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Dam, sorry about the ******************** storm

Enjoy your freedom of speech and your leming and ostrich way of life.

We have to go some where. Why can't we go some where that has BBQ?

Where do you want me to go... I'm asking where?

And the next day? And the next day?

Fight em there or fight em here?

Which would you rather do?

Cumbaya ain't gonna work!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by av8tor4239
First of all, I do not appreciate your steriotype of me based on my views of our governments decsion to attack Iraq. I do support our military, and love our country. This all began when a statement was made that an Army Citation was flying around without a mission on fuel paid for by the people of America.

Finding the best BBQ in the US is not helping the effort in Iraq.

How do you know? You seem to make statements you know nothing about. When I was there we would barbeque every Thursday outside the hooch. It was a GREAT way to escape from the things we faced on a daily basis. I am sure you have done the same. What can you tell me about stressed out soldiers and job performance? Have you been there to be able to make this type of statement about this guys BBQ? Soldiers are a different breed. Not everyone can do the job. We make light of alot of things to hide stress or help relieve it. My wife says I need to talk more about what I am doing but I DON'T like to bring it home. I suspect this guy may either have it really good or is making light of a bad situation.....you and I don't know but you have already assumed you do. I would like to know what you base it on? Do you know him?



Quote:
Originally Posted by av8tor4329
As far as the definition of invasion: I feel that we have taken over control of Iraq and if we leave CONTROL WILL BE LOST AND THE COUNTRY WILL FALL IN TO CIVIL WAR AND BECOME EVEN WORSE THAN IT IS NOW.. MAYBE ANOTHER SOMOLIA. This is just my opinion..

I feel the same way. President Bush told America it was going to be a long war. EVERYONE knew that going into it. We have been in Japan and Germany since the end of WW2 and I suspect we will maintain a presence in Iraq as well. That is a good thing. That is where we are going to be and need to be to gain control of these radical fundamentalists that will attack our country again if given the chance. I am all for fighting them in the mideast instead of over here in America.



Quote:
Originally Posted by av8tor4329
I support our troops in their efforts even though I dissagree with the invasion of Iraq. The troops are operating under orders from the higher powers and they can not control where their government sends them.

Only time will tell if the Iraq War was a good or bad thing for the long and short term. You certainly don't know.



Quote:
Originally Posted by av8tor4329
Remember ALQaida was not in Iraq until we opened the door for them and invited them in.

Where would you rather fight them? They attacked us...remember?



Quote:
Originally Posted by av8tor4329
I dont dog you for being a right wing fanatical bible thumping christian fundamentalist out to get all the muslems and continuing the Crusades in the 21 centry.. so please do not dog me for my views!

So what would that make you?
 
I know I am not going to convince you all that the USA's invasion of Iraq was completely unjustified, and had nothing to do with the attack on our country on 9/11/01.

I also know that as long as you are flying your citation to nowhere and justifying as fighting the enemy over there you will be happy.

Enjoy your BBQ, you know where I stand.

PS.. you all are really good at name calling!
 
I respect your views.

I just take exception to 'CNN' views. I am tired of it. Regardless of what went on or goes on in Iraq, the media doesn't report the whole story, just the parts that support political agendas (usually those with your viewpoints more than others) and it bothers me.

I have seen it first hand. I know what was going on because I was a part of it. I get back from a mission and watch how it is reported and it looks like something else with a LARGE political slant to it. Everyone gets it....the media hates President Bush, the War on Terror and anything that happens that is bad and will shed a poor light on the situation. It gets reported over and over again, while things that happen for good, rarely get more than a minute or so and then it is off to another story.

I don't blame you or anyone else with your beliefs. That is all you know. However, when you start assuming your opinions are fact and they are based on what you were told by a source with an axe to grind; I feel the need to speak up.

I have lost several friends during this war and have been there myself. I would like nothing more than America to have a news agency that would report EVERYTHING (good and bad, soldiers for and against it, ect.) that goes on and not just one side of the story.

I could write a book on the hypocrisy in the media. It is shameful. Americans drink it in like it were all fact and they have the whole story and it is wrong.

