The "program"

[ual727fo]

I want to first say that I appreciate the position of Skywest and Mesa pilots. I know what it must feel like having a group of pilots forced on you from the "Dark Side" (United). I came from ACA and realize that there is a struggle that comes from balancing the needs of all.

As most of you know, furloughed UAL guys have the opportunity to come in at 2nd year pay with Mesa or Skywest on an available basis. Mesa seems to be doing more classes right now and has a few more orders in for RJs, but Skywest is really where I would like to go.

I've been furloughed since January of 2003, and my wife and I just had our fourth kid (conceived before the furlough news). I could definitely use a job.

What do you think the best option is?

Again, I appreciate any help you can provide. Please resist the urge to flame (that I would have had too if it weren't me posting).

Randy

 

[grog_sit_reserv]

Skywest. Mesa is rough.

 

[ual727fo]

Coming from a Mesa guy - thanks. What is the tough part? Pay, conditions, treatment??

I took a look at the contract and noted a couple of things - the pay obviously, but also the 70 hour guarantee, the "historical" segment pay, and junior manning.

Where are most of the new hires going right now (I live in Denver, so I'm figuring out all of the commuting options)?

Randy

 

[Mr DC3]

SkyWest is a great place to work. . . The rumor is that most of the growth will be in DEN, so I'd bet that you'd be able to go there fairly soon -- if you're in the RJ. If you're assigned the Brasilia, west coast is most junior.

 

[stillaboo]

My understanding is DEN will go more junior at Mesa on the CRJ (as an FO only, since the -700's pay higher for CA's than the -200's do), and Mesa has the Dash there too. Either GJT or DEN is junior right now for the Dash, both wich would work well for you in DEN.

I'd go to Skywest myself (better contract overall, more options out of DEN), but if you do go to Mesa, try to avoid the Beech. Most FO's there are building time to move on, and, since you've already got the time to qualify for mainline, the benefit of time building would be of little value to you. The Beech lines are hard to commute to from DEN as well, since Dubois, PA and Tampa, FL are the junior Beech bases.

 

[ual727fo]

Do I understand correctly that you cannot bid to CA from FO on different types at Mesa? If you are an FO on the RJ, you can't bid to CA on the 1900?

Thanks,
Randy

 

[ual727fo]

Also, what is the future upgrade time (if such a thing still exists) at each airline?

I am very much leaning toward Skywest, but if I could upgrade faster at Mesa, that would be a consideration.

Right now, I'd be happy as a FO on the 1900 in East Jabib on a crappy night flying rubber dogsh!t into Hong Kong .

Is Skywest planning massive expansion?

The other thing that concerns me, and no judgement is being passed here, is the union side of things in the future. Mesa has the Freedom Air debacle and Skywest is non-union. How do both of these relate to any future problems? Ethically, I don't have a problem with the current situation of either airline. Freedom was in the past and has been rectified (how effectively is up for debate) and Skywest pilots are treated with respect and do not feel the need for a union at this point. Actuality and perception are two different things though, so how accurate is it to assume my name will end up on a list somewhere flying for either of these airlines?

Thanks again for all of your help!

Randy

 

[ual727fo]

Anyone?

 

[FSB99]

sorry, don't have an answer for you, don't work for either one of those airlines.. but, i have a completely off-topic question for you!
how far did ual furlough, and have they stopped furloughing?
i had a friend who i've completely lost touch with, who was hired by united in early to mid '96, and was curious if he would still be there or not.
thanks!

 

[ual727fo]

FSB99,

I honestly don't know. You can do the math probably. Here are some numbers to crunch:

I was hired in March of 2000 and furloughed January 2003. There were 1060 or so furloughed at that point.

Now, as of the end of October 2003, we will have a little over 1960 furloughed. The senior man on that furlough is from the January 4, 1999 class. That puts the November furlough (unannounced) group into 1998...

After talking with the MEC, it seems that nothing has been set in stone, but furloughs are set to continue indefinitely (and they are furloughing roughly 100 per month).

Hope that helps!

Randy

 

[MJ42]

I can help. Send me a private message.

 

[treetopflyer]

many friends at skywest, they all love it, but are all from the west coast..

 

[Full of LUV]

Four Kids

With four kids, there is no time to be a regional airline pilot. It is time to find a job to stay home a little more.

 

[Heavy Set]

I would say go for Skywest CRJ FO or wait for the EMB-170 at CHQ if that becomes an option (not sure if it is official yet). Not sure about the upgrade time on the EMB-170 - it might be awhile before CHQ would even receive an aircraft....

Have you considered fractional flying? Check out Citationshares - 7 on/7 off and you can upgrade to Captain on the Bravo reasonably soon with pay in the mid $60s once you reach Captain. Not sure whether you would have to resign your seniority or not. Check it out online!


Good luck!

 

[wanabe_fo]

FO to CA upgrade

ual727fo,
you are correct. Under Mesa's new contract you can not bid FO to CA on a different platform.

To my understanding here is how it works, If you are a prop FO, you may bid Prop CA of same type or jet CA. If you are a jet FO, you may bid jet CA.

I do not work for the company but remember reading this when their contract came out and everyone complaining about it.

 

[stillaboo]

Actuality and perception are two different things though, so how accurate is it to assume my name will end up on a list somewhere flying for either of these airlines?

A list?! Man, you took the ball and ran with it on this one! Nobody at either Mesa or Skywest is on any kind of list (b/c of their employment there, at least - what they might have done in the past is 'listable'). At Freedom, if you went before the ALPA contract, you ARE on a list, guaranteed. Even flying a Freedom jet now forces you to wear the Freedom ID and wings, and for some guys, they don't reference a list, they just deny the badge outright, regardless of whether you supported Freedom or not.

Good news for those going to Mesa on the 'Freedom front'. Freedom is not currently planning any new-hire classes (Mesa is starting about 40 guys per week in GS right now, and Air Midwest is keeping their training dept. full too), and Mesa just took delivery of its first 900 and 2 former F8 -700's have been transfered over to the Mesa certificate from Freedom (UAX flying looks like it will be YV only, no F8). While -700's and -900's are both a bit too big for a regional IMO, at least they're not at Freedom or Republic (any other alter-ego contract end-arounds out there?)!