SWA Winglets - It's Official!

[StopNTSing]

Re: What about the -300?

So if Boeing offers them for the -300, will SWA get them for those airplanes as well? And is the -500 going to be wingletless? Anybody know what the plans are?

Heard our -300s and -500s will remain wingletless. They just don't have the life left in the airframes to make the mod costs worth it.

 

[Cardinal]

Out of curiosity, I've always wondered why winglets were not added to the 777 and new 767's. Seems like they are a popular option for improving efficincy but never understood why they are not used on some of the new heavies, but are used on the 744. I guess the aero. engineers have a good reason!

I'll try not to sound too pedantic, but I will approach this in a linear fashion. It's all about aspect ratio, span/chord. A long skinny wing is more efficient than a short stubby wing because of reduced tip losses - that annoying tendency of air to spill from under the wing and up around the wingtip. A winglet increases the effective wingspan, only in a slightly different direction, thus uping the aspect ratio. The 777 ends up with a very high aspect ratio even before any winglets. From the crank at the inboard aileron and outboard from there it resembles a glider. The 767-400 has cranked wingtips, kinda like the Dorniers, that taper to almost nothing. This increases the effecive aspect ratio, it's as if the wing never ends. The motivation to not go with a vertical winglet is structural. Extending the wing in it's same plane by a few feet is comparatively easy, just continue the taper of the spar. But it's more difficult (heavier) to transfer the aerodynamic loads of a winglet through a small, delicate curved structure to the spar. Another factor, particularly with larger aircraft is gate space and taxiway clearance, a vertical winglet fits much nicer than an extra 20 or 30 feet of wingspan.

Actually I find it interesting the WN adopted the winglets given their shorter stage lengths. Either ANA or JAL (perhaps both) operate their domestic 744s without winglets, while their international birds are equipped. Apparently the extra weight was not justifiable over short legs.

 

[firstthird]

Here is a link to a website that explains it all pretty well

http://airtransportbiz.free.fr/Technique/Thewinglet.html

Boils down that you can either extend the wing or put on a winglet that is 4/5's as high as you would've made the wing longer. Winglets also increase the structural complexity/weight of the wing so that is thrown in the mix.

Back in the late 80's when I was in college my aero professors taught that no one had over come the increased planform drag that winglets caused to make them worthwhile even though they were known to reduce the induced drag (from the wingtip vortices) I guess someone figured it out about when they were teaching me that.

 

[Dieterly]

Boeing, Well Done!!!

Aviation Partners Boeing, a joint venture between Aviation Partners Inc. and Boeing, will provide 169 Blended Winglet shipsets to Southwest.

vs.

Airbus wins $12.5B Emirates order. Deal at Paris Air Show pushes firm's orders for year to 197 compared with 38 for archrival Boeing.

 

[G4G5]

I am pretty sure that the G3/G2B were the first with winglets. And IMHO the G3 is still the best looking corporate aircraft

 

[fokkerjet]

I am pretty sure that the G3/G2B were the first with winglets. And IMHO the G3 is still the best looking corporate aircraft

If you are talking business jets, I believe Lear claims the first with the Lear 28 (August, 1978). Gulfstream GIII's first flew in December, 1979, followed by the GIIB in March 1981 and now the GIISP (with Aviation Partner Boeing blended winglets).

From what I remember, Gulfstream stopped conversion of GII's to GIIB's because the -IIB's were a much better performer (and cheaper) than the -III because they were slightly smaller and lighter, with the same rated Spey engines that were on the -III.

 

[qxeplt]

Winglets are cool!!!

I got dubs on the winglet avatar....

 

[MLBWINGBORN]

**CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED**..
I almost had it too..

Thats ok..
I will just put it on my desktop..

Its way cool in my book..

 

[CoopDog]

Good idea MLB!

Desktop....,Ah, excellent idea....it looks so nice. Now if I was just sitting in that right seat....

Some day soon.

 

[V1Cutt]

It is an excellent desktop background. Be sure to get the high resolution image from the link in the first post.

 

[Yahtzee]

Mike,

I know he's not a SWA 737-700, but I could hook you up with several shots of "UGA V"...There are plenty of SWA 737s on this board, but I've only seen two photos of "UGA".

Tell me that ain't the best looking mascot you've ever seen.

Yahtz

 

[MLBWINGBORN]

OK..

"It" aint!!
"It' looks like it could go a few rounds with Robert Shapiros plastic surgeon and have a few bags left over..

Mike

 

[MLBWINGBORN]

Re: Re: ATA took the lead

That's right...and I'll bet they paid WAY more for them than SWA did. The only reason we're finally getting them is because Boeing finally came down on the cost.

The real reason was that the cost of jet fuel has gone high enough and will continue to be high enough to justifiy the cost of winglets..At the lower prices it would have taken too long to realize a return on the investment..
Other items you may see come to SWA in way of improvements will be auto-throttles as well as full up "V"nav..

As for the question of the 300s/500s..Both models are long enough in the tooth to not be cost effective for a major improvement like winglets..Some folks will ask why we are putting the dual FMCs as well as the new flat panels in the 300s..

The very high cost of maintaining the steam gauges has made it cost effective to replace them with the panels and the second FMC allows us to take advantage of upcoming systems..

You very well may see the first 300 retired before that last 200 goes away..

Mike

 

[V1Cutt]

I was told in DAL last week that the price has dropped from close to $2 million per aircraft to $400K in the last 2 years. Patience pays off.

 

[FlyBoeingJets]

I was told in DAL last week that the price has dropped from close to $2 million per aircraft to $400K in the last 2 years. Patience pays off.

But how more gas have you burned in those 2 years??????