Results of ARC rewrite for Flight and Duty (135)

[Boilermaker]

Rest Requirements

It is still unknown how the on-demand charter operations are going to comply, but my boss is on one of the boards trying to figure it out. He said the FAA wanted it done last year and if they don't do something soon they are going to start enforcing the rest requirement of 10 hours prior to your scheduled trip (which would mean alot of violations!). We are trying to figure out how to do it without hiring more pilots to cover pop-ups or turning down late evening trips. One thing we are toying with is going to a hard 8-6 off time and then only being able to fly until 8-10 pm should we get a late afternoon trip.

We are a small company that can't really afford to hire enough pilots to make it work effectively (24-7 on call) but we need to be able to serve our clients who have short term needs so we can continue to provide a valuable service. I'm all in the interest of safety and good rest requirements for crewmembers but I hope there is a middle ground somewhere.

If your companies come up with some good alternatives to this issue, please post them so we all can brainstorm!

 

[svcta]

I'm not making a blanket statement(despite how it sounds) because I know that it's not this simple. But safely operating airplanes in a commercial sense sort of demands a well-rested crew. I've done it in the past and slapping yourself in the face to stay awake with pax or even boxes in the back is not a good situation. It's going to turn out that working out a new staffing solution will just have to be the cost of doing business....one way or another.

 

[CapnVegetto]

I, for one, hope like hell this is changed. It doesn't happen much at my company, but it does happen.....getting called at 1am b/c someone wants to go to fricking Colorado at 3am, this after you've been up all day. It's not safe, period. Something needs to be done about it.

 

[deadstick]

I know some management/charter companies charge the owner (for leaseback/managed aircraft) for the pilots' salaries and training. Why should the company care? If the company owns it, the the 3 F Law applies, and they should know better than to actually own a plane.

 

[smails]

The FAA put the ARC issue on the back burner until the finish with the operational control issue.

 

[FlyingMoose]

Hi!

The whole on-demand cargo industry, which constitutes multiple tens, if not hundreds of companies, all use the 24 hour on call system.

You can be on call indefinitely (I know a guy who was just #1 on call for about 60 hours until he got a trip) until you come in, then you start your 14 hour duty day which can be extended indefinitely if you were originally scheduled to complete your trip within 14 hours.

cliff
YIP

With all due respect, please tell me you don't believe the scenario you explain is in compliance of CURRENT regs (not to even mention safety)!

True, you can be on call indefinitely, but you are very definitely not in rest when you are on-call. As soon as you accept and the company assigns you to a flight immediately following being on-call as you describe you both will be in violation because you can't look back and see your 10 hours rest period. People get so wrapped up in the "what is duty" arguement and confuse themselves from what the FAA very clearly and intentionally defined (and has redifined numerous times), what qualifies as rest and the rest requirements.

The only way the 24/7 on-call scenario works is if your company places you into a qualified rest period immediately preceding the duty assignment. I know operators that do that, and all though it is not a great QOL, that is legal.

As far as some of the other replies about the cost of the neccesary crews to follow the regs; if the company/operator/owner can't afford it then they need to get out of the aviation business, period. Besides, in the scope of the costs of operating aircraft, crew costs are a pretty small part.

 

[atpcliff]

Hi!

What I described is done and condoned by I think all the FSDOs and regional offices. I think what's currently irregularly interpreted is the so-called "14 hour duty day", which can be extended indefinitely, according to some FSDOs/regional offices while others do not allow that.

The on-call vs. rest status will be cleared up in the re-write, because they will have 3 categories of time: Duty, Rest, and On-Call. The 14-hour duty day is also going to be re-written like it is in -121 so there's no grey area.

It's pathetic that the re-write was COMPLETED, what, 2 years ago now, and still nothing was done. What a crock.

Smails:

smailsThe FAA put the ARC issue on the back burner until the finish with the operational control issue.

What is the above "operational control issue" about? Is it the charter thing where a charter "operator" pretends they have airplanes and makes phone calls through 3 layers of companies until they find a jet and crew that they know nothing about and then tells their customer their jet is ready?

How long do they think the above will take 'til they get back to the ARC issue?

Thanx!

cliff
YIP

 

[svcta]

I'm sure it's the same situation with 91 and 135(in spirit), but when I was at the airlines we had rest issues and were constantly upset with just how liberal the rules were with how we were (not) guaranteed rest. The position from our local FSDO was that rest issues were for the unions to sort out. The rules were written and that was as much thought as they would give it.
Until more dead bodies are stacked up they're not going to change the regs.

 

[smails]

atpcliff
Yea, that is what they are focused on. I would suggest that if anyone does work for these type of operations, they identify who they actually fly for to their pax.

 

[Seadogrun]

Am I getting this right?

The only way to work a 14hr day would be to get the call the moment you go on call. I don't work p135 anymore, but that's not how it was interpreted when I was.

The new rule will definately drive costs up by causing 135's to need to double their crew numbers. Falling salaries would probably follow.

Any other thoughts?