SWA & Logging Of Flight Time

[Joe Jet Pilot]

Ok, folks I need some help deciding what to do with my logbook. First of all I use Logbook Pro, so making changes is not a big deal.

I meet the 1000 hour FAR Part 1 PIC Turbine requirement. That is not the issue.

Prior to working for a fractional, the corporate operator I worked for got me typed from day one. Any leg that I was flying, I would log it as PIC, and if not the PF I would log it as SIC.

I'm just not sure what to put into the application when they ask for PIC Turbine. I know SWA uses FAR Part 1 to define PIC for the 1000 hour requirement, but what to do about time that I logged as PIC in the aircraft for which I held a type rating and was the PF.

I'm thinking that I should go back and log all time as SIC until I completed IOE and became the "Part 1 PIC"

Any thoughts?

 

[Astra Guy]

I guess I don't understand the dilemna. My take is that the credible PIC time is only the time you were the PF. Am I missing the thrust of your question?

 

[Joe Jet Pilot]

Try This

Ok for example if I flew 1500 hours as PIC as defined by part 1 of the FAR's, and logged say 500 hours as PIC based on PF but was assigned as an SIC. For the purpose of the SWA application and the presentation of my logbook, do I have 1500 hours PIC or 2000 hours PIC?

I hope I'm being clear. Have not slept due to being under the weather, sorry!

 

[Astra Guy]

Ok, now I get it. I believe that I read that SWA had put another restriction about PIC time, as they viewed it, as being in the left seat. If I am right then the answer to your question would be you could log PIC time anytime you were the PF in the left seat when you were assigned as the SIC.

Personally I think that if you were the sole manipulator of the controls regardless of which seat you are in and you are type rated you should be able to log it as PIC time. For aircraft that don't require a type rating then the same should apply. This is a little muddy because you might be an SIC, not school trained and able to log PIC time.

Hope you feel better.

 

[T1bubba]

From the SWA website-

Southwest Airlines defines "Pilot in Command" as the Pilot responsible for the operation and safety of the aircraft during flight. This definition is taken from PART I of the FAR. Southwest Airlines further allows logging of PIC as follows: For an aircraft requiring a type rating: If both pilots are type rated, the pilot in the left seat and sole manipulator of the controls may log PIC. If only one pilot is type rated only that pilot may log PIC, regardless of seat position.

The key sentence is the first one. Another way of putting it is this- who would the company you worked for say was in charge? If it isn't you then don't log it.

Good luck!

 

[Joe Jet Pilot]

I know that but

Southwest Airlines defines "Pilot in Command" as the Pilot responsible for the operation and safety of the aircraft during flight.

Does this relate to obtaining the 1000 hrs. PIC Turbine or all flight time in ones logbook is the question?

If I said here is 1500 hours PIC Turbine as the responsible pilot, and here is 500 hours logged as PIC based on being the PF would there an issue.

I'm not to worried about how it looks in the logbook, beacuse anyone looking at it will be able to quickly see that there is no attempt to fudge the numbers. My main concern is with the application.

I guess the safe course of action would be to go back and correct everything to SIC time.

Thanks for the help!

 

[T1bubba]

I wouldn't worry about how it's listed in your logbook because you'll get to explain it at the interview. Just make sure that any PIC time you list on the application follows the rules above.

 

[Benhuntn]

I went through this same dilema 2 yrs ago. I took the conservative (I believe correct) approach and only showed PIC for times that I was the acting Captain. I logged SIC for the times someone else was in command. That is the way FAR Part 1 is suppose to be interpeted at least as far as I was trained when preparing for my interviews etc. During the interview at SWA I did my log book review with one of the HR people and he had no questions on my assigning of times. I would rather show less time and then adjust it up than to show to much time and have them adjust it down.

Just another Poolie

 

[Brett Hull]

I'm a bit hard-headed,

So let me throw an example out there.

I work in a 3 person flight dept. The CP and I fly a trip to TEB and back, we're both typed, and every leg is flown from the left seat. If the poop hits the fan, he'll say I was in charge (on my leg). My logbook will look something like this:

TT: 3.8, PIC: 1.8, SIC: 2.0

O.K for SWA or not?

Thanks!

 

[holdon]

OK What about Dual Recieved when you were a private pilot and logged it as both Dual and PIC. Do you need to go back and subtract all of that out of your total PIC?