SWA training rumor?

[Clyde Frog]

Incorrect, they cannot BID CA until 2015.

I love it when people spout off like they know what the hell they're talking about.

 

[HowardBorden]

It's happened at prob every legacy airline flying today.

That's why they have all been through bankruptcy and Southwest hasn't!

 

[redflyer65]

Section F.1.

AirTran Pilots will be prohibited from holding a Captain or Lance Captain position on the Southwest B737 until the January 2015 bid period.


So it's kind of open for interpretation. It doesn't say January award period. It says 'bid' period, as if your bidding in January.

Clear as mud?

 

[HowardBorden]

Incorrect, they cannot BID CA until 2015.

I love it when people spout off like they know what the hell they're talking about.

From S.L. 10

Q. How will future 737 captain vacancies be filled?

A. Until January 1, 2015, all 737 Captain will be filled by current Southwest pilots. After that date, Captain vacancies at SWA will be determined by system seniority.

 

[Ty Webb]

The language isn't exactly clear.

Curious what might be in the negotiators' notes about the intent there.

 

[scoreboardII]

Section F.1.

AirTran Pilots will be prohibited from holding a Captain or Lance Captain position on the Southwest B737 until the January 2015 bid period.


So it's kind of open for interpretation. It doesn't say January award period. It says 'bid' period, as if your bidding in January.

Clear as mud?

It is clear, "Bid", meaning in the SWA jacked up system, your Jan bid for vacancy, will get you a Feb/Mar upgrade, so no CA until Mar/April.

 

[redflyer65]

From S.L. 10

Q. How will future 737 captain vacancies be filled?

A. Until January 1, 2015, all 737 Captain will be filled by current Southwest pilots. After that date, Captain vacancies at SWA will be determined by system seniority.

That clears it up. Jan bid.

Clyde,

How is that making stuff up?

 

[Clyde Frog]

Section F.1.

AirTran Pilots will be prohibited from holding a Captain or Lance Captain position on the Southwest B737 until the January 2015 bid period.


So it's kind of open for interpretation. It doesn't say January award period. It says 'bid' period, as if your bidding in January.

Clear as mud?

If it read"...prohibited from bidding a Capt or Lance Captain position on the SW B737 until January 2015 bid period" I would agree with you. The key word in all this is "holding". SWAPA would likely be facing a DFR if they chose your interpretation. From the way some are talking, there are quite a few FAT guys just looking for a reason.

 

[Clyde Frog]

Q. How will future 737 captain vacancies be filled?

A. Until January 1, 2015, all 737 Captain will be filled by current Southwest pilots. After that date, Captain vacancies at SWA will be determined by system seniority.

No where does it say a FAT pilot can't submit a captain bid prior to 1/1/15 for a class starting after 1/1/15.

Until that date, "737 Captain will be filled by current SW pilots. After that date, capt vacancies at SW will be determined by system seniority".

How can you determine it after that date if they are prohibited from bidding before that date?

Again, I think the key word here is in the text of SL10 where it clearly says "prohibited from holding", not prohibited from bidding.

Anyway, whatever, it's a year away.

 

[HowardBorden]

Q. How will future 737 captain vacancies be filled?

A. Until January 1, 2015, all 737 Captain will be filled by current Southwest pilots. After that date, Captain vacancies at SWA will be determined by system seniority.

No where does it say a FAT pilot can't submit a captain bid prior to 1/1/15 for a class starting after 1/1/15.

Until that date, "737 Captain will be filled by current SW pilots. After that date, capt vacancies at SW will be determined by system seniority".

How can you determine it after that date if they are prohibited from bidding before that date?

Again, I think the key word here is in the text of SL10 where it clearly says "prohibited from holding", not prohibited from bidding.

Anyway, whatever, it's a year away.

I think the key word is "filled". All vacancies have a forward looking component. Any vacancy that has an award prior to January 1, 2015 will be filled with a current SWA pilot. A vacancy closing after that date will be filled via system seniority. That's the way I read it anyway, I could be wrong.

 

[FlyinGuy]

Don't forget that there has to be a vacancy for anyone to bid for upgrade. SWA posts them a month prior to required training. So if this becomes a big issue, SWA can solve it by not having a Jan '15 vacancy posting. This is more a deal for any SWA dude trying to squeak into upgrade.

Now when it comes to Lance Capt, that is a different beast. Any AT pilot that is senior to any RSW LC (after Jan '15) can force an upgrade class by bidding into that position.

 

[scoreboardII]

Q. How will future 737 captain vacancies be filled?

A. Until January 1, 2015, all 737 Captain will be filled by current Southwest pilots. After that date, Captain vacancies at SWA will be determined by system seniority.

No where does it say a FAT pilot can't submit a captain bid prior to 1/1/15 for a class starting after 1/1/15.

Until that date, "737 Captain will be filled by current SW pilots. After that date, capt vacancies at SW will be determined by system seniority".

How can you determine it after that date if they are prohibited from bidding before that date?

Again, I think the key word here is in the text of SL10 where it clearly says "prohibited from holding", not prohibited from bidding.

Anyway, whatever, it's a year away.

The problem with your interpretation goes against 40 plus years of how it's been done. You can't win a training slot, until you win a vacancy bid, which lags by a month.

 

[scoreboardII]

Now when it comes to Lance Capt, that is a different beast. Any AT pilot that is senior to any RSW LC (after Jan '15) can force an upgrade class by bidding into that position.

True, but again, the delay in our system, means winning a Jan bid, is really winning a Feb upgrade class, on the line in march.

 

[humveedriver]

True, but again, the delay in our system, means winning a Jan bid, is really winning a Feb upgrade class, on the line in march.

Anyone who is expecting some kind of instant gratification at this point in the game is obviously living in their own world. Transition, bid what your seniority can hold and wait for the next merger of pilot groups. Everyone has a standing bid that must completed before the end of training. My number one choice is DAL CA. I'll get it before I retire if I don't medical out. It's not that hard.

 

[humveedriver]

The problem with your interpretation goes against 40 plus years of how it's been done. You can't win a training slot, until you win a vacancy bid, which lags by a month.

Since I've been here (all of about 8 months) all I've seen and heard is how SWA is different now and not doing things the way they used to. So I'm not sure historical perspective is a good argument for the awarding of upgrades with transition language that has had buses driven through it. The company will simply do whatever it wants and the folks who feel burned will end up filing grievances.