Take Hornet Drvr off the SWA list

[Switch Monkey]

Folks, I've had a hard time deciding, but after two years of deliberation, I've decided to stay as a "Switch Monkey" at FEDEX. I wish I could have worked with the folks at SWA, and hope that my vacancy will open a door for someone who wants to be there. Best of luck to all of the poolies!

PS my former name was Hornet Drvr!

 

[LiveFreeorDie]

Must have been tough choice

Good luck with your career. Thanx for the info.

 

[raiders#1]

Hey, good luck to you hope everthing workout for you.. thanks for the info this will help guys like me in the pool for planning purposes...

Oakland rules, im out

 

[klhoard]

Hey Switch Monkey. . . .

I bet you're a joy to crawl into the Boeing cockpit with at 3 am. . . . .

 

[Falconjet]

?

Keith: I'm not sure, but I hope you meant that in a good way. It reads kind of sarcastic though, or maybe that is just me.

FJ

 

[KTHornet]

Say it isn't so...

Good luck brother...I'm sure you've gotten used to a little seniority. It was an easier decision for me to leave FedEx for SWA when I had only been there for 4 months. Can't go wrong either way unless you are still staying in Hank's crash pad!

Fight's On!

KT

 

[SWAbigdaddy]

Too bad we can't trade seats and keep our senority!!

I think you'll have a more rewarding career at FedEx.

Good Luck!

 

[canyonblue]

Too bad we can't trade pilots. I'd trade SWAbigdaddy for a couple of Snickers bars and a can of YooHoo!

 

[Bake]

Too bad we can't trade seats and keep our senority!!

I think you'll have a more rewarding career at FedEx.

Good Luck!



SWAbigdaddy, just wondering what would make it more rewarding? MONEY, you probably would make more money flying a career at FedEx. However, if is a challenge you are looking for I think you are mistaken. Neither SWA nor FedEx flying is challenging. Yes, you can go international and fly bigger planes but that ain't no big deal. Just curious what you think is rewarding.


Bake

 

[Falconjet]

Seniority?

I don't think seniority is the issue for Switch Monkey. He is only about 100 numbers from the bottom at FedEx, (since we haven't hired in almost a year and a half) and at best it looks like we MIGHT hire 100 or so this year. That would leave him 200 from the bottom of about 4400 pilots.

If he took his impending class date at SW he would be in front of about 150 other poolies and 143 or so who have yet to interview, assuming the 393 new hires for 2004 is a good number. It could actually be more, could be a few less. But for argument sake, lets say its about 400, so he would have about 300 pilots below him in a pilot group of about 4400-4500.

Seniority is only as good as the number of pilots behind you (ask a 16 year veteran of USAirways) (not a slam or flame, just an example to illustrate my point) so in just under a year with projected hiring at SW and optimistic, rumored hiring projections at FedEx, he would actually be more "senior" more quickly by going to SW.

SW is also positioned favorably in their marketplace for continued growth (and thus more hiring) in the near future (future downturns or attacks notwithstanding) so there will almost certainly be a steady stream of new hires to continue to push him up the seniority ladder in the next few years.

I don't see any rapid growth in the marketplace for FedEx (international being a big exception - but as the old timers at FedEx love to say that if management could find a way to build a bridge to China all of our international freight would go by truck) so there will likely be less hiring in the next few years than there will be at SW.

This is one situation where an individual has the rare opportunity to make a lateral or maybe even an upward mobility type move between major airlines. This is one of the many things that keeps me up at night as I wrestle with the exact same decision, and has for almost exactly 2 years. You can be sure its not an easy decision, and if you are fortunate enough to have the option you owe it to yourself and your family to make the best decision you can and then move ahead.

The scenario reminds me of an old Chinese proverb that goes something like this: A man with many clocks never knows what time it is. A man with one clock ALWAYS knows what time it is. If you have only one option, its easy to make the right choice. If you have many (or 2) options, you will never know which was the right one (until you retire).


Anybody with a watch feel like telling me what time it is?

Thanks, FJ

 

[SWA/FO]

SWA baby!!!! Daytime flying!! The best FA's in the industry!! Best airplane paint job!! No middle of the night sort. Quality of Life, baby! 1-2-3..

Just kidding dude, you made the right decison for You....

 

[AlbieF15]

this might sound dumb...

Try jumpseating a trip or two in Jan/Feb off season. Fly a trip or two indicative of what you would be doing. See what you like (and don't) about the job. Obviously, you'll be in the back, not in the cockpit, but between goes you can eat with your SWA bros, go get another JS pass, and hang with them all day.

Don't get a super senior trip (like our OAK-Fresno run), but don't pummel yourself with a 6 legger if you only do one of those a month or so at SWA...your bros can steer you right.

