The Deal

[waveflyer]

I think the point is there is a LOT of mis-trust of ALPA in this process. They've already recalled an alpa ideologue who continues to poison the well all over the internet, so it's not an altogether irrational concern. If alpa can drag this out another year- they will collect another $4,000,000 in dues, in addition to any good will they earn with other member airlines who want to see them stick it to SWA in any way they can. We lobby for a vote from the membership bc we want the lineholders to have their say and not alpa paid lawyers w/ undo influence.
Delta has a fledgling card campaign to rid themselves of DALPA- if everything goes smooth with us and we put competitive pressure on delta in ATL, what will that mean for alpa.
There's an undeniable conflict of interest and if I were an AT lineholder I'd want to make sure ulterior motives didn't have precedence over my career and money. If lineholders vote this down and it goes south, that's a whole lot easier todeal with than a frontier situation where they clearly got sold out.

 

[Empennage]

Uh, that's the point, if thier opinion is that it's a good deal, we'll vote on it. If not, we won't. That's the point in having a merger/negotiating committee as opposed to all 7000 of us duking it out for position. Isn't it the same with you guys? Would your NC put out a proposal for a vote that in their opinion was not a good deal for you guys?

That is really not the point, at least not in an absolute sense. In many cases it many be and I acknowledge this. However, the MEC has the ability to send out a package for membership ratification with a positive or negative recommendation. Meaning, it is up to the membership to vote and decided on the aforementioned product. Obviously this comes after some sort of education campaign which is vital to the vote.

Long story short, it may be better in the long run if the pilot group, as a whole, decides its future, versus a few elected representatives. Especially in light of something extremely substantial and of great importance.

 

[On Your Six]

It's complicated Luv2BFlying but in general yes, our BOD would only put out a good deal UNLESS... they felt the deal was the "best" offer considering the complicated environment, ie. legal issues, company issues, and career implications but wasn't necessarily what they expected everyone to call "good" and then they would put it out with all the pros & cons and say "we need you to decide now how we move forward because this is too critical."

The problem I think you'll find is that AirTran expectations aren't realistic in many ways, and that is frankly the fault of ALPA who has spent 6 months promising things that won't ever be delivered, not by SWAPA, not by a law, not by a contract, not by an arbitrator, and most certainly not by Gary Kelly and SWA. Based on everything I know about my company, what makes it unique, is our company will not allow our existing pilots to suffer delayed upgrades and the accompanying loss in pay, along with slowed progression in
QOL to insert acquired pilots ahead of them, pilots already getting in some cases 80% pay and benefit raises along with massively improved QOL in terms of days off, domicile selection, work rules and so on. They won't allow it, and they will do whatever it takes in the end to protect us.

Someday I hope to see AirTran pilots as SWA pilots because when that happens, SWA will protect them and care for them in the same way. I LUV my company because they treat us like family.

Talk about propaganda. Wow, this guy is nuts. Listen, you will get what the arbitrators award you. That's it. They will decide what is fair and what isn't. GK wants the deal done, and he could just point at the award and say his hands are tied. Get over yourselves.


OYS

 

[On Your Six]

That is really not the point, at least not in an absolute sense. In many cases it many be and I acknowledge this. However, the MEC has the ability to send out a package for membership ratification with a positive or negative recommendation. Meaning, it is up to the membership to vote and decided on the aforementioned product. Obviously this comes after some sort of education campaign which is vital to the vote.

Long story short, it may be better in the long run if the pilot group, as a whole, decides its future, versus a few elected representatives. Especially in light of something extremely substantial and of great importance.

Absolutely. If you don't like the NC's deal, vote it down and make them go to arbitration. Seniority is forever. Yes, you could merge again with someone, but guys on the current list will be either ahead or behind you, until they retire. You deserve what is FAIR, and arbitrators can decide that without having any conflicts of interest.


OYS

 

[saabcaptain]

and the deal is NOW DONE AND AGREED ON and you'll get to vote on it and we will see if what ALPA promised so long ago is the solution. its your career, vote as you wish.

 

[Daddy]

Absolutely. If you don't like the NC's deal, vote it down and make them go to arbitration. Seniority is forever. Yes, you could merge again with someone, but guys on the current list will be either ahead or behind you, until they retire. You deserve what is FAIR, and arbitrators can decide that without having any conflicts of interest.


