Test Questions

[bomberbubba]

Ok all you dispatchers......and pilots feel free to chime in.....lets see what you know! And you better be able to back it up!!!


Part 121 domestic operations. Destination alternate requirements


Senario: Flight scheduled to depart at 2020z and scheduled to arrive destination at 2159z


Destination forecast

KXXX 241858Z 241918 34012G22KT P6SM SCT025 BKN050
TEMPO 2024 6SM -SHRA OVC025
FM0000 33016G25KT P6SM SCT025 OVC035
TEMPO 0004 5SM -SHRASN OVC025
FM0600 34014G23KT P6SM BKN035 PROB30 0610-SHSN
FM1200 31015G25KT P6SM SCT040


Destination SA's

METAR KXXX 241745Z 05009KT 10SM BKN085 BKN120 14/06 A2985
METAR KXXX 241850Z 06008KT 10SM BKN100 12/06 A2987
METAR KXXX 241955Z 02021G25KT 10SM SCT065 10/05 A2986
METAR KXXX 242055Z 01021G27KT 10SM BKN012 OVC038 06/03 A2990
METAR KXXX 242155Z 36017G23KT 2 1/2SM BR OVC008 03/02 A2995
METAR KXXX 242255Z 36017G25KT 10SM OVC010 01/M01 A2999

Questions: 1. Is an alternate required for dispatch release of this flight?
2. Is an alternate required to be placed on this flight after it is enroute?
3. Is the dispatcher required to notify the capt of the changing conditions?
4. Is the capt required to notify dispatch of the changing conditions?
5. Is there a safety of flight issue with this flight?

If im missing any information for you to formulate your answers just ask and i will provide other details.

 

[atrdriver]

I'll try. 1. No. 2. No. 3. Yes. 4. No. 5. Possibly, depending on what runways are available ar the destination.

But, the 2155Z metar is unlikely, unless the obstruction to VIS is rain of some sort, as mist or fog is fairly unlikely with winds gusting to 23. Possible, but unlikely.

 

[atrdriver]

whoops....double post....

 

[bomberbubba]

With regards to your answer to #5. Destination has ILS Rwy 1 with 200 and 1/2 mins. No notams of any outages.

Also that 2155z hourly was actual wx conditions

 

[bomberbubba]

Come on people....I need your opinions

 

[bomberbubba]

I'll try. 1. No. 2. No. 3. Yes. 4. No. 5. Possibly, depending on what runways are available ar the destination.

But, the 2155Z metar is unlikely, unless the obstruction to VIS is rain of some sort, as mist or fog is fairly unlikely with winds gusting to 23. Possible, but unlikely.

OK atrdriver thanks for your answers. Now let me throw in that the first person to notice wx going down was actually the pilot on initial call to the tower about 1/2 hour earlier than when the 2155z wx became available to the dispatcher. Does that change your answers to #3 and #4?

 

[Blucher]

OK atrdriver thanks for your answers. Now let me throw in that the first person to notice wx going down was actually the pilot on initial call to the tower about 1/2 hour earlier than when the 2155z wx became available to the dispatcher. Does that change your answers to #3 and #4?

Where are you going with this? ATR is your only responder because he's correct. Would a courtesy call be in order from the pilot to the dispatcher to let them know for future flights heading there? Yes. Is it required? No. If the dispatcher knows about the weather prior to the flight getting there is he required to attempt to contact the crew? Yes...but perhaps he/she didn't see it, was busy getting another coffee, was on flightinfo.com. Again, what's your point? Was there volcanic ash involved or something? With what's been presented this doesn't even strike me as a particularly tricky approach.

