SWA/Airtran Process Agreement??

[On Your Six]

A better comparison would be SWA in 1993, (when we acquired Morris)...OBTW the Morris guys were not thrilled to be on the bottom of the SWA list, but they sure are happy about the way their careers have gone since...

This time arbitrators will take care of the SLI, which means a fair outcome is likely. If anyone is afraid of a FAIR outcome, then he/she would fear arbitration.


OYS

 

[madjack]

OYS, et al,

Fair is in the eye of the beholder...Anecdotal evidence indicates a pretty big difference in the expectations of the two pilot groups...what I garner from you, Lee (DELTA??), Ty, Lear etc...is that AAI expects the SLI to be arbitrated and the result to be close to relative seniority...and this is fair because that is the way arbitration works...OBTW: the arbitrated list will be in place no later than 18 months as per the AAI CBA. So, who is stirring the pot??

I agree, online is no place to negotiate...out

 

[Music]

OYS, et al,

Fair is in the eye of the beholder...Anecdotal evidence indicates a pretty big difference in the expectations of the two pilot groups...what I garner from you, Lee (DELTA??), Ty, Lear etc...is that AAI expects the SLI to be arbitrated and the result to be close to relative seniority...and this is fair because that is the way arbitration works...OBTW: the arbitrated list will be in place no later than 18 months as per the AAI CBA. So, who is stirring the pot??

I agree, online is no place to negotiate...out

I'm not sure I would characterize that way. Honestly everyone that I fly with truly wants to get this done WITHOUT, again I say WITHOUT Arbitration. With the exception of few here on FI, most SWA pilots rhetoric could be characterized as 'inflammatory', including statements such as "staple, seniority grab, 2nd rate hacks..." you get the point. Add that to the propaganda that SWAPA is spewing and it doesn't look as if you guys would even vote for a negotiated settlement even if it was sent to you for a vote. I for one am willing to let the process play out because as has been stated many times, none of us is going to change anyone's mind, at least in the short term.

Okay, now someone kick me in the nuts.

 

[dicko]

I'm not sure I would characterize that way. Honestly everyone that I fly with truly wants to get this done WITHOUT, again I say WITHOUT Arbitration. With the exception of few here on FI, most SWA pilots rhetoric could be characterized as 'inflammatory', including statements such as "staple, seniority grab, 2nd rate hacks..." you get the point. Add that to the propaganda that SWAPA is spewing and it doesn't look as if you guys would even vote for a negotiated settlement even if it was sent to you for a vote. I for one am willing to let the process play out because as has been stated many times, none of us is going to change anyone's mind, at least in the short term.

Okay, now someone kick me in the nuts.

Agreed.

That's exactly the feeling on the line. There's certainly been some shock with the perceived agression from some SWA pilots. SWAPA LUV is now completely ignored unfortunately. It's now know as "SWAPA's GLOVE" ...

Ive never heard an AirTran pilot say relative seniority or insinuate it. Not even close. We have heard staple repeatedly. It's unfortunate.

I hope this is worked out by our MC's prior to Arbitration.

 

[On Your Six]

OYS, et al,

Fair is in the eye of the beholder...Anecdotal evidence indicates a pretty big difference in the expectations of the two pilot groups...what I garner from you, Lee (DELTA??), Ty, Lear etc...is that AAI expects the SLI to be arbitrated and the result to be close to relative seniority...and this is fair because that is the way arbitration works...OBTW: the arbitrated list will be in place no later than 18 months as per the AAI CBA. So, who is stirring the pot??

I agree, online is no place to negotiate...out

Sorry, fair is in the eye of the arbitrator. In your instance, it will be a panel. Your lawyers will have to convince THEM. Why is this stirring the pot? Saying arbitrators will decide. Why does that scare people? They look and listen to evidence, then decide, and then write out an explanation. That's not stirring the pot, it is your future, and for anyone else in a large merger. If a NC actually tries to be fair, they will get recalled by their own group. If the AT group gives in and doesn't do arbitration, everybody at AT will always wonder if they could have had better seniority that was more fair via arbitration. You just can't win. The road always leads to it. I would be very surprised if it doesnt happen, and a bit skeptical of the result.



OYS

 

[SWA/FO]

Morris had 21 airplanes ......

A bigger % of airplane growth in 1993 then Air Tranny's planes add to our fleet today.

 

[Hose A. Jiminez]

Sorry, fair is in the eye of the arbitrator. In your instance, it will be a panel. Your lawyers will have to convince THEM. Why is this stirring the pot? Saying arbitrators will decide. Why does that scare people? They look and listen to evidence, then decide, and then write out an explanation. That's not stirring the pot, it is your future, and for anyone else in a large merger. If a NC actually tries to be fair, they will get recalled by their own group. If the AT group gives in and doesn't do arbitration, everybody at AT will always wonder if they could have had better seniority that was more fair via arbitration. You just can't win. The road always leads to it. I would be very surprised if it doesnt happen, and a bit skeptical of the result.



OYS

General, oh sorry, OYS, What will you do when we let cooler heads prevail and come to a negotiated solution that benefits both groups? It's a good possibility. Will you man up and admit you were wrong?

 

[kwick]

Staple the Southwest guys, to make up for their "Sins of the Past."

It will build character and teach a valuable lesson!

 

[stalker]

Hey music you need to go brush up on some of the prior threads on the subject. There has been just as many AAI guys screaming relative is the only fair thing as there has been SWA calling for a staple. While I do not believe SWAPA will open with a staple position I really for the life of me can not see how a 16 year AAI guy thinks it is fair to cozy up next to a 37 year SWA guy.

 

[Music]

Hey music you need to go brush up on some of the prior threads on the subject. There has been just as many AAI guys screaming relative is the only fair thing as there has been SWA calling for a staple. While I do not believe SWAPA will open with a staple position I really for the life of me can not see how a 16 year AAI guy thinks it is fair to cozy up next to a 37 year SWA guy.

I've read everything, unfortunately. True there have been those that have argued the "Relative" position. However, without question, those posts are relatively few. In fact, some were just reacting to another equally provocative post, i.e. "Staple". I won't argue what is or isn't fair here, that's for our MC's to hash out. And failing that, a panel of Arbitrators. I will say that even the most even minded person can see that the rhetoric posted on this site is most decidedly ANTI-AIRTRAN. Hey you or anyone else (or I, for that matter) can post anything we want (within the guidelines of the TOS) but this anti-AirTran stuff is doing nothing but causing division. While I realize folks are concerned (hell, we all are), kicking us in the nads isn't helping. If we can keep the vitriol to a minimum, cooler/rational heads will prevail. That's a fact!