Shutdown

[dsptchrnja]

Without the union people would get fired for not flying through a storm, calling in sick or tired or not having the proper catering on board, even though thats handled by another department.

Thankyou for this statement. It helps me understand exactly why you depend on the union. In a word: FEAR.

Not sure, however, how you would explain that not a single non-union NJI or EJM pilot has ever been fired for any of these things. Furthermore, since the FOM says you are not even allowed to fly near a storm, you are more likely to be fired if you did. In short, your fears are unfounded.

You will convince very few pilots at NJA that the union is bad for them.

I believe you are right... but yet it's tough to overlook the obvious history and facts. Let me simplify. Since the first day I started here until now I have been given aproximately a 285% raise (includes self-paced promotions). I can count on 1 or 2 raises a year. And I'm not special, any non-bargaining employee who has worked here as long as I and has taken relatively the same career path has seen about the same results, give or take.
The kicker is this - I have never had to ask for a single penny.

Now YOU work for the same company except you have a contract and you pay an organization your own cash to negotiate, debate, plead, argue, and enter into endless disputes to acquire a raise for you (also at the company's expense)...and since that is not enough you have to take matters into your own hands, like your doing today on your own time, trying to engage others to sympathize with your cause. Results to date: All talk, same pay. You can't place the entire blame for the company when during the same time it gave it's non-bargaining employees regular and significant raises and great benefit package. NJA can't even give it's FO's better pay outside of negotiations because the union stands in the way (hurts negotiating clout).

Now how in God's green earth are you going to persuade me that your union is the best thing going for you when to date they have not negotiated a basic salary increase in the same time that I have been with the company? Yah, where do I sign up? Get me a union so I can stop getting raises and instead just argue over it for years!! What a headache unions can be. If NJA pilots were non-union I speculate they would be better paid and there would be less disappointment PERIOD.

 

[Diesel]

man these posts just crack me up.

do you guys dispatcher just went on a rant that took him time to type out and explain when in reality it doesn't matter. He doesn't work the line, he's not in the union, he has no vote which means he is just holding on.

He can speculate all he wants but the only way anyone will see what he says is to get on an aviation message board and spout the same crap he tells his boyfriend. It's old and tiring.

There is nothing you can do about it. the union is here PERIOD.

Funny how he forgot to mention the 300+ pilots picketing infront of fbo's around the country. Including cmh.

 

[Bad Monkey!]

100 pilots picketing in front of Easton in Columbus! pilots in BED, CLT, VNY, close to 400 total!

Oh what a beautiful sight!!

Can't wait for the Red October games to begin!

Looking forward to Black November also!

Peso Bill, see that little light flashing? that's your career as president going down the crapper!

 

[FAcFriend]

100 pilots picketing in front of Easton in Columbus! pilots in BED, CLT, VNY, close to 400 total!

Oh what a beautiful sight!!

Can't wait for the Red October games to begin!

Looking forward to Black November also!

Peso Bill, see that little light flashing? that's your career as president going down the crapper!

Um, bad Monkey- Were YOU in CMH? I dont think you had 100 walkers...at time change when you had both shifts on, you had closer to 75..and lots of wives.

but i did hear the pilots marched with great precision. though lots more happening at the office today- not to steal your thunder, but more pressing stuff going on...

 

[AKAAB]

I'll bet the few airlines that are hiring will let applications from striking fractional pilots sift to the bottom of the pile. Of course, we all know that there isn't a single frax pilot that would ever want to work for an airline.

I hope you get what you want, but I also hope you are prepared to pay the price for any gains you receive.

AKAAB

 

[Diesel]

talk about a weird post from akaab?

so because we are fighting to make our lives better that's a bad thing?

 

[loverobot]

Just curious, is a dispatcher required for a fractional operator? Does the FAA require a dispatcher to sign off on a release for 91k or 135 flights as they are with a 121 operation?

 

[You're right]

..........I also hope you are prepared to pay the price......."

AKAAB

Aaaah, but Diesel, this is actually fairly perceptive of "akaab".

Let's summarize the current situation today at NetJets:

• Continued practice of "slowdown" (what is it now, 61% availability/day); yeah yeah I know, "older airplanes" even though the average aircraft is 4.7 years old
• Service issues from SOME crewmembers, (read a survey today from an owner that said, "I was in a great mood until I showed up for my aircraft. The crew would not assist me with my bags and was very grumpy to me")
• How about the ever increasing epidemic known as DNIF

I must say your plan is unfolding well, but we are losing owners.

Fewer owners = fewer airplanes = fewer pilots

"....be prepared to pay the price". Don't kid yourself thinking that this isn't a very real possibility. The question is, will you be 1,900 or 1,800 or 1,700 or 1,600 "strong" when it happens?

 

[Diesel]

You can take a brand new airplane fly it 1500 hours a year and it's going to break like it was an old worn out plane. Especially if it was a cessna.

Actually the older airplanes perform better because all the stuff that breaks on the newer airplanes have been replaced.

I am prepared to pay the price. Trust me the pilots aren't the one that oversold the fleet. Look at your pilot satisfaction charts they are through the roof. OS and Scheduling have just about sunk the company.

But that's okay. It's the pilots fault too.

 

[You're right]

Diesel, you state "You can take a brand new airplane fly it 1500 hours a year and it's going to break like it was an old worn out plane. Especially if it was a cessna.

Actually the older airplanes perform better because all the stuff that breaks on the newer airplanes have been replaced."

If you are going to quote company figures, please get the facts correct. The reality is ALL of our aircraft fly less than 1000 hours per year, not 1500 as you state. This is publicly posted information each month; call your CP if you need the details.

Second, we are operating each day with aircraft availability south of 65%. Write ups such as "the day dimmer switch would not illuminate brightly enough during the day", "the tootsie roll was stuck in the cabinet drawer" or how about the "the rubber cap on the hydraulic pressure test button had an 'apparent' tear in it". EACH one of these write-ups downed the aircraft and DELAYED AN OWNER (yes, shame on the company for not having SERVICE MEL's)

The reality is, that this is leverage that some pilots choose to exercise, and as I stated earlier, the strategy is working well for the union. Aircraft availability is at its all time lowest point. Don't insult either of our intelligence with statements like "Actually the older airplanes perform better ....." We both understand and accept "the chicken game" for what it is.

All I'm asking, is that when some pilots post on here, "tick tock", "Red October", "Black November", "Happy Holidays", etc are you prepared to accept the business ramifcations of these actions?

Some time in the very near future, the "chicken game" will end and BUSINESS decisions will be made. This "chapter" in aviation has been written many times before, NetJets is no different.

Again, fewer owners = fewer aircraft = fewer pilots

This is not a pilot issue Diesel. There is culpability on both sides of this TEAM, and both sides will pay a large price if the equation above plays out. I can only wonder if your seniority number is high enough to protect you when it does.