STFD netjets!!

[dsptchrnja]

oooops one more time..............and yes i do work at nutjets..........but believe what you want...............this is my last post as per the higher ups.

stfd

You guys are dropping like flies this week. Very curious indeed. A month old non-union "employee" of NJA saying STFD. Kind of biting yourself in the foot, wouldn't you think? What higher ups? How would they be monitoring STEEL's posts to begin with if he was posting annonymously unless he advertised it to them?? Game over STEEL.

 

[FamilyGuy]

oooops one more time..............and yes i do work at nutjets..........but believe what you want...............this is my last post as per the higher ups.

What I find curious about this is that the union proponents have been quick to denounce anyone publicly opposing them as being management lackeys, and partaking in some large company conspiracy against the pilots....yet steel's post indicates that it is his side that is being centrally orchestrated.

The question is who is pulling the strings? And why are they seemingly willing to put 2100 pilots out on the street?

 

[On Your Six]

What I find curious about this is that the union proponents have been quick to denounce anyone publicly opposing them as being management lackeys, and partaking in some large company conspiracy against the pilots....yet steel's post indicates that it is his side that is being centrally orchestrated.

The question is who is pulling the strings? And why are they seemingly willing to put 2100 pilots out on the street?

I find this statement hilarious - that's some great SPIN... At the current rate, NJA won't have pilots or owners to worry about. What percentage of flights are you outsourcing nowadays? Doubt the owners like that - I certainly wouldn't...

The LCCs are hiring. Many corporate flight departments are hiring. Other Frax companies are hiring. UPS and Fedex are hiring. NJA's "best and most experienced" pilots are leaving. Seriously, who in his right mind would even consider joining NJA now under the current conditions? Probably someone who is really desparate or someone pretty inexperienced. There are many better opportunities out there and for those interested in the frax business, Flexjet and CS are cleaning up.

NJA's management can continue in this state of denial for a while, but this is a service business. As service continues to slip, renewals will continue to drop. I place the blame firmly on the LACK OF GOOD LEADERSHIP. This pilot contract should have been completed years ago and NJA management has clearly not negotiated in good faith. Paying a Citation X Captain $55K per year is a slap to the face and everyone knows it...

 

[TheTruthCMH]

Other Frax companies are hiring. UPS and Fedex are hiring. NJA's "best and most experienced" pilots are leaving. Seriously, who in his right mind would even consider flying for NJA under the current conditions? Probably someone who is really desparate or someone pretty inexperienced. There are many better opportunities out there and for those interested in the frax business, Flexjet and CS are cleaning up.QUOTE]

What I find humurous about this statement is that you mention two other frax as being better than NJA, yet neither have a union... Are you implying that if the Teamsters were gone this would be a better place?

If the jobs are so plentiful, why have you and the rest left yet?

The Truth Hurts

TTC

 

[be-400xpdriver]

The pilot are not any better at CS or FLEX just the PAY AND MANAGEMENT!!!!!

 

[Semore Butts]

Nah, thats not why.

It's no secret that management monitors this board, and some of you may very well be management.

It's just felt that there is no reason to post anymore, unless you just want to get on here and argue. (As so many have already pointed out)

Thats that! Take it easy.

 

[FAcFriend]

the higher ups that steel referred to are not NJA management but Union MEC folks who do not want their pilots on this board. The union leadership has told pilots not to "read this information."

They also dont want you to read what BB puts out and try very hard to attack the credibility of anyone who gives an opinion not union sanctioned.

This is reminiscent of a cult- first lets cut you off from other information, tell you everyone who is not with us - is against us, get you involved in busy work-

Jim Jones anyone?

I know there are pilots who are objective thinkers, who can evaluate this-

 

[gunfyter]

Very few of the pilots have ever been to this board. Usually if I mention flightinfo... they have never heard of it.

I sometimes get the same response if I mention crewops.

 

[x402]

the higher ups that steel referred to are not NJA management but Union MEC folks who do not want their pilots on this board. The union leadership has told pilots not to "read this information."

They also dont want you to read what BB puts out and try very hard to attack the credibility of anyone who gives an opinion not union sanctioned.

This is reminiscent of a cult- first lets cut you off from other information, tell you everyone who is not with us - is against us, get you involved in busy work-

Jim Jones anyone?

