The real plan mgmt has for the future at Pinnacle

[snap145]

Can someone tell me why management should care where the Mesaba pilots are on the seniortity list? Unless SLI adjusts LONGEVITY, then the costs are basically the same if Mesaba is stapled or if Pinncale is stapled. We are all getting paid based on years of service, not where we are on the seniority list. I guess maybe a little savings having the senior pilots on the lower paying aircraft?

Also, I am not that scared of 9E leaving the table because they won't be better off on their own. This is the third time asking this on this forum, and I have yet to get a response. Are Mesaba and Colgan holding the Pinnacle pilots back from getting their "dream" contract? Would Pinnacle have more leverage negotiating on their own? Would Pinnacle benefit from a whipsaw? Okay, the last question is a new one, but it's relevant.

You are partially right but I was never suggesting that we would be better off on our own...the last six years have proved that point, I am suggesting that (sorry the truth hurts)..if 9E or anyone were to walk away from the table...it would not end well for Mesaba pilots as management would immediatley begin moving metal for the Pinnacle pilots to fly on our current horrid joke of a contract and well you can hope you get a job..believe me this is not out of the realm of possibility with this group...I dont say this as a threat to any XJ guy, its the opposite...you think we want them to whipsaw us against eachother so we can continue to negotiate a neverending contract and fly your airplanes so we can make our already embarassing staffing level even worse???? NO we dont want that for any of you or for any of us...the people you are dealing with in Memphis dont think that way...its an ego trip nothing more nothing less....make no mistake of it...

 

[snap145]

ps..i realize this is a bit doom and gloom and i think it would take ALOT of bad things to happen for either the XJ or the 9E MEC's to let this happen...my point is this...NOONE at 9e wants to see you guys get completley shafted on this deal, JCBA or not...we however dont get the same fuzzy feeling from you when you guys are all tight lipped and just respond with..."our guys have a plan and are taking care of it"...I dont care what you think you may have been through in the past 10 years with Foley..yada yada yada...it doesnt matter...Memphis is a completley different jungle and none of you have the first idea what you are dealing with here...that was then and this is now...

 

[SEVEN]

ps..i realize this is a bit doom and gloom and i think it would take ALOT of bad things to happen for either the XJ or the 9E MEC's to let this happen...my point is this...NOONE at 9e wants to see you guys get completley shafted on this deal, JCBA or not...we however dont get the same fuzzy feeling from you when you guys are all tight lipped and just respond with..."our guys have a plan and are taking care of it"...I dont care what you think you may have been through in the past 10 years with Foley..yada yada yada...it doesnt matter...Memphis is a completley different jungle and none of you have the first idea what you are dealing with here...that was then and this is now...

Before Takeoff Check please.

 

[SEVEN]

Just kidding Snapster.......we're all brothers now.

 

[snap145]

your mistaken anyways SEVEN....im on the jet...

 

[SEVEN]

your mistaken anyways SEVEN....im on the jet...

Good one. I'll be on it soon though.....this DTW Saab flying is getting rough. The 4 star Marriot in Iron Mountain, MI.....:smash:

 

[1.3XVso]

S T A P L E snap snap

 

[SEVEN]

S T A P L E snap snap

http://rushtheiceberg.com/files/2010/11/Pie-in-the-Sky-34x28in-1978-28yjgn1.jpeg

 

[CptMurf]

I for one am not scared.

I personally believe the JCBA will pass, but I'll play your game. If it doesn't and metal changes hands... Holdings would still have to honor our contract (on the XJ side), lest have a complete walkout on that side of the house. Now as many 9E guys have been pretentiously pointing out, out fragmentation policy states "offer employment." That could be at the bottom if the list, but none of our guys would leave to be year 1 day1 employees, especially under your current contract. This would cause major training event costs on that side and major unemployment benefits on out side (mgmt doesn't want this). Not to mention, how is ALPA National merger policy would/could be applied in a fragmentation.

Doesn't matter to me personally though, because I would stay on the XJ side, current contract and merge in as a Q CA with the Colgan transition, and only take a $5.00/hr paycut. So, personally, I'm not too scared. But then again I'm further up the list here.

 

[snap145]

I for one am not scared.

I personally believe the JCBA will pass, but I'll play your game. If it doesn't and metal changes hands... Holdings would still have to honor our contract (on the XJ side), lest have a complete walkout on that side of the house. Now as many 9E guys have been pretentiously pointing out, out fragmentation policy states "offer employment." That could be at the bottom if the list, but none of our guys would leave to be year 1 day1 employees, especially under your current contract. This would cause major training event costs on that side and major unemployment benefits on out side (mgmt doesn't want this). Not to mention, how is ALPA National merger policy would/could be applied in a fragmentation.

Doesn't matter to me personally though, because I would stay on the XJ side, current contract and merge in as a Q CA with the Colgan transition, and only take a $5.00/hr paycut. So, personally, I'm not too scared. But then again I'm further up the list here.

apparently your a slow reader...this is not a "game" as you say...also note the comment i made about that being a very far fetched possibility...and my comment about stopping any type of whipsaw...nice comment though...the "unity" is pouring out of your veins...