President Bush doesn't pander to Hollywood or the media. It bothers those that run those outlets. I have nothing but respect for him. He respects us (military) and is doing everything to help us improve our quality of life. That is something that I didn't see in previous administrations. Just my opinion.

Sorry if it appeared I was name calling. I am not that sort.
 
"We have to go some where. Why can't we go some where that has BBQ?"

Quite possibly the best line of text I have read in a long time. Should be a bumper sticker!
 
av8tor4239 said:
I know I am not going to convince you all that the USA's invasion of Iraq was completely unjustified, and had nothing to do with the attack on our country on 9/11/01.

I also know that as long as you are flying your citation to nowhere and justifying as fighting the enemy over there you will be happy.

Enjoy your BBQ, you know where I stand.

PS.. you all are really good at name calling!
Click to expand...

Well, it's your opinion and you have the right to spout it. But why not support those who are willing to die so you keep that right instead of complaining when one of the training exercises has a plus (ie BBQ) to it?

PS - You know the difference between a liberal and a jet engine? The jet engine stops whinning when you shut it down.
 
Once again reverting to jokes and name calling... I do support our troops....I never said I did not support our troops.. what I dont support are "NON MISSION" flights just goofing around on the tax payer dime and then justifying it by saying you are bringing the battle to the enemey in iraq....
 
Av8tor

I ask you this morning.

Where would you want me to go tomorrow?

The next day? The next day? (Then I have to reset 1 day for crew rest).

Tell me how to give you your moneys worth?

Give me a profile, I'll fly it.

In 2 weeks the second guy to serve a year in both theatres Iraq and Afghanistan flying a UC-35 Citation Ultra) will be back.

I will no longer be the only one.

There will be more to follow soon.

Always the critics, but never the answers.

Please don't judge me. Please don't ridicule me, unless you have answers to how I can improve this world.

Don't give me this "well everybody is gonna pick on me and not listen".

I am a soldier for now, I am listening, give me the Tactics and Tools that will make me successful in your eyes.

Tell me what it will take to satisfy you as a tax payer for me to execute our flight hours?

Because apparently I, not you, will have to execute your plan.

I'm not trying to bust your balls.

36th Infantry Division motto;

"Deeds not Words".

Give me your words, I'll do your your deeds. (Isn't that how it works"?

If I screw up I'll die! If you screw up I'll die!
 
Last edited:
av8tor4239 said:
.... As far as the comment I made.. You specifically stated that these flights were "NO MISSIONS, JUST SCREWING AROUND". I know that you have orders to fly the airplane and it is over your head, so I am not accusing you personally of wasting or unethical spending/flying....Still trying to figure out how being an artist in "american BBQ" is protecting me from the "evil doers"????:confused:
Click to expand...

Av8tor, the flights you're objecting to because Semore made them sound frivolous are actually training missions. (My husband flew the F16 for 15 yrs so I do know what I'm talking about). Flying skills erode when pilots spend too much time on the ground. Military pilots risk their lives in combat zones so the least we can do as taxpayers is to send them well prepared/trained. Surely you wouldn't have complained had Semore accurately described those flights as training missions? As to his choice of meal when he landed--so what?! He had to eat and every bite was well deserved.

When we were stationed in Germany my husband had lots of good meals after training sorties--all over Europe. When he was flying in Iraq every flight hour paid off and his "jaunts" (comparatively speaking) around Europe were more than balanced out by living in the desert in a combat zone--just as Semore had been doing until recently.

In fact, that explains how our resident artist in American BBQ is protecting you from the evil doers. Semore has been there done that already and he's working with pilots that are headed to the desert for their rotation. After the stress of war, I'm sure that regular training flights do feel like "no mission, just screwing around" to a pilot used to flying in combat zones. Having personally observed lots of military pilots talking with their hands at squadron dinners, I bet Semore passes on some damn good advice over the BBQ.

