Shuttle America Sale completed.

[I.P. Freley]

I concur. The likes of aewanabe would be a pleasure to work with.

Popeye? Less so.

 

[AutoCars Armed]

As pointed in recurrent, by mgmt, either company can get out of the flying with 180 day notice...but once again I am sure mgmt didn't tell us everything as with the Saab returns...

If SA is going to keep flying these things and extend the leases how are they planning on staffing them. People are going to leave if the Jr Manning keeps going and/or increases....Contray to HDQ cushy schedules the pilots have lives outside of this company.

 

[BoilerUP]

Popeye - proof positive that the feeling of entitlement goes far beyond any university graduate. A staple is the only 'fair integration'? Do ya even know what happened between TWA and American? Have you ever heard of Allegeny-Mohawk?

Many of the captains you are flying with started their careers slinging gear in a Saab or RJ back in the late 90s, without having to fly for Airnet or Ram. Please, tell THEM how insignificant the SA pilots are for flying their measly 340s; I'm sure they'll be sympathetic to your background.

 

[OldManPilot]

Read the SA contract.. Not much there to support a strong argument for a fair seniority integration.

Prepare for the worst, and hope for the best.

 

[AutoCars Armed]

Popeye - proof positive that the feeling of entitlement goes far beyond any university graduate. A staple is the only 'fair integration'? Do ya even know what happened between TWA and American? Have you ever heard of Allegeny-Mohawk?

Many of the captains you are flying with started their careers slinging gear in a Saab or RJ back in the late 90s, without having to fly for Airnet or Ram. Please, tell THEM how insignificant the SA pilots are for flying their measly 340s; I'm sure they'll be sympathetic to your background.

First of all, I have no feeling of entitlement and have worked hard, as many others have, to get where I am at today. I have no problem staying in the Saab and flying them to they go away. What I and the pilot group would appreciate is some communication from mgmt to the pilot group. The half truths and non-answers are getting to be a little old and serve no purpose other than to lower morale.

Second aewanabe said it best, the general pilots have no say in the aquisition and merger and it will be up the boards to hammer it out.

 

[AZ Typed]

Isn't this all trivial...UAL will be out of business within the coming year(s) - then what will happen? Be careful counting your chickens so soon. As soon as one Major is gone (brining a needed market correction) a Regional will follow (and if all your eggs are in one BIG BLUE basket - you're "F"-ed)

 

[cargoflyr69]

Isn't this all trivial...UAL will be out of business within the coming year(s) - then what will happen? Be careful counting your chickens so soon. As soon as one Major is gone (brining a needed market correction) a Regional will follow (and if all your eggs are in one BIG BLUE basket - you're "F"-ed)

I agree, all the eggs in one basket is bad. In this case Wexford/Republic have the eggs in 4 baskets (UAL, USair, AA, and DL) wexford also seems to have the market cornered on the E170's. I think they own and/or possess options on just about every airframe in the us for the forseeable future. even if one of the codeshares tank, there will be business to be had out there.

 

[PGTB]

When does flying start for SA?

 

[StuckInASaab]

Read the SA contract.. Not much there to support a strong argument for a fair seniority integration.

Prepare for the worst, and hope for the best.

Article 1 SCOPE: "The company in the event of a merger or aquisition will to the best of its ability, try to integrate the pilot seniority by date of hire." (not word for word, but it does say date of hire.)

DOH, That sounds like a "pretty strong argument for fair seniority integration."

ESPECIALLY WHEN WE ARE DEALING WITH TWO GROUPS OF TEAMSTERS!!! Know your facts...

Revenue on June 1.

 

[Old Jballer]

try to integrate the pilot seniority by date of hire."

Try is a very big GRAY WORD. Doesn't your contract have a section called management rights, reads something like they can void any area of your contract? Anyway I don't post hear very often but all I can tell you is a DOH WILL NEVER HAPPEN!! Yes we are both teamsters but from 2 different locals (that means alot). I promise you no matter what happens it doesn't effect me one bit, I do hope that we can reach some agreement. One note the longer it takes the more likely SA will have 400 plus pilots ahead of them from Mid Atlantic and if takes to the end of the year the SF340s will be gone and so will its pilots.(do you really think the company cares if you stay or are street) It's all about money how can they save it. ROLL THE DICE

 

[SlapShot]

If the merger takes to the end of the year, first it makes the Teamsters look like idiots for having such animosity within their own union.

