Somebody's Watching Us

[RightPedal]

Quoted by Cthulhu

Some folks on this board are wound entirely too tight

So true!

 

[dmspilot00]

He probably wouldn't have posted it, had he known it was "made up."

It is interesting, isn't it, that a non-religious person celebrates religious holidays. How rediculously hypocritical.

 

[WrightAvia]

our armed forces are incompetant.

They WOULD need a miracle from jebus to get their job done, right? Skill and training plays no part at all in their mission...just nuggets of kindness from jebus.

Kind of like when these 4 kids got killed this weekend in the car accident on the interstate by Fond Du Lac. It was a MIRACLE that it wasn't me! They must have been real evil, to be all of 18-19 years old and to be killed by jebus in an accident. That couple they head on'd and sent to the hospital in critical condition, was probably evil too! A miracle, I tells ya! Thank you jebus...

All good things that happen in life are MIRACLES! And bad things that happen to other people are too! Cause they could have happened to you!

 

[prodigal]

Timebuilder

Please don't apologize, no need. Just let them be irritated. Actually, it seems to me they irritate themselves by being so intolerant.

 

[chperplt]

From our perspective, God is a part of everyone's life...

That's right.... from YOUR perspective.... That's where it should stay..with you.

P.S. What do all of you anti-religion types do for Christmas, Easter, etc?

What an ignorant statement. You do realize that there are many religions in the world that do not celebrate Christmas, Easter, ect... right??? You do realize that???

But to answer your question.. Most go to the chinese buffet and then a movie.

 

[Timebuilder]

J4J=Jesus for Jets
PFT=Pray For Training

Now THAT was funny!

That's right.... from YOUR perspective.... That's where it should stay..with you.

Sorry, my friend. The Bible says different. 1 Guess you'll just have to grin and bear it. You can be consoled by one thing: during the rapture, we will rise to meet Jesus in the AIR. 2

Think we'll need a clearance?

Lighten up, bud!

1) Matthew 28:18-20
2) 1 Thess 4:16-18

Hey, it's Sunday.

 

[Dieterly]

Simple question that requires a simple answer..
Where the hell was "god" on 911, the day OK City bombing happend? Plus "it" lets 1000's of children die in Africa from AIDS, starvation EVERY DAY, why?

 

[dmspilot00]

What an ignorant statement. You do realize that there are many religions in the world that do not celebrate Christmas, Easter, ect... right??? You do realize that???

Learn the difference between a statement and a question.

I am not going to give you a response to your rediculous triple-question-marked questions. Obviously you are too upset and are not thinking logically.

I asked "What do all of you anti-religion types do for Christmas, Easter, etc?" Anti-religious meaning NO religion. If someone is anti-religious, that means they are against any religion, and shouldn't be celebrating religious holidays, no matter which ones.

I said Christmas and Easter because I was making an educated guess that they are the two most popular religious holidays in the United States. Do you realize that??? How is that ignorant??? Huh???

So, what does that fact, that there exists many people that don't celebrate those two holidays, have to do with anything? My question was singling out people who DO celebrate them, not those who DON'T. Your response makes no sense.

 

[Timebuilder]

Those who would be irritated with this answer to Dieterly's question would be advised well to not read on. However, an earnest question deserves a good answer.

I could give you twelve hours on this, as it is a favorite question of the unbeliever. In other words, "how can a loving God allow this to happen?" Simply put, WE (sinful man, unable to follow The Law) allowed it to happen.

The 60 second version is this.

1) WE (that is to say, MAN) are the responsible party for opening the door to sin. Because of this, evil is in the world, and Satan is the "prince" of this world. Bad things happen, and in great number, including the events you cited. We can act against evil, but we alone are unable to overcome it. It is a part of our heritage.

2) It isn't a part of God's plan to eliminate evil right now from our world. He has a better way of showing His love for us. First, we are to spread the gospel, preparing as many as possible for the next step by trusting Christ for salvation.

3) The rapture, or the being "caught up" to meet Christ in the air, is the step that takes believers out of this world (quite literally) for a period of seven years. During that time, Satan is free to complete his plan of one world government and forced worship (does that sound like any particular religion discussed here recently?) over all who remain on earth after this event.