Semore is one of the NJ pilots that I corresponded with during his deployments. I saved excerpts from one of our exchanges because it was a somber snapshot of life for our NJ pilots serving in the war. I'm sharing it now as a tribute to our military and a look at the serious side of Semore. He wrote to me:

"I'm sure people are getting sick of me always talking about the "wars" like I'm John Wayne or something. ..It's called a "Fallen Comrade Ceremony". There are way too many of them. ....it is difficult to watch a coffin that you know has a dead female soldier in it....never take freedom for granted.... Nobody comes here thinking they will die...Hoist one for me....

After reading that I was praying he made it back to the States in one piece. And my response was:

For the record, Semore,

Your letters from the front are read with pride--
They bring a lump to our throats for those who died.
A medic, dead female, another Fallen Comrade--
It is a loss, a terrible shame, and so very, very, sad.
John Wayne? Hardly! He's only a hero on TV--
You're a real soldier, showing us Freedom isn't free!
 
Heading out

7 hours of hobbs to fly today.

Still no information since AV8TR took over the training program.

No direction as to how to best serve the Taxpayers?

We promise not to have any fun or do anything that would allow us any satisfaction while serving the country (You taxpayers)

Deeds, not Words!
 
YGBSM!

Every day we kill terrorists in Iraq. Sounds like a good plan to me. If you don't want to kill terrorists ... don't VOLUNTEER to join the military.

We got rid of that animal Saddam, then the dumb-ass terrorists come right to us . Right where our forces are so we can kill them... saving us the trouble of hunting them down. Now this is what I call an example of Reconnaissance-by-Fire.
 
Semore, my travel suggestion is to go visit family and friends. If you can ever fly out our way my family would be honored to treat you to BBQ, or anything on the menu, for that matter.

Those who take issue with the war should address it with politicians. Our military members are only following orders and many times they place themselves in danger to do so. They deserve respect and gratitude for what they do. Those who question why need to ask the ones who sent them there.
 
netjetwife said:
(My husband flew the F16 for 15 yrs so I do know what I'm talking about).
Click to expand...
Yep, her HUSBAND flying that F-16 makes HER the expert.

She sets new standards of stupidity and ignorance each and every day. It never ends! :laugh:

Just like her statement below:
 
I read your posts B-19

You have the right to express your opinion.

If you are compensated to post, may you rot in hell.

Getting back to the original post. I'm at 55 hours for the month so far.

How about you B19?

Still waiting for AV8TR to tell me what profiles I should fly to justify his tax dollars.

With no guidance I guess we have to do what we think is best.

Not flying tomorrow,have to go to the firing range.

I guess its a waste of ammo because when will I ever use a firearm unless I were to be shot down.
 
While in country (Iraq), I spent a great deal of time moving Iraqi air around the theater..in other words, we flew empty A LOT! No one liked it but we did it.

If there were some BBQ joints, we would have dropped in!

Av8Tor..what you need to realize is that there is NEVER a time when a military airplane leaves the ground that something is not being accomplished. NEVER!

The military waste some money, few will doubt that. But what it gives in return for the investment is, in this military mans opinion, well worth the cost.
 
Av8tor, your apology is admirable and the restaurant recommendation a nice gesture.
 
Like I said

I immediately posted that I should not have said Screwing around.

But AV8tor, you keep posting it?

Nobody ask you to give up? I ask the opposite,

Once again, tell me what you would consider a worthwhile profile and a training scenario you think would give the tax payers their monies worth.

We have been shooting all approaches by hand.

In VMC we have been shooting our approaches with the Meggit.

Any other suggestions are welcome.



"Hey Owner", great to hear from you again.
 
Semore Butts said:
Once again, tell me what you would consider a worthwhile profile and a training scenario you think would give the tax payers their monies worth.

.
Click to expand...

The reason I am giving up this argument is NOT because I all of a sudden agree with your no mission status, but because you have job to do, a job I apparently do not understand.

As with any large business... our government is great at waste... weather what you are doing is wasteful is obviously up for debate weather you like it or not. (look back at one of my first post about the $100 pencil).