Secondly, if the 170's are on the Shuttle America certificate all the Saab pilots will be senior to the ones flying to the 170 therefore it would be the 170 pilots that would be furloughed. (Keeping in mind that without any integration the 2 seniority lists would be kept separate). I know Chautauqua/Republic (whoever) has a history of furloughing out of seniority but it is my understanding that all those affected by that after 9/11 were still on probation. No one at SA will still be on probation at the end of 2005.

It is probably going to go to arbitration. Who knows how long that will take?

All we can do as line pilots is sit and wait.

 

[Flash]

Hey I.P.

Are you paying your dues flying cargo?

When is the best time to call? I don't want to wake you up.

DG

 

[OldManPilot]

Article 1 SCOPE: "The company in the event of a merger or aquisition will to the best of its ability, try to integrate the pilot seniority by date of hire." (not word for word, but it does say date of hire.)

DOH, That sounds like a "pretty strong argument for fair seniority integration."

ESPECIALLY WHEN WE ARE DEALING WITH TWO GROUPS OF TEAMSTERS!!! Know your facts...

Revenue on June 1.

You are correct... read what you wrote.... it says "Do its best" that is not merger protection. That is perhaps the weakest language there is.
Everyone wants what is best; however, CHQ CBA language is much stronger on this, plus SA language is weak at best. I hope for something fair, but won't be supprised to see some kind of staple happen here.

 

[I.P. Freley]

Hey I.P.

Are you paying your dues flying cargo?

I'm not paying my dues for another week, I think... You can call anytime.

 

[blott]

any of the 9/11 terminated CHQ guys still at SA?

 

[FlyingDawg]

The best case for the SA pilots would be a DOH. Worst case is a staple. The result will be something inbetween.

 

[I.P. Freley]

Actually, best case for the SA pilots is a ratio merge starting at the top of the list... But even an SA pilot would have to admit to the unfairness of THAT scenario, as the number 1 SA pilot being merged in at, say, #10 on the CHQ list would have a hire date well after the person on the CHQ list that would follow him. Straight DOH isn't exactly fair, either, as you'd have to feel for the poor stooge who was the first CHQ newhire after 9/11 (when they had a nearly year-long break without hiring, I understand), who'd magically have a dozen people materialize on the list immediately above them.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, put the #1 SA pilot in at DOH and do a ratio merge from then on down, unless the ratio merge puts a Shuttle pilot higher than he/she should be by DOH... So basically, ratio merge that puts no SA pilot above someone with an earlier hire date. That would be most fair for all involved, and no individual CHQ pilot gets the screws put to them more than another.

 

[PapaGiorgio]

Anyone know if UPS is hiring? I hear they get great crew meals.

 

[Fred Flamebait]

Well let's hope are MEC's stick to their guns and accomplish nothing. Then we can get an arbitraitor to decide this mess. Spin the wheel. Get Date of Hire. 2 seperate lists. Alleganey-Mohawk. Or he can come up with some new precedence considering CHQ is not aquiring SA; RAH is. We should have worked this out years ago when SA came in and stole CHQ's SAAB's. They were a one airplane airline then. Let's face it they've been operating us as one airline for years now.

 

[SlapShot]

Well let's hope are MEC's stick to their guns and accomplish nothing. Then we can get an arbitraitor to decide this mess. Spin the wheel. Get Date of Hire. 2 seperate lists. Alleganey-Mohawk. Or he can come up with some new precedence considering CHQ is not aquiring SA; RAH is. We should have worked this out years ago when SA came in and stole CHQ's SAAB's. They were a one airplane airline then. Let's face it they've been operating us as one airline for years now.

Well said my friend.

 

[I.P. Freley]

We should have worked this out years ago when SA came in and stole CHQ's SAAB's.

Buuuuuaaaaahahahahahahaha!