4) After this seven year period, know as the Tribulation, Christ returns to earth with His followers to defeat Satan and the angels who followed him (know as demons) during his defection.

5) Christ begins His "millenial reign" on earth, with sin and death eliminated from our world. His sets up a kingdom on earth that lasts 1000 years. After that, we leave for a new Jerusalem.

To summarize, it is the sinful nature of Man, not a mistake by God, that these bad things happen. God made an unbelievable sacrifice to provide our salvation, far more than we ever could suffer. Nothing we could do would have been sufficient to attain a state that was acceptable to God. Only His perfect sacrifice was able to be a propitiation for our sin.

And that my friends, is your Easter explanation of why stuff like 9-11 happens.

On the other hand, Mayor Daley is a mystery to me.

 

[Dieterly]

Timebuilder,

You need some professional help, you are more whacked out than I thought.

 

[Timebuilder]

Thanks for the tip.

It's all 100% from the Bible.


Of course, I'm to blame here for taking the time to treat your question with enough respect to give it an answer.

What was I thinking?

 

[John Wayne]

Here is what I don't understand,
Why is it that when those who assert that religion is just as viable a topic as anything else here,take the time to answer questions that I am sure they know will turn to flame bait they get flammed, slammed, called wack jobs etc. but the "non-believer" continues to ask questions.
I want to thank time builder for the 60 sec rundown on the end times. My pastor can't even paint that clear a picture without multiple divergants to other topics.
Next I want to say to the interested non-believer, keep asking questions, read some of the Bible. No one here that I have seen has been judgeing or insisted that their way is the only way to heaven(even is it is). It is by answering questions from you who may be interested that I would hope to walk out my beliefs. It is by walking the walk not just talking the talk that you will know me.
To those who will never be convinced or are offended by religious discussion, move on. If the discussion were that far out of the rhelm of acceptability for this site it would have been removed long ago. Just back out and see what else is on the board if the discussion offends you. No one is making you stay.

GOD BLESS YOU ONE AND ALL

 

[ClassG]

I'm not a religious person. Spritritual, Yes. Religious, No.

I respect all religions for the sanctity it seems to create in people's lives. I am dissapointed by the unending conflict between the so-called peace-loving faithfuls of this world.

I am, however, forever amazed by the power of God. It seems there is no way to begin (or attempt to halt) a discussion of the subject without the point being made and the message coming through anyway.

So no matter which side of the fence you believe you're on, no one has won and no one has lost this debate. But God has once again spoken.

So who wants to be the first to tell me I'm wrong?

 

[VNugget]

How would everyone feel if people started throwing in bible passages when asking for help

I don't understand... I see pleny of references to the FARs in answers and explanations here.

 

[metrodriver]

Timebuilder, that whole story you wrote there is your belief, not mine, and in my view just a load of cr@p (OK, now I offended every religious person on this board). I'm with Dieterly about 9-11 and OKC. How about a friend of mine who lost a friend, 30 year old woman with a 4 year old kid, dies of a parasite that eats your heart, or the 4 pilots last week, was this the way god or jesus wanted it??? No way. The 'sinner' in the 4 pilot car crash lives, if there really had been some higher power that guy would have burned to death in his car.
What do I do for easter or christmas? wake up , watch tv, eat something, go to work if I'm scheduled, and go to sleep again in the evening.
I don't see much of a religious aspect in the holidays anymore here in the US. Stores are open till late or even all day. Most other countries have 2 christmas days (25 and 26 dec.), 2 easter days, good friday, and a host of other ones where pretty much everybody is off. For the sake of the almighty dollar those days have gone by the wayside and all we have left is a few hours on 4 days if you are lucky. And what happened to the sunday? Everybody is working except if you have an office job. Thought it was the day that you were required to rest from your weekly activities and devote the day to the church.
When I was a kid we did not exchange gifts on christmas, we did that on a different day, a family tradition that came from the old world long time ago.

The only reason I replied in the first post is to show te religious folks that there are people out there who don't believe, or have different beliefs that do not involve a god or jesus.
And 'spreading the gospel' is in my eyes wrong too. That to me is showing a disrespect for other religions or beliefs. If someone beliefs that a god is mad when there is a thunderstorm and consequently starts a fire to sacrifice the best animal he has, so be it. (I think it's stupid, he would have had a lot of food, milk or other benefits from this animal otherwise). This is the way our european ancesters were 1000 years ago (they had actually a god for every day of the week), and some other people around the world up to a lot more recent day, like the native americans.

