Southwest, AirTran Brothers and Sisters!

[PCL_128]

Jon, no need to poke them. Aren't things ugly enough around here as it is?

 

[jonjuan]

Jon, no need to poke them. Aren't things ugly enough around here as it is?

Sorry.......

 

[elcid]

With oil screaming northwards, GK will have to start some serious sucking up to apla and the airtran guys or swa will shrink. Talk about some awesome leverage. Maybe the new found leverage will translate to even better than relative seniority for at?
Looks like the tables are turned and alpa is now in the drivers seat, ladies.

Now THAT's funny! Funny in a really stupid kind of way, but funny.

That's funny like the male FA who was yelling at me and my captain at the bar the other night that Southwest hasn't hired any FA's below him because of George Bush attacking Afghanistan, and that we should have apologized to the Taliban for whatever we did to make them take down the towers. I couldn't help but laugh. But, like I told him, Johnjuan, "I see your point."

 

[jonjuan]

That's funny like the male FA who was yelling at me and my captain at the bar the other night that Southwest hasn't hired any FA's below

Did you get his number?

 

[jonjuan]

Now THAT's funny! Funny in a really stupid kind of way, but funny.

That's funny like the male FA who was yelling at me and my captain at the bar the other night that Southwest hasn't hired any FA's below him because of George Bush attacking Afghanistan, and that we should have apologized to the Taliban for whatever we did to make them take down the towers. I couldn't help but laugh. But, like I told him, Johnjuan, "I see your point."

Says a lot about what you think of your CEO.

 

[elcid]

Did you get his number?

No, that's not my deal. You shouldn't have too much of a problem snagging one of these guys though if that's your thing (I'm guessing?).

Says a lot about what you think of your CEO.

Not sure I follow you. Not sure if I want to either. Hey, whatever though. I'm not judging.

 

[Roomwithaview]

Pcl_128

I disagree with your premise. ALPA hasn't burned bridges with pilots at the regionals.

Well, we'll have to agree to disagree. In the early days of the commuters ALPA didn't really offer much in the way of support. The mainline was their only cause for concern until the regionals grew as big as they did and became a much larger contributor. Now, I hear a lot of grumbling from ALPA mainline guys for the mishandling of scope and how a HUGE portion of the mainline flying has been farmed out to the RJ. Look no further than the E190 and E195. How many seats will the next big RJ have and what mainline route will it take over?

Also, our drive at JetBlue has been going very well. The JetBlue pilots have the largest organizing committee in ALPA history, and cards are coming in at a good clip. I suspect that there will be an election in the first half of the year, and ALPA will probably be certified by a decent margin.

We'll see. I have a buddy who's trying to help get ALPA on the property and he says there's a lot of resistance. FWIW, I support your/his efforts.

ALPA has also added AirTran, ATI, North American, Colgan, and several Canadian carriers in the past few years. There isn't any indication that ALPA has "burned bridges." We've even signed a services agreement with the APA at American in recent months, and ALPA will be providing professional negotiators and financial analysis support. Many pilots are realizing the benefits of a national union and the resources that come with it

Don't get me wrong. I agree that having a national union negotiate for you has huge benefits. You guys single handedly made the Age 60 change happen and I can't tell you how many pilots at Southwest you made happy. (Well, okay about 463)

That change was going nowhere until ALPA did a 180 and decided that Age 60 was no longer a good thing and now we get five more years of the most senior guys on the property. You'll have to explain to me what changed their mind other than Woerth being shown the street.

 

[PCL_128]

Well, we'll have to agree to disagree. In the early days of the commuters ALPA didn't really offer much in the way of support. The mainline was their only cause for concern until the regionals grew as big as they did and became a much larger contributor. Now, I hear a lot of grumbling from ALPA mainline guys for the mishandling of scope and how a HUGE portion of the mainline flying has been farmed out to the RJ. Look no further than the E190 and E195. How many seats will the next big RJ have and what mainline route will it take over?

A perception of lack of support is not the same thing as an actual lack of support. The regionals have never had any problem getting resources or support from ALPA. In reality, the problem that regionals have typically had is that it's tough to get motivated and qualified volunteers from the pilot group, because most of them are only there to build time and move on. They aren't interested in fighting to improve things at their regional, because they're only concerned with getting out. When you can't get good volunteers, you can't get very far, regardless of the resources provided by the national union.

That change was going nowhere until ALPA did a 180 and decided that Age 60 was no longer a good thing and now we get five more years of the most senior guys on the property. You'll have to explain to me what changed their mind other than Woerth being shown the street.

The change was really precipitated by the IACO rule change. When ICAO changed the rule, it was going to be incredibly difficult to keep it at 60 here. I disagreed with how it was done, and I still do, but that was the reason the Association changed its position. Once ALPA got behind the change, Congressman Oberstar got the bill out of committee and it was quickly ratified. He had been holding it up for quite a while when ALPA was opposed.

 

[Roomwithaview]

Pcl

A perception of lack of support is not the same thing as an actual lack of support. The regionals have never had any problem getting resources or support from ALPA. In reality, the problem that regionals have typically had is that it's tough to get motivated and qualified volunteers from the pilot group, because most of them are only there to build time and move on. They aren't interested in fighting to improve things at their regional, because they're only concerned with getting out. When you can't get good volunteers, you can't get very far, regardless of the resources provided by the national union.

Interesting. Obviously the grumbling I was hearing was only from one side. Good point and one that can only really be understood from someone in your position. I'll throw that rebuttal out there next time I hear some ex-alpa/regional guy bitching about alpa.

What about the farming out of the mainline flying?

 

[PCL_128]

What about the farming out of the mainline flying?

Obviously a big mistake, but hindsight is 20/20. It's easy to see how pilots might have felt "back in the day" that allowing a few Beech 1900s to fly feed wouldn't be a problem. It was only after 3 decades of concessionary bargaining and bankruptcies that managements were able to extract so much more from it, and before we knew it, it was out of control. I'm not sure that a lot of it was even avoidable, thanks to the horrible bankruptcy laws that are on the books.