Slam Dunk In Florida...

[kilroy]

Has anyone else flying down the West coast of Fl. having problems with Jax slam dunking 35 N. of Lakeland at some ridiculous altitude. Everytime I come into Srq area we get a descend that would require 4000 VSI minimum to meet a restriction. This happens all the time. Lately I've been refusing the crossing restriction.

 

[mnixon]

I haven't gotten it personally, but I have been hearing it a lot on freq lately

 

[Flechas]

What's the problem with that? Unless you have a 150 kts tailwind you should be able to make it. I don't mind doing slam dunks, in fact, one once in a while changes the everyday rutine.
What kind of airplane do you fly?

 

[kilroy]

Descends at 350knots indicated and 420 knots across the ground to get down to loose 19000 feet in 20 miles requires a descent **CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED** near resemblingan unusual attitude. Not to mention your pax's are looking straight down to the ground. Might be fun if you are hauling freight but not pax. Not to mention trying to keep the cabin pressurized with the throttles at idle.

 

[Flechas]

Now thats pushing it, the max we can do is 4500 fpm with the boards out and iddle. In that case I'd say unable too. That would take almost 7000 fpm.

What do you fly?

Descends at 350knots indicated and 420 knots across the ground to get down to loose 19000 feet in 20 miles requires a descent **CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED** near resemblingan unusual attitude. Not to mention your pax's are looking straight down to the ground. Might be fun if you are hauling freight but not pax. Not to mention trying to keep the cabin pressurized with the throttles at idle.

 

[labbats]

Request lower prior to that point.

 

[Headwind]

JAX center gave me one this week that required 7600 fpm - I did not accept it and after about 30 seconds he said the next controller said to continue with a normal descent, then handed me off. I think about 3000 fmp is enough. It's not your fault the controller waits too long to give a crossing restriction. If you accept it and then can't do it you are at fault.

HEADWIND

 

[O-Line]

Has anyone else flying down the West coast of Fl. having problems with Jax slam dunking 35 N. of Lakeland at some ridiculous altitude. Everytime I come into Srq area we get a descend that would require 4000 VSI minimum to meet a restriction. This happens all the time. Lately I've been refusing the crossing restriction.

There's several of those "uncharted" descent points around the country. After getting slammed a couple of times, I just program the FMS to meet the restriction, before I get it.

That way when you get that initial descent say from FL390 to FL350 you're already coming down at an appropriate rate, and more often then not, right when you're about to level at FL350, you'll get "continue decent to FL310".

What happens is ATC has LOU's with the adjacent facility to cross you at that point, but as often happens someone's below you and they have to step you down. When you finally clear that traffic is when you finally get that "cross XVY at FL-10"

 

[FracCapt]

What's the problem with that? Unless you have a 150 kts tailwind you should be able to make it. I don't mind doing slam dunks, in fact, one once in a while changes the everyday rutine.
What kind of airplane do you fly?

You don't think that a 4000fpm required descent rate to meet a restriction is excessive? Screw that...I'm not throwing the boards out, and making it an uncomfortable and noisy ride for the pax because a controller wants me to make a BS descent.

 

[Flechas]

You don't think that a 4000fpm required descent rate to meet a restriction is excessive? Screw that...I'm not throwing the boards out, and making it an uncomfortable and noisy ride for the pax because a controller wants me to make a BS descent.

Once in a while is not big deal, if it were to happen everyday then I'dn't accept it. For the most part controllers start you down way out.
That's what the boards are for, to be used, I don't understand why so many people are afraid of using them. I understand the pax comfort thing, but if a controller needs help once in a while, I'd be glad to help.
What I try to do to improve pax comfort is make the transition smooth. Some peole want to strart down way out at only 2000 fpm, but when the go from level to 2000 fpm they give the pax a "0 G".