Republic looking at Bombardier C-Series to Maybe Replace F9 Airbuses?

[starchkr]

"He really does not get it, and even the five percenters at RAH are embarrassed by him."

You know it is bad when even the dumb@sses think you're a dumb@ass.

:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

 

[707eng]

Hmm, what were the rates jetblue flew those same 190's for prior to June of this year??? That was over 3 years at rates BELOW our current rate! Have a short memory don't we.......I guess you didn't have a problem with their B scale, did you?

Ilini, most people enjoy flying with me because we are there to do a job and I don't care what other people think about us. Animal is pissed that he didn't get a # with southwest and he misquotes everything RAH people say.

So Jetblue E-190 first year Fo's made $25.00 an hour? Don't even try and compare Republic to Jetblue. I give you guys 2 years!

 

[scotts]

Calling it a "regional" or "major" aircraft has ZERO influence on pay rates. Pay rates are influenced by your leverage to negotiate better pay. Regionals have very little leverage because they can be replaced by any other regional at any time. Major or "branded" pilots can negotiate high pay because they have SCOPE - their jobs can't be transferred to a lower paid colleague. Or in Jetblue's case (no scope) they at least have managment that understands that their passengers will not come back if they find themselves riding on a CRJ with poor service and no live TV. That leverage doesn't exist in the regional world so the wages are lower.

Regional pilots don't WANT to work for less - the market (even with the influence of unions) dictates that they WILL work for less.

What management calls your jet is one way they manage your expectations. If you don't think you are worthy of higher wages, they don't need leverage to get you to accept lower wages. There is more to negotiating than what your actual leverage is. If your expectations are low, you won't try for the wages you should have. Management wins when they keep their employee's expectations low.

 

[Toobdrvr]

Scotts: excellent point. The other day I rode on an RAH E190 for the first time and I gotta say: That is an AIRLINER! The people working those flights (both in the front and the back) are doing exactly the same job and at the same level as we are in the 'bus. They deserve airline pay and qol. Hopefully, once we're all banded together we can push to get these guys/gals to the level they need to be.

Minimac: excellent point about Popeye. The same can be said about Animal Tale. He's actually a great guy on the line, but he gets a little fired up on here. Yo Animal! Love you brotha', but when you start slinging names, it's time to take a break...

 

[jayme]

If you don't think you are worthy of higher wages, they don't need leverage to get you to accept lower wages. There is more to negotiating than what your actual leverage is. If your expectations are low, you won't try for the wages you should have. Management wins when they keep their employee's expectations low.

I'll give you that, but what negotiating committee is going to go along with the company propaganda? A moron could see through that BS logic! The only reason regional employees are paid so poorly is because they don't have scope protection. It's not because they don't think they deserve more. Were you ever at a regional? Did you think you were paid fairly? Were you fooled by such silly propaganda?

I don't know what RAH pilots have for scope protection - if it's weak, they have little leverage to get higher pay. I sincerely hope that's not the case.

 

[jayme]

Scotts: excellent point. The other day I rode on an RAH E190 for the first time and I gotta say: That is an AIRLINER! The people working those flights (both in the front and the back) are doing exactly the same job and at the same level as we are in the 'bus. They deserve airline pay and qol.

Every regional flight I have ever been on has been run professionally and at the same level as the big boys except for a few Mesa flights. Did those crews not deserve to be paid better? Did they not want better pay?

 

[scotts]

I'll give you that, but what negotiating committee is going to go along with the company propaganda? A moron could see through that BS logic! The only reason regional employees are paid so poorly is because they don't have scope protection. It's not because they don't think they deserve more. Were you ever at a regional? Did you think you were paid fairly? Were you fooled by such silly propaganda?

I don't know what RAH pilots have for scope protection - if it's weak, they have little leverage to get higher pay. I sincerely hope that's not the case.

Jayme, do you think that management tries to manipulate the negotiating committee exclusively? The only thing that matters to management is 50% + 1 on the ratification vote. Psych. warfare ("silly propaganda" as you put it) can be very subtle and if you are myopic in your thinking, management is going to have their way with you.

Fairness has nothing to do with it. It's only what you can negotiate that matters. If you were on the negotiating committee and the pilot group was worried about losing their jobs, how much leverage does that give you with management? Leverage can be gained in many ways on both sides of the table and there is much more to negotiating a new contract than one issue (scope).

Still at a regional. Not my first flying career and old enough to see the big picture. Unfortunately, many of my peers are much younger and more impulsive than I am. That is my current lot in life, and I try to make the best of it. Like I said, fair has nothing to do with it.

 

[scotts]

Every regional flight I have ever been on has been run professionally and at the same level as the big boys except for a few Mesa flights. Did those crews not deserve to be paid better? Did they not want better pay?

I'm glad you have had that experience. I have seen many flights at both the regional and major level flown unprofessionally, and not Mesa crews. I don't work for Mesa, but I've seen enough to tell you that every pilot group has it's fair share of unprofessional pilots. Anyone who disputes that hasn't seen enough of their operation to know.

Again, it's not what you deserve or what is fair. What you can negotiate will determine what your pay and benefits will be.

Jayme, it looks like you have at least a couple of airlines under your belt. Now at VA I guess. Seems like a pretty good gig. Relax! Seems like you are fired up about pay. Are you negotiating for the VA pilots?

Take care man.

 

[Toobdrvr]

Every regional flight I have ever been on has been run professionally and at the same level as the big boys except for a few Mesa flights. Did those crews not deserve to be paid better? Did they not want better pay?

I agree, but that was not my point. My point was that the E190 is a big airplane, has a lot of people on it, has the legs to fly as far as an A320, and the people working that particular a/c deserve Airline pay and benefits. Maybe as a larger group we can work to get it for them...

Can I say the same for a BE1900, EMB120, or CRJ crew? Sure, it would be great to get them that and I certainly think they should be paid more than they presently are, but end-road airline pay would be a tough sell. Besides, that would carry its own set of problems...

 

[jayme]

Again, it's not what you deserve or what is fair. What you can negotiate will determine what your pay and benefits will be.

Jayme, it looks like you have at least a couple of airlines under your belt. Now at VA I guess. Seems like a pretty good gig. Relax! Seems like you are fired up about pay. Are you negotiating for the VA pilots?

Take care man.

Maybe I'm a little sensitive because of the regional/major culture war that exists. I see it all the time where I work. It's frustrating when I hear guys suggest that there is a fundamental difference between a regional pilot and a major pilot. We all do the same job, and now that I'm flying bigger planes I can honestly tell you that this job is WAY less challenging than regional flying in every way. You guys hit a nerve suggesting that E190 guys deserve more because it looks and feels like a major airliner. Implied is the idea that if the plane doesn't look and feel like a major airliner pay is somehow less important.

As you guys say, fair is not the issue. I absolutely agree. You get what you negotiate, and anybody who negotiates less robustly because they are told they are flying regional equipment is a fool. I don't think regional negotiating committees are foolish - they are simply under market pressure to not price themselves out of a job.

Happy holidays & merry Christmas!