SWA lands at wrong Branson Airport

[imacdog]

slaquer, I'm getting out of the industry completely. Maybe SWA is perfect for you. It's not for everyone, though.

Please tell us you aren't joking.

 

[waveflyer]

Telling the truth is one thing.

Coloring the truth to fit an agenda is quite another.

Bubba

This^^
As always, well said

 

[Just thinking]

Two colors on every side ..... black and white.... the truth is always in the gray area depending on how well you stay in the lines. The company was way outside the lines with their handling of the Denver FO. Hopefully swapa will make sure he is made whole for the moeny they have stollen from him. They have set themselves up for all the other furlough pilots to be firmly in their seat in class with their recall number before they call to let gary know what's going on. You reap what you sow gary.

 

[180ToTheMarker]

Yes, I heard from one of our former SOC people how that works: "You've got to somehow trick them into believing that it was really their idea and not an AirTran procedure, then they'll think it's brilliant!"

That's true for any airline post merger.

 

[PCL_128]

Telling the truth is one thing.



Coloring the truth to fit an agenda is quite another.



Bubba

I don't color anything. waveflyer certainly does, though. Always trying to make SWA seem prefect, and always kissing management's ass.

 

[SWA Bubba]

Two colors on every side ..... black and white.... the truth is always in the gray area depending on how well you stay in the lines. The company was way outside the lines with their handling of the Denver FO. Hopefully swapa will make sure he is made whole for the moeny they have stollen from him. They have set themselves up for all the other furlough pilots to be firmly in their seat in class with their recall number before they call to let gary know what's going on. You reap what you sow gary.

What Denver FO? What happened?

Bubba

 

[APFPilot]

anyone know anything about this: http://avherald.com/h?article=46e29568

didn't want to start a new thread and stir the WN pot.

 

[canyonblue]

The requirement to cross the FAF at night, on a visual is a safe practice. It reduces pressure, mitigates rushed approaches and may have prevented this incident.

Well that explains the 10 mile downwinds i've experienced. If you can't land an airplane from abeam the numbers, you just plain suck. Also, if you land at the wrong airport, you would suck also.

 

[canyonblue]

Yes, I heard from one of our former SOC people how that works: "You've got to somehow trick them into believing that it was really their idea and not an AirTran procedure, then they'll think it's brilliant!"

Could be true, Robert Fornaro tricked Gary Kelly.

 

[Ty Webb]

Well that explains the 10 mile downwinds i've experienced. If you can't land an airplane from abeam the numbers, you just plain suck. Also, if you land at the wrong airport, you would suck also.

I don't cut inside the FAF, period. I also haven't had to perform a go-around in at least five years.

Now, Your Honor, I might be just an unfrozen caveman pilot, but methinks these two things be related.

 

[waveflyer]

Sound like a pu$$y flyer Ty

I'm not in a hurry but I have no desire to turn into a group of morons who can't do a visual rolling out stable at 1000'

News flash- We get priority from atc bc we move metal, not pizza parties-

 

[PCL_128]

Sound like a pu$$y flyer Ty

Gee, there's a safe attitude.

 

[tankerhead]

News flash- We get priority visits from the FAA bc we grind metal

Fixed that for you

 

[Just thinking]

"News flash- We get priority from atc bc we move metal"..............

Moving metal at the speed of Mach .74 at altitude in a classic?
Moving metal at the eye watering speed of 261 kts on the descent?
Moving metal along the taxi ways where the company has to put out RBF's for taxi speeds and the safety of the F/A's?

"I'm not in a hurry but I have no desire to turn into a group of morons who can't do a visual rolling out stable at 1000'"...........

Good luck with that one when you get FNT in sight from 7000' and they clear you for the visual.

Good luck with that one when they give you a slam dunk from 12000 in Atlanta landing west.

Night time turns inside of the FAF is not impossible but it is a wise and prudent measure to ensure proper alignment with the proper runway. (Biggs vs ELP).

Request the early turn to final while operating in any HDTA because you "move metal" and see what the response is. Wait in line there skippy.

 

[Just thinking]

What Denver FO? What happened?..........

Go to the swapa forum to read the individual's account. Classic airline mgmt 101. Herb's airline has been gone for quite a while.

