So much for strike leverage at DAL

[densoo]

They quickly dove into BK and started to fix the problem... three years ago. American and CAL were well ahead of them.

"well ahead"--I'll say. CAL busted the pilot unions and declared BK twice more than a decade ago and has had wages and benefits down at the bottom of the pile ever since. A ten year head start on a competetive advantage and plenty of time to "make it work." What is surprising is that they haven't done better considering the cost advantage they've had all these years. And they need $80M from the FAs?

 

[ms6073]

What most of us fail to see that in a population of 295,000,000 people only 639,000 of us are licensed pilots and that is including recreational to ATP. We have this country by the balls if we just walk off the job on any given day.

I am curious, did not have time to search with google but say this comes to a head in Bankruptcy court resulting in the union placing the pilots in the position to strike, what is to prevent management from lobbying the White House? I seem to recall that in past labor disputes with national impact, at one point not too long ago the President at the time interceded to prevent a strike by injecting a cooling off period or am I way off base?

 

[ultrarunner]

I seem to recall that in past labor disputes with national impact, at one point not too long ago the President at the time interceded to prevent a strike by injecting a cooling off period or am I way off base?

Close, but not quite. What you're referring to is a Presidental Emergency Board (PEB). An employee group operating under a CBA that falls under the guidelines of the RLA may seek 'self help' (strike) at the end of the cooling off period when a mediator declares an impass in negotiations on a contract that became ammendable.

That is not what is going on here.

IMO, this would not apply if the 1113c hearing is sucessful for Delta. Delta management wishes to toss out the CBA, effectively ending Delta pilot represention. In essence, if the labor contract is cancelled, the pilots really would not be striking, they would simply be walking off the job, and the PEB would be able to prevent that.

No one group can have it both ways.

 

[General Lee]

Close, but not quite. What you're referring to is a Presidental Emergency Board (PEB). An employee group operating under a CBA that falls under the guidelines of the RLA may seek 'self help' (strike) at the end of the cooling off period when a mediator declares an impass in negotiations on a contract that became ammendable.

That is not what is going on here.

IMO, this would not apply if the 1113c hearing is sucessful for Delta. Delta management wishes to toss out the CBA, effectively ending Delta pilot represention. In essence, if the labor contract is cancelled, the pilots really would not be striking, they would simply be walking off the job, and the PEB would be able to prevent that.

No one group can have it both ways.

So, can you explain this part of the transcript:


ALPA attorney asked CFO Bastian if DL had a contingency plan for a
possible pilot strike. CFO replied, "we have a legal opinion that a
strike would not be allowed under the RLA". Judge interrupted to ask,
"What does the RLA have to do with this". CFO repeats his statement.
Judge says, " I don't believe the Federal courts have the power to
enjoin a strike. I know I certainly don't."


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Draginass]

The management shysters will tell everyone that the RLA is still in affect after an 1113, but that's just the standard corporate lawyer lies.

It's all BS anyway. If the pilots walk, the company shutsdown. The key point to remember is that the pilots WON'T walk. They don't have the nuts to. They're going to take what management gives 'em, just like U and UAL. Watch NW. That's the real show. NW wants to break their unions, but good. They want to humiliate them and drive 'em into the ground, like they did with the mechanics.

 

[ultrarunner]

Opps..typo on my part...

I meant to say:

"....and the PEB would NOT be able to prevent that...."

And the judge seems to be of that opinion as well as shown in her comments posted by General above.

 

[michael707767]

King said that he expected Delta pilots -- who are fighting the airline's bid to void their contract in bankruptcy court -- to vote against a strike if the judge hearing the case rules against them.

Have to disagree there. Smart or not, I bet this pilot group votes to strike is a contract is imposed.

 

[ultrarunner]

I would agree. IMO, if management gets what it wants, I don't believe the government will inteject and prevent a "strike". Delta management metality has shown they look out for themselves, and place the shareholders and everyone else after. So IF the pilots walk and shut down the airline, I don't really think Delta will give a crapola.

 

[General Lee]

I would agree. IMO, if management gets what it wants, I don't believe the government will inteject and prevent a "strike". Delta management metality has shown they look out for themselves, and place the shareholders and everyone else after. So IF the pilots walk and shut down the airline, I don't really think Delta will give a crapola.

Who does care? How about the creditors, the State of Georgia, the City of Atlanta, the 25 million Skymiles members through American Express, and probably some other people? So, I would think that management is getting an earfull from some of these.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[GeneralAv]

where can one find the transcripts?