In conclusion, in my opinion you can not change your no mission status because It is not yours to change.. you boss tells you to go out and burn Jet A to kill time for whatever reason... You choose to find good BBQ, so instead of argue with you about something you can not control, I will give you some recommendations:
I used to work at Leonards BBQ in Memphis.. It is by far one of the best BBQ joints around! They have a buffet 5 days a week, and on friday nights ribs are on the buffett... They make their own sweet and spicy sauce. They will also prepare your ribs wet or dry.. Blues City BBQ on Beale st is one of my favorites although it is quite touristy! Great Wet ribs... You can only get wet ribs at Blues city! As far as touristy... The Rendevous very touristy and dry ribs only
 
av8tor4239 said:
The reason I am giving up this argument is NOT because I all of a sudden agree with your no mission status, but because you have job to do, a job I apparently do not understand.

As with any large business... our government is great at waste... weather what you are doing is wasteful is obviously up for debate weather you like it or not. (look back at one of my first post about the $100 pencil).

In conclusion, in my opinion you can not change your no mission status because It is not yours to change.. you boss tells you to go out and burn Jet A to kill time for whatever reason... You choose to find good BBQ, so instead of argue with you about something you can not control, I will give you some recommendations:
Click to expand...


Av8tor,
You are upset with what you see as a waste of taxpayers dollars. Let me ask you this, would you rather see those dollars get flushed down the toilet or get some use out of them?
The reason that I ask that is if Seymore does not do the flying, that is exactly what will happen to the money that is earmarked for the flying hour program.
The flying hour program is fully funded and it does not roll over to the next year, when you get to the end of the Fiscal year, any money remaining in the program goes away, and the chances of getting the same amount of money for the next years program is lessened.
Right now it is Seymore and one or two other pilots trying to fly the hours off of the planes. Theses hours will be needed next year so they can not be reduced. With the increased Optempo and deployments that are currently facing our Guard and Reserve units, there is a higher turnover in them.
I know of a AH64 unit that returned and everyone that was able to at that time, retired. Now here they are not 2 yrs later and they are looking at being activated again for another year plus long deployment, with a bunch of newbies. They are out training daily now. Sometimes that includes cross country flights to have lunch...but is actually for keeping their skills up. Alot easier to hone their skills while not being shot at.

Seymore, when you come back to NJA....cold ones are on me.
Might even be able to find some good heffeweitzen, not as good as the pension...but we can try.

207th forever!!
 
This is appropriate! (edited as needed)


You want the truth...

You can't handle the truth!

Son, we live in a world that has walls and those walls need to be guarded by men with guns. Who's gonna do it? You? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom. You weep for Seymore Butts and curse his flight for good BBQ; you have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know: that Seymore's desire to find good BBQ, while tragic (and wasteful), probably saved lives and that his existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, saves lives. You don't want the truth because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties you want him on that mission to find good BBQ, you need him on that mission. We use words like honor, code, loyalty, southern style, sweet and tangy, and corn bread. We use then as the backbone (or rib bone if you will) of a life trying to find good eats. You use them as a punchline. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you," and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest that you pick up a menu and make a recommendation. Either way, I don't give a damn what you think you are entitled to.

"Did you order a whole slab?"

"I was hungry"

"Did you order a whole slab?"

"Your damn right I ordered the whole slab..with a side of slaw and corn bread!!!!"
 
And I paid for it with per diem, too!!

Very creative JJ....:laugh: :beer:
 
ozpilot said:
JJ - now that was funny! :)

If out military needs to fly empty citations around the country to maintain proficiency then how about helping these people out ?

http://www.angelflight.com/
Click to expand...

No can do...missions change at the last minute. Then there is the whole liability issue. I wish the mil could do stuff like this but I think some folks would have an issue with it. It is not like we dont want to do it, we love that kind of stuff...we just cannot.

The US military, in my opinion, is the largest and most prolific humanitarian organization on the planet. Look at what we do worldwide....and domestically.
 
JungleJett said:
The US military, in my opinion, is the largest and most prolific humanitarian organization on the planet. Look at what we do worldwide....and domestically.
Click to expand...

Good point - its a shame you can't help angelflight - I did it for years and it is without a doubt the most rewarding flying I've ever done.
 

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