 

[SushiSlayer]

First, I would like to state that though I am not religeous, I do respect all religions and those who chose to follow them. I must ask though for the Christians that tout the Bible, why is it that if the Bible holds the truth, that the world ran a gamut of other beliefs before Christiananity took hold. Like, for instance the Romans and Greeks believed in many gods to explain the ways of the universe. If the God you refer to created the universe and all in it, why wasn't he known in earlier times? I just don't get it.

How old is the bible? Isn't it like 2000 years or so? I'm sorry but I don't know alot about it's history. I'm just guessing that because I figured Jesus was around the same time all the others who wrote the bible were llike Luke, Job, and those people. Like I said, I don't know much so go easy on me if I way off here. But, if the Bible is 2000 years (or so) what about all the thousands of years before it came into existence? What was the "truth" back then?

And to the individual that wrote this,

It is interesting, isn't it, that a non-religious person celebrates religious holidays. How rediculously hypocritical.

The over-commercialized way that most people celebrate these holidays have all but disregarded their religeous roots. I think the true hypocritical ones are the people who claim to be devout Christians and still celebrate these holidays as they are now packaged: The Santa Claus, the gifts, the Easter bunny, etc. I celebrate Christmas because it's fun, not because someone decided to pretend that Jesus' birthday was December 25th, which, from what I understand it wasn't. I don't celebrate Easter because I don't have any kids but if I did, I would because it would be fun for them.

 

[SushiSlayer]

Looks like metro beat me to the point!

 

[Timebuilder]

Metrodriver: the Bible acknowleges, in so many words, that most people will regard the Gospel as "a load of cr@p". Jesus taught this in the Parable of the Sower, in Luke 8:4-8. You, my fiend, are a part of those upon whom a seed would fall, and not grow.

How about a friend of mine who lost a friend, 30 year old woman with a 4 year old kid, dies of a parasite that eats your heart, or the 4 pilots last week, was this the way god or jesus wanted it??? No way. The 'sinner' in the 4 pilot car crash lives, if there really had been some higher power that guy would have burned to death in his car.

First, as mentioned above, a lot of things happen that we don't like. They don't seem right, and they don't seem fair.

Why?

Because we see only our limited, human view. We have, at least some of us who are unacquainted with scripture, a view that God should save all "nice" people from accident or death, that all small children should be spared any pain or disfigurement, and that God should eliminate all evil, and he'd better do it RIGHT NOW! Otherwise, we refuse to have anything to do with Him.

This is one of the reasons we are referred to as children throughout the Bible. We want OUR plan to be in place, not God's plan! We don't like it! We want our plan NOW! Waaaaaah!

We see only just so much in the grand scheme of things. Once we were driven from paradise, we lost the perfect world of heaven on earth that God had created. I know this seems very basic, but it is the Biblical explanation. It isn't in God's purpose or plan to act in the manner that you describe at this point in time. The evil that happens to us and our friends on a daily basis has a PURPOSE: to drive us to our knees, to God, to trusting Him for salvation. Since this is God's plan and not ours, we have to play it by HIS rules. It's His only plan, so we are FREE to accept it OR reject it.

Just like using the FAR's in our daily flying, we are best advised to use HIS rules in our daily lives. Then, we are properly prepared for the worst: 9-11, famine, flood, you name it.

The only reason I replied in the first post is to show te religious folks that there are people out there who don't believe, or have different beliefs that do not involve a god or jesus.

That's why we support dozens of missionaries all over the world.

And 'spreading the gospel' is in my eyes wrong too.

Wrong in your eyes, but required activity according to the Bible, which is the inerrant word of God to the believer. The next time you have a hotel stay, open the nightstand drawer and read Matthew 28:18-20. It is referred to as "The Great Commission".

Man, am I glad you brought up animal sacrifices and pagan belief too. You mention some wonderful points.

The reason that animal sacrifice comes up in both ancient Jewish culture and other "pagan" beliefs is to avoid the wrath of God.