You are smarter than anyone else, my friend, you caught onto "The Plan"! Steal CHQ's Saabs! CHQ fought and scraped to keep them, they didn't want to HAVE TO go fly an RJ, they were STOLEN from CHQ!

Thanks for the best laugh I've had in weeks! PRICELESS!!

 

[Weasel Keeper]

*bump* (not for the crap, but for more info rather than numbnuts bringing up 3 year old posts ahead of this)

So, we (SA) have ac (E-170) 631 on our plot for proving runs/acceptance. I doubt we'll see her anytime soon, and other than the emergency lighting problem shown on the MOC plot...how's she doing? BTW, just curious, what's 631's N number?

As one of the SA mechanic's aquired by RJET, I'm hoping it's going to be as nice as when I worked for CHQ three years ago (no doubt from my end). I just hope the aircrews can figure out a way to get along since both groups are very professional. As you CA's and FO's figure it out, we mech's are looking foward to receiving the upgraded benefits that just aren't happening with SA. Best of luck to all involved, and as an ex Teamster (414) for a foodservice warehouse...stick to your guns for whatever you believe. Just don't screw the pooch...mmm'kay?

 

[Chicken Taco]

Weasel,

It's N631RW. We had a stupid with it a few days ago in IND. It was parked since it's not currently in revenue service, and one of the active planes broke and needed a card that wasn't in stock. MX went to rob 631, but OOPS! it's a different airline, can't mix and match parts from two carriers without paperwork that isn't done yet. SOP around here lately, this is gonna get real fun when the third cart goes online. Welcome back, have fun here. If you're an old FWA hangar guy I probably know ya..

..CT

 

[SlapShot]

What is going to happen to the FWA hanger? I do not think Wexford/Republic own it. Anyone have any idea how long SA's lease is for? What is the rumor going around FWA about the future of SA's HDQ? Would Republic want to keep it in FWA just to keep the certificate out of the IND FSDO?

 

[AutoCars Armed]

What is going to happen to the FWA hanger? I do not think Wexford/Republic own it. Anyone have any idea how long SA's lease is for? What is the rumor going around FWA about the future of SA's HDQ? Would Republic want to keep it in FWA just to keep the certificate out of the IND FSDO?

According to Warren Wilkenson from RJET. Republic is looking at trying to keep FWA open but it all depends on many factors such as flights out for FWA and tax breaks and concessions from the city. They have measured the hangers and the 170 will fit in FWA...It is a lot of guessing here but FWA may stay if they can find something to do with it.

 

[AutoCars Armed]

Buuuuuaaaaahahahahahahaha!


You are smarter than anyone else, my friend, you caught onto "The Plan"! Steal CHQ's Saabs! CHQ fought and scraped to keep them, they didn't want to HAVE TO go fly an RJ, they were STOLEN from CHQ!

Thanks for the best laugh I've had in weeks! PRICELESS!!

I'll have to agree with IP Freley....Shuttle just stole those old beatup Saab from CHQ. LOL

 

[Fred Flamebait]

I'm just saying a precedence has been set. SA took planes from CHQ before and didn't want to merge lists then. So now they want to merge lists when SA gets CHQ'S hand me down 170's. I think there's an argument to keep the lists seperate. CHQ did nothing to help their SA brothers out for 4 years Wexford/ Republic has been running both airlines as a single carrier.

 

[godsgift2aviatn]

I.P., Mutant Merge? With friends like you.........

 

[PERSON]

The SA chief pilot came in to talk to the class going on last friday. Nice guy, very impressed with his laid back attitude and to the point with all questions asked. Pretty much in a nut shell said a staple is out of the question as well as a 12:1 or 13:1 ratio merge as that would not be fair either. I think it will probably be along the lines of what I.P. Freely was saying which I think would also be the best thing as well. As far as going to arbitration he said that would not happen and worst case situation would be taken to the intertnational level to get resolved. However I do not even think that will happen. I think (and any thing is subject to change) that this will all be resolved in the talks between the two pilot groups. Best of luck and look towards seeing everyone very soon under ONE roof.

 

[I.P. Freley]

I.P., Mutant Merge? With friends like you.........

Beg pardon?