OYS

So said the guy who has absolutely NO skin in the game

 

[Ace McCoy]

The deal is done. If it still has the airtran FO's being stapled I don't need to see anything else. Voting NO

 

[saabcaptain]

Every airline goes through this, including SWA. We have in the past had some "unpopular" deals where "everyone" said they would vote "no" but magically it passes by 75%+. I predict both sides vote heavily in favor but many on both sides, well over 50% say they voted "no" when cockpit complaining to the guy/girl next to them.

 

[On Your Six]

So said the guy who has absolutely NO skin in the game

Am I making a decision for anyone? Anyone can give advice, but seniority is forever. I can see why some people on here are nervous. My advice is get a fair deal, which may come from arbitration.


OYS

 

[On Your Six]

The deal is done. If it still has the airtran FO's being stapled I don't need to see anything else. Voting NO

You bet. If it isn't good, vote it down, and take it to arbitration if you need to. Look at recent awards, you might do better. Godspeed!


OYS

 

[amF16]

The deal is done. If it still has the airtran FO's being stapled I don't need to see anything else. Voting NO

We tried to tell Gary no once, it cost us 50 million dollars from TA1 to TA2.

 

[Empennage]

Absolutely. If you don't like the NC's deal, vote it down and make them go to arbitration. Seniority is forever. Yes, you could merge again with someone, but guys on the current list will be either ahead or behind you, until they retire. You deserve what is FAIR, and arbitrators can decide that without having any conflicts of interest.


OYS

It's over oys. Done.

I'll add this is what can be accomplished with leadership from above and hard work on both sides.

Oys, we will accept your congratulatons whenever you like.

My Airtran brothers, welcome aboard. It's a great day for us all! This is very impressive.

 

[The Prussian]

OYS...here's the dealio....GO HOME,..you're not wanted here!

 

[On Your Six]

It's over oys. Done.

I'll add this is what can be accomplished with leadership from above and hard work on both sides.

Oys, we will accept your congratulatons whenever you like.

My Airtran brothers, welcome aboard. It's a great day for us all! This is very impressive.

Thanks, it hasn't been approved yet. Save the accolades until it's over. And, if it is done, then there is a good chance it will be fair, with AT guys mixed in with Corndogs. Great!


OYS

 

[On Your Six]

OYS...here's the dealio....GO HOME,..you're not wanted here!

Public forum. Create your own. Good luck with that, and I can't wait to hear specifics about the SLI.


OYS

 

[Empennage]

Thanks, it hasn't been approved yet. Save the accolades until it's over. And, if it is done, then there is a good chance it will be fair, with AT guys mixed in with Corndogs. Great!


OYS

Oys the point is the process did work. Many of us knew what we were talking about. We believe in who we are, what we do and who we work for. Additionally we want Airtran and their people. We believe in them too and want them to be as much as our future as they want us to be theirs. One luv (yea cheesy). It's one future.

You continue to flame at will. Unprofessional and immature

 

[Empennage]

Thanks, it hasn't been approved yet. Save the accolades until it's over. And, if it is done, then there is a good chance it will be fair, with AT guys mixed in with Corndogs. Great!


OYS

The Airtran and Southwest pilots are still waiting for your congrats. I'm sorry, the Southwest pilots are still waiting for your congrats.

With LUV

 

[Crash Pad]

The deal is done. If it still has the airtran FO's being stapled I don't need to see anything else. Voting NO

HAHAHA you got so fixated on seniority that you missed the real negotiation. Read up on fences and seat locks. In ten years you will wish for a staple.

That said... Lets do this thing. GK can't create growth with all this uncertainty!
(Wave here is a wink... I know how much you love Republican talking points)

 

[hairball1173]

Awesome News!!! I got the first round :beer:

 

[titan1]

Talk about propaganda. Wow, this guy is nuts. Listen, you will get what the arbitrators award you. That's it. They will decide what is fair and what isn't. GK wants the deal done, and he could just point at the award and say his hands are tied. Get over yourselves.


OYS

You will hate working here homeboy!

 

[flynvixen]

Talk about propaganda. Wow, this guy is nuts. Listen, you will get what the arbitrators award you. That's it. They will decide what is fair and what isn't. GK wants the deal done, and he could just point at the award and say his hands are tied. Get over yourselves.


OYS

Hey Six.......talk about brainwashed all I hear from the Clampetts is arbitration arbitration arbitration...........did you not read the part that says if we dont like the the arbitrated SLI we don't have to get in bed with you ???? tell me did you read that part or is that one of the parts the your savior ALPA forgot to brief you on.??????

