SWA delaying new planes, adding used Westjet birds --article

[intooclose]

AND....We didn't have to pay for a 737 type.

 

[madjack]

True dat

 

[HowardBorden]

At least somebody gets it. This whole thing was engineered from the beginning to turn out like it has. Gary made sure the first deal was so onerous that no union in its right mind would accept it. Then when the inevitable vote not to ratify came along, he could pull the money off the table and say "I gave you the opportunity to have the money, but you wouldn't take it." Disingenuous, but smart. Certainly not in line with the "golden rule," of course, but again, he is management, so I expect nothing less.

It appears that he completely snookered you. If this whole thing was engineered to turn out like it has, why didn't you stick to your own union governance rules? You could have also not agreed to send out the second agreement to the membership for ratification as was your option on deal one. You could have just ran out the clock and forced arbitration in accordance with PA timeline. But, you were trying to save your hide from an extremely angry mob that you "saved" from themselves because they were not smart enough to vote no on the first agreement if they had been given the option. Did your union governance rules change? If it was OK not to allow a membership ratification vote the first time, why not the second? Why did you ultimately agree to send whatever AIP2 turned out to be for MEMRAT? You are so fond of calling your fellow pilots "pansies" but I would like to know where your balls disappeared to in adverse conditions. You can talk a great game about saving the under educated masses from themselves during the first deal, but they suddenly became trustworthy to vote on their fate when the second deal came along, why was that?

 

[redflyer65]

At least somebody gets it. This whole thing was engineered from the beginning to turn out like it has. Gary made sure the first deal was so onerous that no union in its right mind would accept it. Then when the inevitable vote not to ratify came along, he could pull the money off the table and say "I gave you the opportunity to have the money, but you wouldn't take it." Disingenuous, but smart. Certainly not in line with the "golden rule," of course, but again, he is management, so I expect nothing less.

Engineereed from the beginning? You've got to be kidding me.

PCL, your completely off the ranch with this one. Grasping at straws to describe the ALPA meltdown. Be careful, there might be more black helicopters over West Georgia.

 

[waveflyer]

There's only one problem with your conspiracy theory PCL -

Your own union's neurosis

Who could've predicted how weird your union got?
You do recognize that your own union you helped lead, really acted strangely and against themselves several times during the SLI run up, right?

That and you were uber aggressive- tried to wag the dog- everyone here told you what would happen if you tried- call your fellow pilots pansies all you want- but you ABSOLUTELY COULD HAVE LED YOUR PILOT GROUP TO A BETTER MORE PROSPEROUS OUTCOME THAN WHAT HAPPENED.

YOU DIDN'T.

THAT'S ON YOU

NO SPIN WILL CHANGE THAT

 

[PCL_128]

It appears that he completely snookered you.

Me? No. The Merger Committee? Absolutely. The MEC? For a time. The pilot group? Oh yeah. In grand fashion.

If this whole thing was engineered to turn out like it has, why didn't you stick to your own union governance rules? You could have also not agreed to send out the second agreement to the membership for ratification as was your option on deal one. You could have just ran out the clock and forced arbitration in accordance with PA timeline. But, you were trying to save your hide from an extremely angry mob that you "saved" from themselves because they were not smart enough to vote no on the first agreement if they had been given the option. Did your union governance rules change? If it was OK not to allow a membership ratification vote the first time, why not the second? Why did you ultimately agree to send whatever AIP2 turned out to be for MEMRAT?

I didn't do any of those things. I wasn't on the MEC. The MEC made decisions that I felt were not very smart, and I told them so.

You are so fond of calling your fellow pilots "pansies" but I would like to know where your balls disappeared to in adverse conditions.

My balls never disappeared anywhere. I was just as vocally opposed to SIA#2 as I was to SIA#1.

 

[maxblast72]

Sounds like your MC "got it"

The AirTran Merger Committee and ALPA lawyers "got it". If some members of the AirTran MEC didn't have some baggage, we would been able to help them "get it"

If you don't think some of the AirTran MEC had baggage, wait until you read the DFR lawsuit transcripts. Last week, we deposed a former ATN MEC member. After our lawyer started out by asking him his name, address, phone numbers, and email addresses, he was asked who he currently worked for. His response was ATA before he realized his mistake and corrected the record. I wonder if he was representing the ATA pilots or AirTran pilots in August 2011.