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Time to say NO MORE

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1IDBLKJEW

Member
Joined
Sep 7, 2005
Posts
18
Hey Maaaaaaan Sammy-D here,

Here’s a dumb question for everyone. When the heck is the first ALPA pilot group going to stand up and say NO! Cast a strike vote, and just walk out. This is ridiculous. I am ashamed to wear the pin. We have lost all credibility and leverage as a union. We are a complete joke.

It was one thing to pitch in and INVEST in our airlines (mismanagement) as a show of good faith and as a business deal after 9/11 by taking temporary concessions. Those should have been considered loans and there should have been a return on those investments. Those days of professional generosity are over. Now most ALPA carriers have been through their second or third round of concessions, not to mention SO LONG retirement. At this point it is extortion and union busting, and we are bending over and taking it. I think the 1113 motions are going to be common place. Next stop Delta and NWA.

Every ALPA carrier’s management knows how spineless we are so they just keep going for more because they know that they can threaten, intimidate and get it. This is thanks in part to the fact that the senior pilots (who by the way negotiated most of these CBA’s) stand to lose the most by walking out. So I guess there will be more yet to come. Maybe as soon as the captains are down to FO wages we will realize that its time to say enough is enough.

I have been a supporter of ALPA and, have benefited from my membership all these years, but at what price. Considering the condition of the industry, and how badly we have ALLOWED ourselves to get beaten up, I think 2% of my salary, 3 furloughs, several concessionary contracts and the past 5 years of my life is too much. And I am one of the lucky ones. I guess I expect more from my dues that just a seniority number and a lawyer if I get my pee pee spanked.

When Boeing engineers didn’t get a good deal after a few months, they shut Boeing down and came to an agreement. Pilot group’s talk big to the media, then eventually succumb to threats, intimidation and cave in after months and months. What kind of collective bargaining it that. Face it we are wimps. No one is willing to call their bluff and stop this downward spiral. Does everyone really think the airlines are just going to shut down and file ch. 7 if we walk out????? That is pathetic.

I think ATA had a great opportunity recently to let management have it by voting no on the last concessionary TA. They cast a strike vote when mgmt filed the 1113 motion; did anyone ever even hear the results of that? No. Instead they passed the TA with 59% and 15% of the pilots didn’t even vote. That’s pretty sad. They should have walked out. They know this isn’t going to save the airline.

Time to call their bluff people. Time to say no. ALPA at the national level should be intervening at this point and advising all locals to say no more. Otherwise Time to branch off and start over on our own.
 
1IDBLKJEW said:
Does everyone really think the airlines are just going to shut down and file ch. 7 if we walk out?????
Some will. Do you want it to be yours?

Unable to take the initiative, ALPA is now in full-time damage-control mode. IMHO this won't change until the economy allows it.
 
1IDBLKJEW said:
... This is thanks in part to the fact that the senior pilots (who by the way negotiated most of these CBA’s) stand to lose the most by walking out.

ALPA is run by the senior piots for the senior pilots. Sometimes it's good and sometimes not so good.

If you look at the successful strikes and threatened strikes, they are in periods of good revenue or in times with prospects for immediate improvement. This time looks different to me. With jet fuel going up 43% in the last quarter, I have to wonder what leg we have to stand on.

Stand up for wages, but cut your flights by 20%, or more, due to declining ticket sales. On the flip side, management is trying to cut too deep.


I know we have heard the doom and gloom often the last couple of years, but the brokerage houses' voices are getting even louder now. They say one or more carriers are looking at Ch 7 with current economic conditions.
 
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It might be time to disband ALPA, and reform the union to include all airline employees. Pilots, flight attendants, mechanics, gate agents, rampers, fuelers. The whole lot. Yes, working under different labor contracts, but under the same goals and leadership. What the hell would management do when their entire workforce was unified under one union, say, the Air Line Employees Alliance or something like that? Flight attendants walk? Rampers walk? Everyone walks. Plus, the unity that might come from it, when the ramper pushing you back is a member of the same union as you? Someone who you shared a picket line with when management tried to rake you over the coals? Like some of the other trade unions. Ahh, pipe dream I know. Maybe in a perfect world...
 
The US Airways 170 pilots have said NO. I also do not wear the pin out of shame!

ALL OR NONE!!!
 
FlyChicaga said:
It might be time to disband ALPA, and reform the union to include all airline employees. Pilots, flight attendants, mechanics, gate agents, rampers, fuelers. The whole lot. Yes, working under different labor contracts, but under the same goals and leadership. What the hell would management do when their entire workforce was unified under one union, say, the Air Line Employees Alliance or something like that? Flight attendants walk? Rampers walk? Everyone walks. Plus, the unity that might come from it, when the ramper pushing you back is a member of the same union as you? Someone who you shared a picket line with when management tried to rake you over the coals? Like some of the other trade unions. Ahh, pipe dream I know. Maybe in a perfect world...

At least you could now raise the ticket prices.
 
FlyBoeingJets said:
If you look at the successful strikes and threatened strikes, they are in periods of good revenue or in times with prospects for immediate improvement. This time looks different to me.

Bingo. When times are good, the threat of a strike will work. Look at the DL pilots back in 2001. Times were good (or at least it appeared that way) and Mullin was afraid of a strike. So he caved to the pilots and gave them huge raises that DL could not afford.

But now times are different. If the DL pilots go on strike now, a quick liquidation of DL would occur. So unless your are willing to throw your seniority away (which most guys with any real seniority won't do), a strike isn't going to happen.
 

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