Hoo Boy
Cardinal said:
..."Or join the corporate ranks and drive down the salaries where so many arrogant anti-unionists call home."...
This has to be the funniest, most ill-informed statement I've seen in months.
The superior pay and benefit packages in the corporate world among Fortune 100 flight departments was achieved over the decades by demonstrating the value and worth of what they offer to the company, and negotiating accordingly with an eye to what the coporate "industry standard" has been. Salaries have almost never failed to rise, and applicants who offer to "do it for less" in the naive hope that it will elevate their chances are quickly shown the door by the Department Manager. For one thing, it shows that the applicant doesn't know jack about the world of corporate flying, hasn't bothered to find out what type of wages are standard, or the relationship between a company's management and it's pilots.
And there's more than a little irony in your statement given recent history, you being a die-hard, airline unionist and all (although it probably pre-dates your experience so you wouldn't remember). I'll provide some: Beginning about 10 years ago the fractionals began expanding rapidly, hiring gobs of pilots to fly corporate-type aircraft in a quasi-corporate operation. In many ways, competing with established corporate flight departments.
In large part, these newbie fractional pilots were drawn from the regional airline pilot ranks (ALPA members or wannabes), hundreds of them..pilots in search of stepping-stone jet time to make themselves competitive in their race for a mainline job, since back then the regionals were operating only turboprops like Brasilias, Jetstreams, and of course the venerable Beech 1900.
In their breathtaking ignorance, these "union-boys" accepted these jobs flying the exact same equipment on the same type of missions as their bona-fide corporate counterparts, but for about HALF THE PAY as what the corporate world industry standard was. And for the "privelege" of making these ridiculously sub-standard wages, they PFT-ed (and still sign training contracts) for their SIC check-outs...something unheard of in the corporate world for anything but a shoestring, laughingstock operation.
But by far the funniest thing was hearing them yakking in FBO lounges, about how GREAT it was while trying to recruit coporate pilots to join their ranks (I always wondered if they got a free set of steak knives or something if they succeeded). In their minds, the big "cherry-on-top" was the fact they were...(drum roll/roll eyes)...UNIONIZED!
("So let me get this straight. I can go to work for HALF the salary I make now, pay 10K for an SIC check-out on an aircraft I'm already typed in, and best of all, chip in another percentage for union dues for those that set up this stellar deal? Gee, where do I sign up, Sparky?"). Ya just wanted to pat the them on their head and send them on their way.
Such was, and continues to be, the record of unionized pilots in the corporate arena. To me, it sounds exactly what a SCAB is accused of in the airline world, doesn't it?
The basic truth is this, Cardinal; the poster who you directed your salvo at hasn't the experience (yet) to be competetive for being hired in the Fortune 100 corporate world, and judging by your profile, neither do you. In these unfortunate days however, plenty of out-of-work, former ALPA etc., airline pilots do (in terms of hours). Sadly and ironically, either through sheer ignorance or because they think none of their "bretheren" are looking, many of them now are out there right now in the non-unionized corporate world advertising they will "do it for less". Don't think it's true of your brothers? think again. When I did the hiring at a corporate flight department I saw plenty of them, and those applications that offered to "do it for less" than the industry standard for the type of aircraft we flew were the first one's in the trash can. Frankly, the record of airline pilots negotiating their own wages in the corporate world sucks.
It might be wise to clean up your own house on the issue before making broad-brush statements about a group being "arrogant", given that you've never even been inside their house in the first place. I've been inside yours, however, and it ain't all that tidy on the arrogance front.
WTF? First of all, I am NOT a product of Gulfstream, thank you very much. And yes, I am in fact quite familiar with the Railway Labor Act of 1916. As for my relative youth, I am honest enough to present what I am and what I am not to the whole forum, whereas you hide behind a veil. There are 737 captains who don't have a clue about economics and labor relations, and there are Twin Otter pilots in Alaska who could write a book on the very same issues. I've had an intimate view of the industry for my entire life, and have personally witnessed what happens when a picket line is crossed and the longer term consequences of such an action. I have resolved never to succumb to weakness in that manner, and to endeavor to prevent others from making the same mistake.