I would say you are getting a better deal with this one than you fools could ever get from any arbitrator.

We will see how you guys work out in the future as SWA pilots, so far what I have seen is a bunch of spoiled cry babies that won the lottery by accident and now stand around with your hands out like common street people demanding more.

As is stands now I hope you guys vote this deal down so we can sh%%$#T can all of you and get back to bringing on pilots with real class and top shelf aviation credentials instead of the JV squad that this sh^%#t sandwich will force on us.

STAPLE STAPLE

 

[titan1]

Oys the point is the process did work. Many of us knew what we were talking about. We believe in who we are, what we do and who we work for. Additionally we want Airtran and their people. We believe in them too and want them to be as much as our future as they want us to be theirs. One luv (yea cheesy). It's one future.

You continue to flame at will. Unprofessional and immature

So you are one of the "one luv " lanyard guys! Speak for yourself. WE aint accurate son! Not one SWA pilot has ever dreamed of going to tranny, not one. They are what they are, a place to build time. Are there any SWA guys in the pool at tranny? Not. Why? Yep!

 

[RLAblows]

So you are one of the "one luv " lanyard guys! Speak for yourself. WE aint accurate son! Not one SWA pilot has ever dreamed of going to tranny, not one. They are what they are, a place to build time. Are there any SWA guys in the pool at tranny? Not. Why? Yep!

Is this the "culture" everyone keeps referencing? If so, every airline has this.

 

[Frequency]

Vixen, OYS is not an Airtran pilot. I believe he is a Delta pilot. Lets get this behind us and move on. ONE LUV.

 

[OldManPilot]

Hey Six.......talk about brainwashed all I hear from the Clampetts is arbitration arbitration arbitration...........did you not read the part that says if we dont like the the arbitrated SLI we don't have to get in bed with you ???? tell me did you read that part or is that one of the parts the your savior ALPA forgot to brief you on.??????

I would say you are getting a better deal with this one than you fools could ever get from any arbitrator.

We will see how you guys work out in the future as SWA pilots, so far what I have seen is a bunch of spoiled cry babies that won the lottery by accident and now stand around with your hands out like common street people demanding more.

As is stands now I hope you guys vote this deal down so we can sh%%$#T can all of you and get back to bringing on pilots with real class and top shelf aviation credentials instead of the JV squad that this sh^%#t sandwich will force on us.

STAPLE STAPLE

Wow, you must be a real joy to fly with.

 

[The Prussian]

Caution, everybody...many involved in these discussions are not who they say they are, but instead are trying to drive emotions in opposite directions, to further their own cause.

 

[SWA/FO]

Congrats to Air Tran Aviators and SWAPA Aviators... You guys are going to really like coming to work, and like the scheduling and flexibility that comes with it. Maybe you guys can teach us how to use a intercom switch properly.

 

[Flyer1015]

OYS = General Lee = Airtran pilot. Not Delta.

 

[Ty Webb]

We will see how you guys work out in the future as SWA pilots, so far what I have seen is a bunch of spoiled cry babies that won the lottery by accident and now stand around with your hands out like common street people demanding more.

As is stands now I hope you guys vote this deal down so we can sh%%$#T can all of you and get back to bringing on pilots with real class and top shelf aviation credentials instead of the JV squad that this sh^%#t sandwich will force on us.

STAPLE STAPLE

When the parties started this marathon, I decided to stay out of this discussion entirely, because I thought it best to let the MC/NC do what we have asked them to do and work out an agreement. As someone very visible on FI, I thought it best to avoid the appearance of representing the opinions of AirTran pilots.

This post, by Flynvixen, is an insult to ALL of us (AAI, SW, SWAPA).

Flynvixen, you obviously have some serious, deep-seated emotional problems. I have no idea how you made it through the hiring process, but you are an embarassment to ALL of us. You are a real scumbag, no matter whose uniform you wear.

 

[Bobby Orr 4]

When the parties started this marathon, I decided to stay out of this discussion entirely, because I thought it best to let the MC/NC do what we have asked them to do and work out an agreement. As someone very visible on FI, I thought it best to avoid the appearance of representing the opinions of AirTran pilots.

This post, by Flynvixen, is an insult to ALL of us (AAI, SW, SWAPA).

Flynvixen, you obviously have some serious, deep-seated emotional problems. I have no idea how you made it through the hiring process, but you are an embarassment to ALL of us. You are a real scumbag, no matter whose uniform you wear.

Agreed.