 

[GogglesPisano]

Delta Pilots May Consider Vote to Strike
Wednesday December 7, 7:25 pm ET
By Aleksandrs Rozens, AP Business Writer Delta Air Lines Pilots May Consider Vote to Strike if Carrier Managers Impose Changes on Contract

NEW YORK (AP) -- Delta Air Lines Inc. pilots may consider a vote to strike if the bankrupt airline's managers impose changes on their contract, a pilots union spokesman said Wednesday.
The airline has asked a bankruptcy judge to let it scrap its current contract with pilots, as part of its efforts to emerge from bankruptcy. Delta, besieged by rising fuel costs and stiffer competition, filed for bankruptcy protection on Sept. 14.
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"It is our contention that if they start imposing their terms we will start defending the contract," Air Lines Pilot Association spokesman John Culp told The Associated Press. "If we hit Dec. 16 and they stick to their plan to start imposing conditions ... we'll consider any and all legal options."
Delta spokeswoman Chris Kelly said the airline would consider extending the Dec. 16 deadline "if we felt a consensual agreement could be reached."
"Our strong preference is to negotiate in good faith and reach a consensual agreement," she said.
Wednesday was the ninth day of hearings focused on the airline's motion to dismiss its current contract with its 6,000 pilots. So far, the hearings have focused on testimony from Delta executives and a Wall Street investment banker advising the airline.
Bankruptcy law provides that a debtor can impose changes to a contract 30 days after making a request in court. Delta made such a request for contract changes in mid-November.

The Delta pilot union's master executive council -- 13 union representatives throughout the country -- is slated to meet on Thursday. Culp said the union pilot representatives may consider giving the union's chairman the ability to call for a strike ballot. It could take weeks from the launch of a ballot to a strike vote tally, said Culp.
While Delta has said such a strike would be illegal and a violation of the Railway Labor Act (RLA), Culp said ALPA believes it has the right to strike if the pilots contract is rejected. Delta's chief financial officer Edward Bastian has said a strike by pilots would be "devastating" to the carrier.
Culp said that if management starts imposing terms, many pilots would quit. "There are a lot of pilots actively looking for work elsewhere. If management starts imposing their terms, they will have a problem operating the airline," he said.
Culp would not state how many of the 6,000 ALPA pilots are seeking employment at other airlines. "This is not a union directed action. These pilots are making an individual career decision," he said.
Delta's Kelly declined to comment on speculation that the pilots are looking elsewhere for jobs.

 

[COpilot]

At the last second, there will be an agreement, the DL pilots will accept UA + 1%.

Lets move on to the next subject.

www.airlinepilotpay.com

 

[ultrarunner]

At the last second, there will be an agreement, the DL pilots will accept UA + 1%.

Lets move on to the next subject.

www.airlinepilotpay.com

HA...

The day's of chest-thumping, high-fiving and cocky flight back stickers is OVER!

And I'm sure everyone will agree that those days were good while they lasted.

 

[whymeworry?]

Why is it that the herd wants to all of a sudden believe analysts? Trust me, I have inside knowledge on these tools. Most, if not all Wall Street analysts claim to be experts on an industry or field yet most of them very often overestimate the timing of their comments. They're nothing more than glorified journalists.

Just this week two anaylsts came out and said CAL and AMR will trade higher. Duh! Ummm... where were these guys 3 months ago when the stocks were 40 and 50% lower resepctively? Now they want people to go buy airline stocks once they've rallied? As if these stocks are going to go up another 50% in the next 3 months? They wait for stocks to rally, or to crash, then they go "out on a limb" with some magnificent prediction. And like a script from a cheap hollywood movie, right about the time they come out with glowing predictions of better times for the airlines, their firms issue new stock of these companies (usually for a princely fee). But there's no conflict of interest there. No. It's all honest on Wall Street and the SEC is looking out for you, Joe Blow individual investor. Yeah!

The analyst everyone is referring to on this thread is no different a clown. Now that DAL is teetering on the edge he predicts a liquidity crisis? Puuleeese. DAL's financial position has been on edge for over two years. Anyone who follows them could have made a prediction of liquidation a long time ago. Remember, however, big airlines die a slow death. And big DAL ain't goin' anywhere right now. How long did it take Pan Am to die? Over a decade... same goes for T-way, 2 decades. Just 6 months ago everyone thought UAL was all but done for. Wall Street is one of the most corrupt market systems known to man. But they will never allow you to beleive it. I would venture to say someone put this analyst up to these public comments in an effort to scare the "line pukes" into voting down a strike ballot. DAL will still be around, whether the pilots strike or not. They may face a liquidity crisis but that's why their in CH 11!!! READ: THEY NO LONGER HAvE TO PAY THEIR BILLS THE WAY EVERYONE ELSE DOES! Hence, there really is no liquidity crisis at DAL. Ahhh the beauty of the US Court system. Just a bunch of hot air out of Wall Street (because their in bed with DAL mgmt and we all know Wall Street both hates labor and completely underestimates labor) in order to appease the upper management at DAL. This is part of the investment banking relationship between DAL and their Wall Street syndicate firms. These firms get hundreds of millions of dollars in banking fees to restructure a company. It's a well-orchestrated game. And once again, Wall Street underestimates the labor side of the equation. Can't hardly blame them though, they don't teach Labor 101 at Harvard or Yale Business School.

 

[General Lee]

Whymeworry?.

"DAL will still be around, whether the pilots strike or not."

Delta will be around if the pilots strike? Are you kidding me? Gone. They haven't been able to train any replacements for the PRPs since last Summer (only 200 pilot trainings). And the ASA pilots will NOT be allowed to fly any of the Delta routes because they are ALPA too. So, unless you have a bunch of connections from Lynchburg to Baton Rouge, I think it will sink. I hope it doesn't get to that, but you never know....


Bye Bye--General Lee