I was tied in knots 2 years ago wondering if I should go to Jetblue or Fedex. Well...a few offline commutes later, I realized how nice deviation bank money and a company jumpseat can be to a commuter. Knowing how hard getting back and forth to JFK from NW Fla would be, I am a lot less torn looking back. However, if I had decided to move to MCO, or if you decided to move to PHX, HOU, MCO, etc the choice might be more difficult.

The FAs at this hotel last night were not that young and could not really be called "hotties"...seemed older than average. However, they still had that nice SWA smile and attitude. As a married guy with 3 daughters, the lack of FAs around is not an issue. Yeah...I'd likely be just as loyal if I were somewhere else, but my wife has one less thing to worry about when I'm on the road. When you share a hotel with a pax crew, you also get to see the "cat herder" mentaility that pax pilots sometimes have to adopt trying to get their crew of 5, 6, or even 7 folks to the transportation on time. Not a big deal really but certainly something we don't deal with a FDX. On the other hand, you and I play FA a bit when we grab meals and coffee...

No kidding FJ...I'd hit the road for a 3-4 trip, maybe a couple of times, and take a good hard look. I know it won't help you sleep, but either way you go you'll have some good folks around you and one of the better businesses in America today behind you.

Good luck.

 

[G4G5]

I have to agree with Albie. Try it and se if you can deal with that type of life style. It's all about your personality. I too had to make a similar decision. I found solice in asking myself the difficult questions.

Can you deal with flying the same type of equipment for the rest of your career?
Taking a job knowing that I would be starting and retiring in the same piece of equipment was not for me. For some they love the idea of just having to learn one type.

Can you deal with only flying in the greater 48?
I need variety. I would sooner have the ability to fly to new different places. This was more important then upgrade time to me. The ability to fly to Tokyo or Rome was more important then how fast I got to the left seat. For some it's the other way around. I have flown with plenty of folks who never want to leave the US. Or the quicker to the left seat the better.

Can you deal with the LCC mentality?
SWA is great, of all the US carriers they are the only one I would be willing to be a career on (outside UPS and FedEx). They will most likly be here when you retire. BUT they still are a LOW COST carrier. Any company that starts out with the term LOW COST has one thing in mind keeping costs low. If that type of flying is for you, awesome. Some could care less and fly cargo. Some folks like the first class. To each his own.

Just ask yourself the tough questions and don't look back.

 

[SWAbigdaddy]

BAKE, I think you answered your own questions!!


"SWAbigdaddy, just wondering what would make it more rewarding? MONEY, you probably would make more money flying a career at FedEx."

YES, money is good. Thats why I work.
MONEY=REWARD


"However, if is a challenge you are looking for I think you are mistaken. Neither SWA nor FedEx flying is challenging. Yes, you can go international and fly bigger planes but that ain't no big deal. Just curious what you think is rewarding. "

Yes, flying bigger airplanes internationally is more challenging.
BIGGER AIRPLANE/INTERNATIONAL=CHALLENGING
OAK-LAX-SJC-ONT-SMF-LAX/737=NOT CHALLENGING

 

[SWAbigdaddy]

Too bad we can't trade pilots. I'd trade SWAbigdaddy for a couple of Snickers bars and a can of YooHoo!

Sounds like a SWA Crew Meal!!

 

[Bake]

Bigdaddy, C'mon now. More Challenging flying international?? Maybe for a couple of months, same thing with the bigger airplane. It will be challenging until you figure it out. 2 years flying that stuff and you will be bitchin because they wont let you fly the space shuttle.

 

[sandman2122]

Good Luck

Glad to hear he's happy enough at FedEx to step aside and let someone without a airline job get one!

That was a nice thing to do Switch Monkey.

 

[FearlessFreep]

Switch Monkey,

There are "THOUSANDS" of people that would be happy to be flipping switches for Fedex, especially if they had some seniority.

Maybe you should just count you lucky stars, relax and enjoy life. Be happy with what you DO have, and stop worrying about what you don't.

Count your blessings, even the small ones! (Though a job as a pilot at Fedex would NOT be considered small)

Good Luck To Us All!

 

[duckman]

The great debate.

Ah....and the great debate continues....on-infinitum I presume...(or is it adnausium)???

 

[SWA/FO]

Your all right....except for the part about a Snickers bars and a can of YooHoo! I eat the best meals at SWA, 50% off at most of our four star hotels make me feel like a king...(but not a networ-king.)

In fact, I'm the King of the 737, flying the lower 48 with 8-12 legs a day!!!!

However, I only need 7-8 hours of sleep (at night) after getting home from a trip. What do the international flying folks need to right themselves onto their family's clock?

