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Rebuttal against age 65 (for FoxHunter and Jim Smith)

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You get my vote for funniest shiat ever posted. Almost made beer come out my nose on that one.

BTW, pro-change crowd, can we talk about how you're advocating further hardship on the FURLOUGHED PILOTS now?

Didn't think so. Y'all deserve gonorrhea for getting this thing changed.

The furloughing of pilots was/is caused by mismanagement and over-capacity in the system. This (age change) will just provide a lot of current and prospective pilots something else to consider as they make their career decisions.
My Uncle was laid off by Ford because you bought a foreign car. He thinks you deserve the clap.
 
When is the last time a pilot had to hump a 80# hose up a flight of stairs, or chase a criminal on foot?
It must be nice to live in your simple little black and white world. You gripe about the self serving attitudes of the pro-65's and don't even see your own hypocricy. You don't want the rule changed because you don't see it as an immediate benefit for you. Your motivation is no less selfish than anyone elses. Change is constant and inevitable...learn to live with it.

I can't remember if a fireman had to wake up in a different timezone each day of a 4 day trip at different hours, with different sleep patterns, and then try to land a 250 passenger vessel in bad weather? (for 25 years) You don't think that could cause fatigue, hearing loss, and just plain loss of situational awareness? Nah, that could never happen.

But, could you answer whether or not we should change the legal driving age around the country to age 14? Nebraska and Kansas do it, so everyone should. Sure, let's get the young kids out there, they can probably handle it too. Who came up with that rule? An Age limit? Come on? Why? For safety reasons? I bet 14 year olds could do it, just like they do in Kansas. Just like age 60 and over pilots do it in Europe. Who makes the rules? Public opionion, not old pilots who didn't invest well. The rule change would be an immediate safety hazzard, and an immediate downer for everyone invloved except the old captains. Care to comment on how England does it? They make the guys go to the right seat for two years at age 60. How do you feel about that?


Bye Bye--General Lee
 
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You won't get an answer General because they have no logical argument.

You might as well try to get blood from a turnip.

FJ
 
Now, Now...

That's discrimination. These guys are lipid challenged. Or waist enhanced.

Seriously--for the same reason airlines are no longer allowed to give you a physical as part of the interview. Federal law does not allow employers to health screen you beyond what is required for the job. I think it has something to do with the American's with Disabilities Act.

Age discrimination is supposed to be outlawed too, but it happens as we all know.


Age discrimination is in the Constitution---with a minimum age for a President of the United States. The Age 60 rule was upheld by the Supreme Court, who ruled against the Southwest pilots anyway, saying they would have to reinstate retired firemen and cops too.

And there is a process for health screens, but they are not uniform, and everyone knows it, including you.

Bye Bye--General Lee
 
The furloughing of pilots was/is caused by mismanagement and over-capacity in the system. This (age change) will just provide a lot of current and prospective pilots something else to consider as they make their career decisions.
My Uncle was laid off by Ford because you bought a foreign car. He thinks you deserve the clap.

Well, most Fords are terrible cars. Anyway, can you explain why ICAO would recommend NOT having 2 over age 60 pilots in the same two man cockpit? Can you answer the question please?


Bye Bye--General Lee
 
Who cares about ICAO? I just don't think it's anyone's business but his own if a healthy 61 year old pilot wants to keep flying at his airline.
 
Who cares about ICAO? I just don't think it's anyone's business but his own if a healthy 61 year old pilot wants to keep flying at his airline.

I think a 29 year old President would be great for the country, but the Constitution doesn't allow it. I think most 14 year old kids are great at driving go-carts, but they really can't drive yet in most states. I think we should change all the rules.....

Bye Bye--General Lee
 
Well, I say if they're going to bump the age to 65, do it .5 year increments that bump every 6 years. Keep things interesting.....
 
I think a 29 year old President would be great for the country, but the Constitution doesn't allow it. I think most 14 year old kids are great at driving go-carts, but they really can't drive yet in most states. I think we should change all the rules.....

Bye Bye--General Lee

Interesting. I was not aware that the Constitution prohibited 61 year airline pilots.
 
They were looking at limiting maximum pilot ages WELL before the rule was enacted. Here are some links (from a pro-change website, of all ironies):

http://www.age60rule.com/docs/1952_airport_and_nbors.pdf

http://www.age60rule.com/docs/1953_asma_aging_comm.pdf

http://www.age60rule.com/docs/1954_asma_ageing_comm.pdf

http://www.age60rule.com/docs/1959_navy_recco.pdf

http://www.age60rule.com/docs/1959_qs_med_panel.pdf

It looks like the rule was enacted for safety rather than some backdoor conspiracy that gets passed around here.

The selection of age 60 for the upper limit was arbitrary.

http://www.age60rule.com/docs/2004_ASMA_Position.pdf
 
Hmmm. I'm already planning to retire about age 50 or 51, so a mandatory retirement age of 55 might just be a useful thing. :)
 
Well, most Fords are terrible cars. Anyway, can you explain why ICAO would recommend NOT having 2 over age 60 pilots in the same two man cockpit? Can you answer the question please?


Bye Bye--General Lee

Why do some Captains always add 5000 lbs of fuel to the Flight Plan/Release even though the weather is clear, wind is calm, light traffic period, four runways over 10,000 ft. long? Just a comfort level for some, but really not required.

In regard to the one pilot under age 60 ICAO said;

In the JAA countries, the upper age limit of 60 has been maintained for pilots in single-crew operations, but since 1 July 1999, the JAA regulations have allowed airline pilots to continue flying until age 65 with limitation to multi-crew operations and with the proviso that no other member of the flight crew is older than 59. However, the Secretariat is aware that this proviso was not based on medical grounds but rather the result of a compromise between the different parties. Although recommended by IATA, the Secretariat does not consider this proviso safety relevant for the following reason: For the individual pilot engaged in multi-crew operations, it is today generally accepted that a medical incapacitation risk of one percent per annum (“The 1% Rule”) is fully compatible with the desired flight safety level for airline operations. This risk level corresponds to one medical incapacitation per 100 years or approximately one million hours. Male pilots from Scandinavia, United Kingdom and NorthAmerica are lilely to approach this risk level when they are around 65, female pilots three to four years later. The risk of two older pilots becoming medically incapacitated at the same time, during the same one-hour flight, is thus one per trillion hours (1 trillion [FONT=Helvetica, sans-serif]— [/FONT]1012 or one million [FONT=Helvetica, sans-serif]x [/FONT]one million), a risk so low that it can safely he disregarded.
 
Should we lower the driving age if the kids can demonstrate ability? I will tell my nephew to hit the go cart track after school everyday. He is 10 years old, but by 12 he could probably handle highway driving and parallel parking...
Would you agree to that too? You can't do one without the other. Then you would be a hypocrite.


Bye Bye--General Lee


I said "demonstrated ability"! Are you deaf, or just not listening!!? Let the kid drive if he can do it. Geez! Listen up fer chrissakes!
 
Male pilots from Scandinavia, United Kingdom and NorthAmerica are lilely to approach this risk level when they are around 65, female pilots three to four years later.

And THERE is the next argument that'll be put forth... All women pilots should be allowed to fly to 68-69. Crap, I'm never gonna get in that seat...:laugh:
 

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