In the Jewish tradittion of the Old Testament, the sacrifice must be the BEST that the individual had to offer. This was to make up for "sin", an old Hebrew word that means "missing the mark". This is a reference to trying to live by The Law, as given by God through Moses, and failing to do so. At the same time, their scripture mentioned that someone was coming to not just "cover up" the sins with animal blood, but to actually take those sins away permanently. That someone is the Messiah, and most Jews still do not recognize Him. Jesus fulfilled ALL of the prophecy that was written of His coming for thousands of years. He is the only one who has done so in the ensuing 2000 or so years since he walked among us.



Sushislayer:

I must ask though for the Christians that tout the Bible, why is it that if the Bible holds the truth, that the world ran a gamut of other beliefs before Christiananity took hold. Like, for instance the Romans and Greeks believed in many gods to explain the ways of the universe. If the God you refer to created the universe and all in it, why wasn't he known in earlier times? I just don't get it.

Another good question. This is a lot of work, but you deserve an answer.

God "hard wired" us with a desire to seek Him. Without a clear path to do so, in OUR human opinion, we tend to make up our own ways (our own "plan" as mentioned above) that we find to be a "better" or "more caring" plan, and much of that troubles God. Here's an example.

When a host of pagan beliefs took hold after our ancestors were driven from eden, God identified a man and his family to become the seeds of a new population. His name was Noah. After the flood, sure enough, more pagan beliefs took over, and God focused on the line of Abram for his guidance. He became the father of the Jewish people, and Jesus' human family descended from Abram, whom God called "Israel". Israel the country is named after Israel the man.

To keep this short, the fact that there are many beliefs from many people doesn't make them right. That's why Matthew 28:18-20 is so important. In essence, the fate of everyone is in the successful spreading of the plan of salvation. We are required to do the best job at this that we can, because so many lives are in the balance.

I'm just guessing that because I figured Jesus was around the same time all the others who wrote the bible were llike Luke, Job, and those people. Like I said, I don't know much so go easy on me if I way off here. But, if the Bible is 2000 years (or so) what about all the thousands of years before it came into existence? What was the "truth" back then?

The new testament, that contains the four Gospel accounts (Luke is one of them) was written many years AFTER Jesus was crucified. The time right after the crucifixion is written down in ACTS, as the apostles obeyed the command to "go (ye) into all the world and preach the Gospel".

Age of the Bible: the Bible scripture itself treats this question as unimportant, so Bible scholars are left to scratch their heads. Several old testament books were written by Moses (the Pentatuch) and make up the Jewish Torah. Although Genesis is the first book, it isn't the oldest in terms of writing. Before it was written down, God's word was passed between men in a verbal tradition. The stone tablets given to Moses might have been the first written scipture. I'm not a scholar in this area.

A lot of writers must mean a lot of mistakes, right?

Nope. God guided the writers so that every word is as He wants it to be, according to 2 Timothy, 3:16-17.

not because someone decided to pretend that Jesus' birthday was December 25th, which, from what I understand it wasn't.

You are correct. This time was chosen to "over write" the existing winter solstice pagan holiday, and provided the early church an easy way to bring people to Christ without taking away a time of celebration. The FOCUS of the celebration became the birth of Christ.

I don't celebrate Easter because I don't have any kids but if I did, I would because it would be fun for them.

The presence of the rabbit in spring celebration is a symbol of fertility. Also around this time, the Jews celebrated the Passover feast and Christ was crucified. Over time, this was all condensed into a single holiday, except from the Jewish perspective.


Well, this took almost two hours, but hopefully somone gained a better understanding from my answers to their questions.

I have a new respect for pastors, for certain.

 

[na265]

Timebuilder, I am with you. Great post. It's called faith. I don't have to see Christ to know His influence in my life. I see it in my wife, my kids and the view at Fl390. I may get flamed for this statement, it's ok, I have my faith and know who I am and what I believe.

 

[brianjohn]

I think Mr. Concorde is more mature than a lot of two year olds on this board.
Several people have said it already, and I'll say it again. It's obvious people feel free to share their thoughts, opinions about womanizing, drinking, etc., without getting flamed. So why does someone get flamed for mentioning "God", and "prayer"?
I read the thread about the "best bars." I don't agree with it so guess what: I hit the back button and read something else.
Not too difficult.