-Blucher

 

[bomberbubba]

Blucher-Ok in my original post I said you better be able to back it up. So Blucher here is your chance to shine!! Why is it required for the dispatcher to notify the crew of the change in wx but NOT required for the pilot to notify the dispatcher??? Would you want to be notified if you were dispatched to an airport without an alternate and the sa wx enroute changed to 2 1/2 and BKN019??? Would you now want an alternate??? If you say YES your full of sh!t!! Usually when the crew gets the atis it is going to be more current than what is being presented in the hourly’s to the dispatcher. I guess my point is why would the crew or the dispatcher have to call the other at all??? Is there a safety of flight issue with this situation? Your right really nothing tricky about this approach. A freshly certificated instrument rated private pilot could probably handle this one! One would think that an airline transport pilot flying under 121 regs surely would have no problem with this one.....one would think!!! Here is the real issue: I had a capt ASAP me for not calling him up enroute to notify him of the wx that had changed and for not adding an alternate to him!! I’m not sure if you are familiar with the ASAP program or if your company is a member but how it is suppose to work is that it allows the crews to identify safety related issues without worrying about any repercussions within certain guidelines. I am trying to figure out why this capt felt that this situation constituted a safety issue for him to write up an ASAP report against me???? When working up the release and looking at the wx there was no alternate required and no where in the regs does it say that, "should the hourly wx change while a flight is enroute to now require an alternate as if the flight were being released, that one needs to be listed." It’s not like we can do air-refueling!!! Now if the wx went down to below landing minimums that would be a whole different ballgame! I really don’t want to get into what ifs....but rather the actual conditions for this situation. I have babbled on way to long...I guess I was just trying to get a consensus on what some other airplane drivers at other companies thought of this situation? Whether they thought that this capt had a legitimate grip?

P.S. The ASAP ERC (which is made up of a pilot union rep, faa rep, and a company rep) wanted to have the chief dispatcher take me off line for being incompetent. They also felt that I needed some recurrent training before being allowed to dispatch again. Obviously I feel this whole thing is bullsh!t!!! Everything with this flight was legal and in no way was there ever a safety of flight issue! If there was, then the pilot should have never continued to a destination that he thought was unsafe! 121.627

So here are my answers:
1.NO
2.NO
3.NO
4.NO
5.NO

Bomberbubba

 

[Blucher]

Ok

BomberB,

Understood. Personally, no, I wouldn't haven't gone after you the way that Captain did. As I said, yes, at our company per 121.601c, the dispatcher must notify the crew about any significant changes in weather. However, as I also said, who knows if the dispatcher (in this case you) even knew about the change (it would appear you didn't). Don't know what happens at your company, but I know at mine they don't just assign one flight per dispatcher, so generally those guys/gals have a full plate. The reason I say the crew doesn't HAVE to notify the dispatcher is because it looks like it was rapidly blowing through and it was coming up on the ATIS anyway for any future flights headed in there. Still, a courtesy call probably would have been in order from them to you. Frankly, I think you just ran into a real jerk of a captain. Sorry to hear it, please don't let that one guy taint how you feel about the rest of us. The vast majority of pilots out there absolutely cherish their dispatchers, and know how much nicer you make our lives for us. For this guy to go after you like this seems odd to me. If you can, look into his personal situation a bit and I bet you'll find the answer. Here are my top 3 guesses:
1) Wife/Husband leaving him/her
2) His/Her flying skills suck (this is THE most common reason for Cpt's to be jerks to FO's)
3) Generally miserable with his/her life
Ask around the grapevine at your company and I bet he/she's already got a rep. Good luck, and thank you (all dispatchers) for looking out for us.

-Blucher:beer:

 

[ImbracableCrunk]

Maybe the captain was sick of being dispatched to KXXX with only 2200ish pounds of fuel.

And maybe when the captain called last time for an alternate, he had a dispatcher sigh and say "You don't need an alternate!" And the captain had to twist his arm just to add one. And the captain ended up going around numerous thunderstorms and was this close to declaring Min Fuel, even though he "didn't need an alternate."

Plus, you've got two good alternates 15 minutes away. Had you noticed the weather change, would you have called them and advised them?

(No, I'm not involved in any way.)