Where is Dennis Miller when you need him?? CNBC

 

[Falconjet]

Freep

Freep: Go back and read the posts. Switch Monkey isn't complaining about anything, he was a stand up guy and took himself off the list at SW because he has decided to stay at FedEx. He didn't want to hold up the hiring process for someone else at SW or cost them any money ot time keeping him up to date since he had made his decision. That shows a lot of class and concern for others.

Perhaps you took my post for complaining, and again perhaps you didn't read it very thoroughly. NOBODY is complaning about having options. This I'm sure was a common lament in the heydays of hiring back in the late 90s and early 2000. We come to this forum to share ideas and perhaps seek input from those who have something to offer that might actually be HELPFUL in making a decision, or maybe just for some entertainment.

The bottom line is that a job will open up (eventually) for somebody else at either FedEx or SW, regardless of what my decision is. In Monkey's case the position is now open at SW. No complaints, just some venting and sharing of info.

I was looking for some discussion on my analogy of the seniority issue. Do folks agree that it would be a lateral or upward move, as opposed to a downward move as is normal. Any thoughts on that?

Nobody is complaining, and I for one feel extremely lucky to have a choice, but it still must be made. If I could give away either slot to a deserving pilot believe me I would and I know several who deserve it.

FJ

 

[AlbieF15]

Fearless,

FJ is a highly qualified pilot who did the preparation required to have a couple of job offers. Lots of people in the last 4-5 years have been in the same situation. They do not need to apologize to anyone for having mulitple offers nor should they just "take what they got and be greatful".

FDX is a great job. Its also a very, very difficult lifestyle doing hub turns in the middle of the night on reserve, and its certainly not for everybody. AA, DAL, NW, and United all have guys who decided they couldn't hang with the tough hours and lifestyle and left us for greener pastures. Some got burned in the post 9/11 world, but some are still out there on the line at other majors.

At what point is a guy supposed to quit striving to do what is best for him and his family?

Yeah, its tough for a lot of folks right now. However, without rubbing salt in anyone's wounds, the guys who do the preparation, networking, and make things happen owe themselves the opportunity to do what is best for their own interest. Folks ought to be asking FJ "how did you do that?" rather than attacking him for having options.

 

[FlyBoeingJets]

Albie,

As usual you are far more eloquent at saying what I'm thinking.

I second the above.

Wishing everyone trying to get a job the best.

FBJ

 

[RightBettor]

Amazing how one guy posts a statement saying he's gonna stay put and it turns into a "my pecker is bigger than yours" debate!

 

[dixieflyer]

At least at FDX you wont have to deal with obnoxious passengers. I did that for 4 and half years at Horizon and I would sit on the panel untill age 60 before going back. I dont know what it is, but the public seems to loss all their manners once they board an airplane. Rude, obnoxious, no class at all....

 

[RightBettor]

dixieflyer,

You must've been flying in and out of the California markets. Talk about a bunch of self-absorbed, arrogant, you-know-whats!! It's interesting to see how people behave depending on where you are. The CA crowd takes the cake. (Having spent several years at SkyWest in an out of LAX and SFO all day... I can attest!) For example, fly from PHX to BNA and the folks are pretty well behaved and friendly. Fly between BUR & LAS or SNA to/from anywhere and these people will make you lose all hope for humanity. Some FAs frequent this board... perhaps they can coment.

I was recently able to escape the PSRCA and get my family out. We were lucky the whacko burned-out hippies from Sacramento didn't send a political officer to place us under arrest for trying to leave. We are happy to report we are safely in Arizona and have only one more CA tax return to file (for 2003.) After that the whacko burned-out hippies from Sacramento can kiss my arse!!

Hey maybe we can turn this into a "my state is better than your state" thread.

 

[SWA/FO]

If you are missing that pax experience all you have to do is turn on A & E @ 10 Eastern on Mondays and watch "airline".

By-the-way, my State is better then your State!

 

[enigma]

I dont know what it is, but the public seems to loss all their manners once they board an airplane. Rude, obnoxious, no class at all....

I used to think that the metel detectors served a secret dual function. The secret function being that if a common sense zapper. After a while I decided that the attitude change/intelligence draining device must be hidden somewhere in the airport entrance signs.

I know it's got to be somewhere, cause people sure do act stupid, and do it with a bad attitude, when in the airport or airplane.





enigma

 

[dA-RoCk]

FedEx all the way baby... You won't be flipping those switches for ever buddy.. Hang in there.

Airlines tend to be a grind sometimes, and I would give my left nut to fly for FedEx anyday.

Swa is also a nice place to be, but i really don't think i could leave one for the other!


Good chatter on the tread boys...


Good luck

RoCk

 

[b747dogg]

Amazing how one guy posts a statement saying he's gonna stay put and it turns into a "my pecker is bigger than yours" debate!

Hey RightBettor, my pecker is bigger than yours!!!