SEVEN...enjoy life with an APU my friend...you deserve it...

 

[SEVEN]

apparently your a slow reader...this is not a "game" as you say...also note the comment i made about that being a very far fetched possibility...and my comment about stopping any type of whipsaw...nice comment though...the "unity" is pouring out of your veins...

SEVEN...enjoy life with an APU my friend...you deserve it...

What's an APU?

 

[CptMurf]

apparently your a slow reader...this is not a "game" as you say...also note the comment i made about that being a very far fetched possibility...and my comment about stopping any type of whipsaw...nice comment though...the "unity" is pouring out of your veins...

SEVEN...enjoy life with an APU my friend...you deserve it...

Your far fetched possibility is a far fetched fantasy at best, and best quantified as a "game."

Unity is DEFINITELY needed here, but it comes with levels. My trust and loyalty comes in this order...
1.) God
2.) Family
3.) Friends/XJ coworkers/ XJ Union
3.a) 9E/9L Union
3.b) All other airline unions/ industry
4.) Passengers
5.) The Government
5.a) The FAA
6.) My Company

I expect 3 and 3.a to merge with the JCBA/SLI. And I would expect your list to not be too different in the top 4.

 

[Flyer1015]

What's an APU?

Always Pinnaclized in your Undies

 

[xjhawk]

Some good banter. I always like the "its not a threat but a posibility" for the transfer of assets and offering of a job (staple). I would love to see the actual dollar amount this action would cause Pinnacle and Delta. I say delta because they would be paying for a lot of canceled flights and stuck aircraft if this was announce. I for one would jump seat home or rent a car, I hope others would do the same. I also would like to know what the training cost it would take to train all 9E FO's as captains since they would be senior to the now stapled former XJ captians. Not to mention with suddenly having 60 some new aircraft overnight with more than 1/2 of the pilots quitting where will you find all these pilots? If alpa SLI took effect, and we were forced somehow to fly under 9E's 99 contract, none of my flights would go smoothly. and I am sure there would be a ALPA vote and we would strike aSAP

 

[SEVEN]

Some good banter. I always like the "its not a threat but a posibility" for the transfer of assets and offering of a job (staple). I would love to see the actual dollar amount this action would cause Pinnacle and Delta. I say delta because they would be paying for a lot of canceled flights and stuck aircraft if this was announce. I for one would jump seat home or rent a car, I hope others would do the same. I also would like to know what the training cost it would take to train all 9E FO's as captains since they would be senior to the now stapled former XJ captians. Not to mention with suddenly having 60 some new aircraft overnight with more than 1/2 of the pilots quitting where will you find all these pilots? If alpa SLI took effect, and we were forced somehow to fly under 9E's 99 contract, none of my flights would go smoothly. and I am sure there would be a ALPA vote and we would strike aSAP

Not to mention, ALL outstation aircraft would be grounded due to "mechanical irregularities."

 

[CptMurf]

Some good banter. I always like the "its not a threat but a posibility" for the transfer of assets and offering of a job (staple). I would love to see the actual dollar amount this action would cause Pinnacle and Delta. I say delta because they would be paying for a lot of canceled flights and stuck aircraft if this was announce. I for one would jump seat home or rent a car, I hope others would do the same. I also would like to know what the training cost it would take to train all 9E FO's as captains since they would be senior to the now stapled former XJ captians. Not to mention with suddenly having 60 some new aircraft overnight with more than 1/2 of the pilots quitting where will you find all these pilots? If alpa SLI took effect, and we were forced somehow to fly under 9E's 99 contract, none of my flights would go smoothly. and I am sure there would be a ALPA vote and we would strike aSAP

It's not like they can "force" us to go either... And who would? The whole Corp would crumble under the cost of transferring without a JCBA/SLI.

 

[altimaklr]

That is not the scenario. It would be a steady number of planes per month, and 9E could easily utilize simspace in YUL and STL to make it happen. A gradual draw down would avoid any mass exodus, and having 4th year 9E scale captains would quickly recoup any costs versus paying more senior pilots on the XJ scale, as well as provide a staffing source for the additional Q400's next year.

 

[CptMurf]

Always Pinnaclized in your Undies

Always Pissed about Uniting

 

[CptMurf]

That is not the scenario. It would be a steady number of planes per month, and 9E could easily utilize simspace in YUL and STL to make it happen. A gradual draw down would avoid any mass exodus, and having 4th year 9E scale captains would quickly recoup any costs versus paying more senior pilots on the XJ scale, as well as provide a staffing source for the additional Q400's next year.

You could use the sim in MSP too. Now find the bodies to sit in the seats.

 

[MACH-TUCK]

You could use the sim in MSP too. Now find the bodies to sit in the seats.

About the training center in MSP, I have recently heard (don't qoute me on it) that Pinnacle is going to try to keep it going, instead of bringing everything to MEM. I personally would love that, instead of going to MEM every six months.