I know there are pilots who are objective thinkers, who can evaluate this-

Better go back and get some more info from your traitors with passwords, no one has ever said not to look at these boards.
To paraphrase, don't get worked up over the postings of COMPANY SPOKESPERSONS or UNION BUSTING HIRED GUNS.

 

[On Your Six]

Other Frax companies are hiring. UPS and Fedex are hiring. NJA's "best and most experienced" pilots are leaving. Seriously, who in his right mind would even consider flying for NJA under the current conditions? Probably someone who is really desparate or someone pretty inexperienced. There are many better opportunities out there and for those interested in the frax business, Flexjet and CS are cleaning up.QUOTE]

What I find humurous about this statement is that you mention two other frax as being better than NJA, yet neither have a union... Are you implying that if the Teamsters were gone this would be a better place?

If the jobs are so plentiful, why have you and the rest left yet?

The Truth Hurts

TTC

You are a true idiot if you believe pilots are joining Flexjet and CS because of the lack of a union at either company. C'mon - that's ridiculous. Another example of great SPIN. NJA is becoming far less appealing because of its acrimonious work environment and its lower pay. It has a bad reputation now among prospective pilots - I know because I have been told that by recent Flexjet newhires. CS Bravo Captains are paid more than NJA Citation X or G200 Captains.

The "Truth" is that NJA can't admit the fact that the operation continues to sink as some of its best employees and many owners walk out the door... It is becoming a worse place to work by the day. Clearly a lot of the pilots have remained due to the promise of potential retro pay. But, as things continue to get worse, I am sure that these highly experienced pilots will find better opportunities and the owners will find better conditions at the other fractional companies. The clock is ticking...

 

[h25b]

You are a true idiot if you believe pilots are joining Flexjet and CS because of the lack of a union at either company. C'mon - that's ridiculous. Another example of great SPIN. NJA is becoming far less appealing because of its acrimonious work environment and its lower pay. It has a bad reputation now among prospective pilots - I know because I have been told that by recent Flexjet newhires. CS Bravo Captains are paid more than NJA Citation X or G200 Captains.

The "Truth" is that NJA can't admit the fact that the operation continues to sink as some of its best employees and many owners walk out the door... It is becoming a worse place to work by the day. Clearly a lot of the pilots have remained due to the promise of potential retro pay. But, as things continue to get worse, I am sure that these highly experienced pilots will find better opportunities and the owners will find better conditions at the other fractional companies. The clock is ticking...

If what you say is totally correct you better be looking to jump ship soon... How in the world can you figure that an already sinking company can absorb the huge financial hit of your new CBA and do any better ?

That's the point isn't it ??? What us non-union people don't get is that it's always better to ask for a raise when things are going well. Pretty difficult to have one hand out while the other is holding a "STFD" sign... And I realize that it's been X number of years, but realistically you can't count those under the previous MEC can you ? If they were as "corrupt" as you say they were who's fault was that ? You voted em in and you voted them out. It was your problem and you fixed, it cost you some time.

 

[gunfyter]

Six does not work here.

 

[On Your Six]

If what you say is totally correct you better be looking to jump ship soon... How in the world can you figure that an already sinking company can absorb the huge financial hit of your new CBA and do any better ?

That's the point isn't it ??? What us non-union people don't get is that it's always better to ask for a raise when things are going well. Pretty difficult to have one hand out while the other is holding a "STFD" sign... And I realize that it's been X number of years, but realistically you can't count those under the previous MEC can you ? If they were as "corrupt" as you say they were who's fault was that ? You voted em in and you voted them out. It was your problem and you fixed, it cost you some time.

Gunfyter is correct - I don't work at NJA. Some of my best aviator friends work there and they talk about the situation all the time - I feel like I know the situation fairly well. During my brief time at UAL (until shortly after 9/11), I got a good sense for how unions work and I am definitely pro-union. I currently fly a Global Express for a part 91 operation out of the NYC area.

NJA's current situation is directly attributed to its own financial mismanagement and the flight crews should not suffer as a result of management's incompetence. My NJA friends talk about considerable waste throughout the system and the operations process (that subject has been beaten to death on these boards) and the subsidization of the formerly struggling NJE operation.