 

[freightdogfred]

edited

 

[Ty Webb]

Sound like a pu$$y flyer Ty

I'm not in a hurry but I have no desire to turn into a group of morons who can't do a visual rolling out stable at 1000'

News flash- We get priority from atc bc we move metal, not pizza parties-

This pu$$y flew a jet out of a coastal airport that had only a circling approach (the real kind) and two foggy seasons . . . Let's just say I'd put my skills up against yours any day.

In an airliner, though, I cross the FAF.

PS . . . How many jet type ratings are on your certificate without a limitation on circling? I'm betting zero.

Pu$$y!

:laugh:

 

[jonjuan]

Newsflash for you, Skippy-

Just because you're a d!ck doesn't make everyone else a *************************. :laugh:

For two years, I flew a jet based at a field that had only a circling approach and two foggy seasons . . . Let's just say I'd put my skills up against yours any day, and my judgement, too.

PS . . . How many jet type ratings are on your certificate without a limitation on circling? I'm betting zero.

*************************!

:laugh:

Sounds safe. :erm:

 

[Ty Webb]

Sounds safe. :erm:

It can be done safely, but it do take some skill!

It also takes eyebrow windows . . . since they removed them, we can all breathe easy. :laugh:

 

[Phlintstone]

Relax Ty, wave and canyon are just playing out their roll as the princesses of aviation. Their parents told them they were the prettiest and the most special kids ever. They still believe that...just ask them. :laugh:

Phred

 

[PBRstreetgang]

News flash- We get priority from atc bc we move metal, not pizza parties-

Too bad its not always to the right airport....double pepperoni, double cheese.....

 

[waveflyer]

Hahaha- man, I hooked like 7 of you with that.

I think it's often prudent guys- certainly would've saved us that night and if it's in your procedures I bet we see it-

That said I don't want us to lose the ability to be pilots and use that when we can- our judgement is being taken away from us instead of trained into us- and I don't think there's any getting away from using our own judgement online.

As for always fly over the FAF- My last two flights into oak were from sea and Pdx -
Really? Go all the way to Mitoe? It's like 8 miles
How about smf from the south? And bc of timing if we HAD to do that, we'd have got Fedex'd all the way to San Jose
I'm Vegas based and tend to stay west hence my examples
We can't do that at those, but we'll do the circle to 22 in mdw?
C'mon-

How about we learn the lesson and use our available tools and gain more technology to help- be more vigilant then let us work-
This does put the exclamation point on anybody still resistant to technology- we can't afford the guys who don't use all their tools

All my jet types have the circle limits pu$$y Ty - dang, wish I was a real pilot

 

[Ty Webb]

When I go into MDW, I check on with "Information Ditka".

Ditka always calls da plays in Chicago . . . 31C every time, dahhhl.

Then I throw my pizza order out the DV window as I pass Giordano's . . . That way, it'll be waiting for me at the gate. Grab couple a' Old Styles, head for da hotel.

:laugh:

 

[canyonblue]

I don't cut inside the FAF, period.

So you won't sidestep in PHX, MCO, LAX etc..? Sometimes you end up inside the FAF if you accept it. What is the AAI policy on that?

 

[waveflyer]

Nice TY

 

[Ty Webb]

So you won't sidestep in PHX, MCO, LAX etc..? Sometimes you end up inside the FAF if you accept it. What is the AAI policy on that?

I like sidestepping as much as the next guy, but if you want to cover all your bases, you should review the landing data for that runway and cover it in your brief.

The only surprise I like is what's on tap at the hotel.

 

[scoreboardII]

PS . . . How many jet type ratings are on your certificate without a limitation on circling? I'm betting zero.

Pu$$y!

:laugh:

Uhhh, all of them. SWA requires unrestricted type, meaning, circling required.

 

[waveflyer]

That's right, 73 is not restricted
For any of us Ty
That's pretty funny
I guess none of us are pu$$ies

 

[dicko]

Well that explains the 10 mile downwinds i've experienced. If you can't land an airplane from abeam the numbers, you just plain suck. Also, if you land at the wrong airport, you would suck also.

Well made points as usual -

The FAF is generally half that distance from the runway. Maybe you should rethink your technique ?

How badly do you suck if you tail strike eight 737-800s ? If one's a hull loss is that worse or better ?

So many questions and so little time. Perhaps Wave will answer with a "you're a puzzy if you're not dragging metal down a runway".

 

[dicko]

I have no desire to turn into a group of morons who can't do a visual rolling out stable at 1000'

When you get a chance call your FOQA guy, and then re-read what you just wrote.