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Spectre and Spooky

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HueyPilot, if you'll forgive a comment from a retired ex-wso. I worked a little when I was in SparkVarks with both MC and AC-130s.

I have to say they are both great airplanes and great crews. But the MC-130's mission is sometimes beyond awesome.

Jim
 
Huey Pilot,

Having been an EP in AC-130Hs, I will have to tell you that the saying is true about "once in AFSOC, always in AFSOC." Special Ops requires a lot of training. You get to shoot just about everytime you fly the gunpig. You can't say that in any other type of USAF aircraft. The gunship mission has you refuel, fly low level, and do the required qual proficiencies as well. Although you are given the basics, it takes a few years to develop the ART of shooting a 105mm shell out of an airplane. Thus, 5 years is a typical commitment once you enter the Special Ops career. AFPC will allow you to sometimes goto an ATC assignment to fly T-1s or T-37s, but you will return to Special Ops in one way or another. I enjoyed my 5 years there at Hurlburt. Bosnia was winding down in 1995. The new U-model came on-line about the same time. Thus, our deployments were shared with another gunship squadron. Once I moved to the 19 SOS, the RTU, I went on deployments only when I wanted to. The typical TDY for pilots ran about 30-45 days a year. That was before 9/11. Talking to friends, now they are on the road A LOT! With this being a special ops kinda war, I can see TDY's 6 months +++. Don't believe what you hear about upgrades. If you have previous experience in other aircraft, you could upgrade in about 1 year to the left seat. The mission as well as running a crew of 14 prevents pilots straight out of UPT from upgrading any earlier than about 3-4 years. It's very rare to get pilots out of UPT though. You'll do a lot of flying around the flag-pole too. There aren't that many land ranges we can shoot on in the country. We used to be able to shoot out on the Gulf of Mexico, but fish lovers thought we were disturbing the dolphins. So, if you like TDYs to see the world, goto slick C-130s or MC-130s. We had 2 previous C-21 guys in our squadron and they all did fine. Hope I helped a little.
 
MC-130s

HueyPilot, trueblue;

Having recently separated after 9+ years flying for AFSOC, I can say it was a great time. My background is all MC-130s. I started out in the HC-130N/P Combat Shadow which was redesignated as the MC-130P. It was/is a fun plane, but expect to be TDY extensively. The MC-130P and also the MC-130E Combat Talon I are helicopter refueling platforms (and many other missions) and thus are normally tied to the helos for deployments/TDYs.

After a few years, I was lucky enough to switch over to the MC-130H Combat Talon II. This is the plane pictured in my icon. It was the Air Force's first glass cockpit and began operationally flying in the early 90s. Although the plane is slated for helo refueling pods, it is not yet been modified. What this means is that we really didn't have "rotations". Many of our TDYs were self driven and GREAT flying.

I know the focus of this thread has been on the mighty gunship, but there were a few references to the MCs. I can say this though - there is no other flying like it. A typical flight would involve a "blacked out takeoff" (no lights externally or on the rwy), a 5 hour low level or so consisting of terrain following (radar) at 250', penetration flight down to 100', air refueling (receiving), airdrop equipment/dudes, blacked out landings on crazy little landing zones, and tons of other fun/crazy stuff. It is some well trained people playing with some advanced expensive toys.

Hopefully that helps.

Goose17
 
Hawg2Hawk

Actually, the best is 2 A-10s on the wing of an AC-130. We did that in Bosnia several times. The AC-130s have a capability to designate targets with a laser. To add, gunships also have the capability to spot a target with an IR pointer. This allowed for hard target kills (tanks etc) whereby the A-10s would roll in under our direction.

There is no such thing as a permissive environment these days. Somolia was the closest thing to a permissive environment for gunships. However, I know of some crews who had to land their aircraft in Mog. So, how permissive is it when the locals take pot shots at you on take off and landing? Ask a Blackhawk pilot there, and he'd tell you it wasn't a permissive environment.

Scud hunting in Iraq was not permissive for gunships, but we did it anyway. Lost one AC-130H near Kuwait to an IR missile 31 Jan 1991 during the battle of Khafji.

Flying over Bosnia wasn't permissive either. Let's see, they shot down an F-16 and an F-117 in the same airspace AC-130s flew.

Most pilots will agree, I'd much rather fly in a permissive environment rather than a high threat environment. Reality is, depending on the mission, we are often subjected to medium to high threat. The SAM rings would disappear from the missions we had to do, only to return several days later on our off days.

But hey, at least the tanker crews over the Adriatic were getting Air Medals, while were getting Aerial Achievement Medals.

To wrap this up, the gunpig has quite a suite of defensive equipment managed by an EWO. Better than a B-1's. Future equipment will directly engage IR missiles. That's a couple years away.
 
Learjets to Herks

I'm pretty sure I'm going to put Ramstein first, followed by gunships. Then it's a toss-up between Little Rock and Pope, and MC-130s. I guess it just boils down to having to talk to some slick pilots up at the other two units. One guy I knew who flew for the 2nd AS said he was TDY overseas for 6 months out of the year flying those old beat-up E models. I had a friend of mine who was a HC-130P FE before he went to OTS, and he was gone TDY at least 6 months a year, if not more. His wife divorced him over it! If I can't be home, then being somewhere close to 'home' is the next best thing. But I think Florida is about as close as I'll get to my wife's hometown in southern Louisiana, so I may keep AFSOC high on the list even if I don't get a gunship.

Thanks alot for the info. I appreciate it all.
 
Re: Hawg2Hawk

Spectre said:
Lost one AC-130H near Kuwait to an IR missile 31 Jan 1991 during the battle of Khafji.

I read about that AC-130 he was about to disengage (he was suggested to get out by the Joint Stars and the Sentries), because the sun was rising, but he wanted to do one more pass and they got him with a shoulder fired SAM.
 
Check the Poster!

Hawg2Hawk,
That was Spectre not ExAF on the reply above. I saw the ;) and know from whence thou speakest! Cheers!:D
 

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