Just ask yourself this question: how is Southwest managed differently than NJA and what is the result? Southwest pilots are loyal and reasonably happy (especially considering the rest of the industry). NJA had the potential to be the "Southwest" of the fractional business with happy and loyal (meaning lower training costs - thank goodness Buffett also owns Flight Safety) but it dropped the ball in a major way. It demonstrates daily how it simply does not care about its employees - especially those who directly interface with the almighty owners... All of my NJA pilot friends are looking at other options right now. What a pity - NJA could have been such a great place to make a career.... But NJA management dropped the ball and now the atmosphere is poisoned. This is a classic situation of "NJA could have been such a great place to work if..."

I feel bad for the NJA crews who actually believed that they would be treated fairly and with respect. After all, I have met some extraodinarily gifted pilots who worked for NJA (a few have recently departed). I know that I would want to find a place where I could park myself for the rest of my career and earn respect and at least industry-average wages (for the aircraft type - not $55K as PIC of a Citation X). Yeah, NJA is in an interesting financial situation right now - so, it should figure out a way to get back on track and reduce the friction it has created. Perhaps Warren should contribute some of his considerable cash hoard to improving the situaiton? Continuing to hold-out (without making some progress) will only create more ill-will and the resulting poor morale won't please the owners....

 

[FAcFriend]

Better go back and get some more info from your traitors with passwords, no one has ever said not to look at these boards.
To paraphrase, don't get worked up over the postings of COMPANY SPOKESPERSONS or UNION BUSTING HIRED GUNS.

First- X402 in regards to your first post- are you saying people who talk to me are traitors? That is the mentality, I was referrring to.

But noone has given me a password and I have not been anywhere I am not supposed to be. the comment was made by a pilot on this board- I filled in the blanks and you added the icing on the cake.

As far as being a company spokesperson or union busting hired gun- I am neither. I do not work for the company nor have I ever pretended I do- I am a writer and originally came here for a story idea and started speaking with Netjetwife.

If you think I should be hired- please let someone who has the authority know

 

[x402]

First- X402 in regards to your first post- are you saying people who talk to me are traitors? That is the mentality, I was referrring to.

Yes, if they pass you half truths to annoy the pilots working for fair wages.

But noone has given me a password and I have not been anywhere I am not supposed to be. the comment was made by a pilot on this board- I filled in the blanks and you added the icing on the cake.

I see, they just let you look over their shoulder.

As far as being a company spokesperson or union busting hired gun- I am neither. I do not work for the company nor have I ever pretended I do- I am a writer and originally came here for a story idea and started speaking with Netjetwife.

Let us know when you get published, can't wait.

If you think I should be hired- please let someone who has the authority know

Jim Jones? Dallas Cowboys, right.

 

[wolfpackpilot]

Steel is a moron

Hmmm that is curious Dispatcher Good Catch.

Yet another 23 year old CFI (JET-GOD) who gets caught hunting Elephants with a BB-Gun... His outward stupidity only briefly shows his personality defects which say nothing of his overall lack of professionalism.



When the more level headed and moderate NJA pilots (whom I regard as professionals) start ranting and raving like this imbecile, then I'll start worrying.



On a side note: I had breakfast with a very senior BBJ Captain last week at the Crown in HPN, we laughed, we joked, and we both talked about the current situation. Needless to say, we both know he isn’t going to see me on his seniority list, and I won’t be seeing him in the Gulfstreams.

 

[miles otoole]

On a side note: I had breakfast with a very senior BBJ Captain last week at the Crown in HPN, we laughed, we joked, and we both talked about the current situation. Needless to say, we both know he isn’t going to see me on his seniority list, and I won’t be seeing him in the Gulfstreams.

I am wondering how the breakfast conversation would have sounded with a very senior NJA Falcon Captain. Would you have laughed and joked about the same things? You and your sorority sister sound like a couple of Delta pilots, years gone by, talking about how Leo Mullin better respect your position.

 

[GEXDriver]

I am wondering how the breakfast conversation would have sounded with a very senior NJA Falcon Captain. Would you have laughed and joked about the same things? You and your sorority sister sound like a couple of Delta pilots, years gone by, talking about how Leo Mullin better respect your position.

The NJA Falcon Captains I know voted for the TA last October.

 

[NJAFracPilot]

The NJA Falcon Captains I know voted for the TA last October.

I did. And i'm still pissed about losing the $25K signing bonus and a year's worth of the 13% raise.

 

[x402]

I did. And i'm still pissed about losing the $25K signing bonus and a year's worth of the 13% raise.

Oh come on, I bet you made that up in extended days in the first quarter. Always good to hear from one of the 17%.

How's that go,'I've got mine f**k everyone else.'