts is the one from the above mentioned people.

I've quoted the FAA 'legal opinion' above - so to get IFR current, you CAN'T hop into a plane in VMC conditions, do 6 approaches and call it 'current' without a view limiting device (and a safety pilot!)

 

[wheelsup]

I just want to get a feel for how everyone's total time stacks up against their instrument time. I remember reading a job posting a couple of months ago for a corporate shuttle CRJ in Houston. The mins were 4000 total and 500 instrument.

I'm guessing that would fit under the old cliche - "fly what you can, log what you need".

Just kidding folks. Just kidding.

And really, as long as your instrument time isn't crazyily out of wack, who is really gonna know if you were in the clouds or not? The FAA isn't gonna pull the weather from 2 years ago to see if your flight from A to B was really IMC or not. You're only cheating yourself if you log things that aren't true.

~wheelsup

 

[troy]

#1 rule--use common sense.

#2 rule--if in doubt, use common sense, not a loophole or other far fetched interpetration of the FAR's. It's you that has to do the explaining if questioned.

 

[Uncle Sparky]

This is an interesting post - I never realized that there was a general 10% rule floating out there about IMC time vs. Total time.
I am here to tell you that this 10% WAG is not accurate. .

I think you're misunderstanding it. Think of the claimed "10% average" as the number a potential employer might use and nothing more. ie: If I'm an employer and I have a particular applicant that has 2,000 total and 500 actual logged, through the process of simple math I'm probably going to dig a little deeper on this particular guy. That's all. The idea that you log every minute of an IFR filed flight as IMC just on the grounds of the type of flight plan is ludicrous. My logbook has a column that says actual instrument.
Actual-existing in fact; real..........I do agree with the statements about not having to be in the clouds to log IMC. If you read the definition: ...only for that flight time when the person operates the aircraft solely by reference to instruments... ....it's really up to the integrity of the individual. I can say, without a doubt, that there have been many instances where I wasn't in the clouds but had to maintain "wings level" using just the instruments: in the clear on a moonless night.......flying over water in a heavy haze(but with several miles of flight visibility)......flying in the clear between cloud layers........flying into a sunrise/sunset.......flying below a cloud layer when rain is falling etc. etc.........

 

[Daveman]

I concur with Uncle S.

 

[Dodge]

If you are cruising along at FL330 and their is a solid layer under you from CLE to all the way to DEN, is still doesn't count as "sole reference to instruments." You still have a horizon out there. Now, I agree that you can't find I-70, but ya need to be in the clouds to be logging instrument time.

Mine is about 5%. I might have more but just forget to mark it down some times.