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Senior NWA pilots screw junior ones

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nwaredtail

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 5, 2005
Posts
622
In a slick bit of "legal" words and a good sell job, the senior NWA MEC has once again shown their real colors, green. The pilots were "told" that after agreeing to freeze the pension, NWA would put a 5% defined contribution in our accounts starting FEb 1. This way a junior pilot would be able to start saving now that their promised pension is going away. Senior pilots would get what they "expected" and have earned. Basically, a no vote might have meant termination of the plan, with senior guys going to PBGC maximums and junior guys getting the same either way. That was the sell job, "we know 5% is low, but we will get more.........." was what the told the junior membership.

Hours before the vote was to be finalized, junior MEC members found some questionable wording and had a conference call. It was confirmed that NWA would indeed not put the 5% in until after BK exit. When requests were made to extend the voting process and get this info to the pilots, MEC Chair Mark Mcclain said NO.

Vote passed by 80-20 with 30% not voting.

For all you junior pilots out there, let this serve as a warning. Senior folks will Fuk you at any cost.

The recall process will start shortly from what I am hearing. If we go down, we go down swinging.
 
We get 10 a percent.... DC.. plus stock 'options' issued ... Meager compared to the days of yore. Funny how things changed so quickly. IBM just negotiated something similiar I believe.. Senior folks keep what they have and dovetail an exit from traditional pension program.

That NWA deal blows .... But your kinda stuck between - rock and hard place? I sincerely hope it improves... If you have 20 to fly its not enough to retire on and maintain the same standard of living into retirement.

Hang in there fellas. Is it true they want to extend the CBA to 2009 or something similiar in time..?? Sincerely ........ Ex NWA Mechanic
 
Wow. What about the grey of it....

I always thoughts there was a relatively equal amount of representation. If a roll call happened there might be a few more Captain votes, but not the landslide given.

Usually, there are several factors when voting on issues like this and one has to weigh them all and accept some garbage for the something that is more significant.

Why did 30% not vote? Absent? Or did they choose not to choose.

A recall? That kind of disruption should only happen if absoultely necessary. It can play into management 101: divide and conquer

What is your source? A MEC member? Crewroom chatter?
 
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yep the senior cuys at cal sold out the junior one's also. Anyone who want to get into this line of work, beware------ the senior pilots will always screw you to get what they want, so when you have an opportunity to screw back don't hesitate.:confused:
 
Thump thump, thats the sound of the Jr guys getting tossed under the bus. It's happened at every major I can ever think of. Sorry to hear it guys. That's why the age 60-65 argument is so complex. The Jr pilot today needs to sit down with a retirement counselor and ask the tuff questions. Given the current trends (Verizon, IBM, NWA, UAL, USAir) and the loss of pay and benefits and in the aviation industry, will I be able to afford to retire at 60?

Are you aware that anyone who retires after 8/2006 at Verizon DOES NOT get retirement health care benefits. Boys and girls, plan on paying for your own health care when you do retire.
 
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tie1on said:
yep the senior cuys at cal sold out the junior one's also. Anyone who want to get into this line of work, beware------ the senior pilots will always screw you to get what they want, so when you have an opportunity to screw back don't hesitate.:confused:

This reminds me of the Sprint commercial--

Its my way of sticking it to the man..
But you are the man...
Thats right..
So you're sticking it to yourself....



Maybe...


C'mon guys... you are smarter than this. You gotta be, cause the issue isn't this simple and superficial. Also, your quote basically says what the senior guys is doing is ok, because they were junior once and got screwed and now that they are senior they get to do the screwing. Alot of screwing going on here, but is anyone getting gratification? :eek:

How can the senior guys stick it to the junior guys when there is a balanced amount of votes. Are the senior guys more active on thier issue? Are they more politically savvy? Again, why didn't 30% vote?

I am not for or against the senior guys... I'm just calling BS on the way this information was presented....
 
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This is a complicated/confusing issue but there is a lot of misinformation flying around about this.

Here's the deal: The 5% DC contribution in the TA is a "placeholder" amount for the duration of the 1113c process. The final amount will be negotiated later. The TA says that NWA will pay the 5% during the 1113c process and after that the amount will be whatever is part of a negotiated deal. When is the 1113c process over? When the judge rules on it. Hearing is 1/17. Judge can rule immediately or up to 30 days from 1/17. Could GRANT NWA's 1113c motion to set aside the contract. Could DENY the motion. Could convince both sides to extend the process and keep negotiating although he can't force this, both sides must agree to that. If he GRANTS the motion ALPA says we will strike.

Important part: NWA's current position is that they will not pay the 5% until exiting BK, EXCEPT for the time that the 1113c process is going on. Whether that's what happens or not depends on the outcome of the 1113c process. The only way they can do that is if the judge GRANTS the motion and they are then legally free to impose their own terms on the pilots, including the their position that they will not pay the 5% until after BK. Kind of a moot point though if we strike following their throwing out of the contract. Pay from NWA during strike = $0. 0% of $0 = $0

Bottom line: They will only be able to do what they want (0% DC until exiting BK) if they win the right in the 1113c process to toss out the contract. Otherwise the amount will be a product of a mutual agreement between them and ALPA which means that if it ends up being 0% DC until exiting BK it is because ALPA agreed to it and it was memratified.

Meanwhile, according to the now ratified deal, they freeze the pension as of 1/31/06 and NWA pays a 5% DC starting 2/1/06. They continue to pay the 5% DC until the end of the 1113c. After that they pay whatever has been negotiated or, if they win the 1113c and impose their terms, they say "1113c is over, we pay 0% until exiting BK then we go to 5%"

Clear as mud huh?
 
I'm not sure if this is a Senior / Junior issue, or just manipultion by the MEC.

I went to a 2 hour presentation regarding this TA. I listened very closely. So much so, that I pointed out a mistake on one of the presentation slides, that had been undetected in two previous presentations.

They talked about the 5%. It was stated that they plan to negotiate for more..."later". I do not recall anything about this 5% now, except if....or until...... It was just 5%.

Now there are "conditions".

The problem is the snakes in Mgmt are smarter than the ALPA guys.

Here's the fancy wording....

...the company has agreed to make an “interim” or “placeholder” 5% contribution as long as the 1113(c) process is going on. The interim contribution would continue until the 1113(c) process ends. That process will end when the company and ALPA reach an agreement, or when negotiations break down and the bankruptcy court enters an order “rejecting” our collective bargaining agreement (CBA).

If an agreement is reached, the amount of the company’s contribution from that point on will be whatever ALPA and the company have agreed upon.


If no agreement is reached, and the bankruptcy judge grants the company’s motion to reject, the company would then be free to impose its last offer. The company’s latest offer so far is to contribute 5 percent of pilots’ Recognized Compensation to the RSP, but these contributions would not begin until the company emerges from Chapter 11.


 
Well, I don't work at NWA, so my opinion doesn't mean jack, but....

No contributions during Ch11 would be a strike issue for me.
So would only getting a 5% DC. (didn't someone say AirTran gets 10%?)


Is mgmt 401k contribution suspended right now???

F'em
 
I have been a proponent of being aware of the senior dudes agenda for long time. I'm not saying they are out to "screw" anybody, but be aware of their position and what they want out of the company AND junior membership.

For example, SWAPA BOD just told the company no on extending the contract for another year. Is that smart? Are we headed for a profit killing wage improvement during negotiations this year? What will the long term impact be?

Wish I knew.
 

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