Radio Pet Peeves

[172driver]

How about these two:

1. We've got 4244 in the box

2. ATC: N4971F, standby

Pilot: N4971F standing by


And the 'with you' thing is extremely irritating...

 

[Ty Webb]

Of course, nobody mentioned the "windcheck", "what's our sequence" and "how long's the final" transmissions we hear so much in Atlanta.

Sorry, Food, but "how long's the final" and what's our sequence?" are both very valid questions in ATL, perhaps you just don;t understand WHY we need to know these things. Just because it isn't info that you need in your airplane (t-prop or draggy, straight-wing jet) doesn't mean it isn't important info in mine (slippery sucker that doesn;t like to come down).

"How long's the final?" When you are entering the downwind turn at 12,000 or 10,000 feet and are given 7,000, it is important to me to know whether I need to come down at 1500' ft/min or 3000'/min . . . 2 different configurations and plans. Re-configuring after the fact is sloppy and wastes fuel. Don;t get down quickly enough, and you may find some other guys vectored in between you and your turn to final; get down too fast and waste fuel slogging along for a 20-mile downwind- that's not the way we liek to operate.

"Who's our sequence?" Again- something I need to know. Usually, they'll tell you, but once in a while they get busy and forget. If I have an engine shut down and it has a five-minute warm-up restriction prior to takeoff, you bet I need to know who I am following out of there.

 

[MetroSheriff]

My toppers:

1. With you

2. Checking on (we know, we can hear you)

3. In the box (we know where the code goes)

4. In the window (we know where the altimeter setting goes)

5. Squawking and talking (we know what 19.3 and 5621 are)

6. On the hold

7. Here we go (we know that cleared for takeoff means you will start moving)

8. Flashing (it's an ident button not a Kodak Instamatic)

9. Instrumnets to XYZ (no foolin)

10. Decimal (we know that "point" is short for, there is no need to remind us)

Typhoon, I told you this we be a good thread. Thanks. It was nice to have a funny thread to read.

 

[Typhoon1244]

Oh, and if I never again hear a TCAS called "the fish-finder," it'll be too soon!

 

[Ty Webb]

2000Flyer,
You don't get 10 pilots to check in with you because you weren't listening as you approached the airport. If you base you approach to the pattern on the lack of responses you get, you will be mighty surprised to find all that traffic. Keep you eyes open, listen on the unicom, and look for the guys without radios. sure, I can believe youmight alert someone every now and then that has been lazy with his radio calls, but for the most part, your request is ignored.

Sorry, Anne, this may not be a necessary call for you in your airplane, but as a pilot who operated a jet based at an uncontrolled field for three years, I can tell you that it was a necessary call.


Sure, if all I had to do was monitor one frequency, and navigate visually at 120 KTS, yeah, that call might be unnecessary, but we're not all doing the same thing out here.

When you are 20 or 30 miles out, in a jet, that means you are only five to seven minutes from entering the pattern, yet you are picking up airplanes on overlapping CTAF frequencies for perhaps a 100-150 mile radius, so it's not always clear who is who/where/what.

When we are talking with approach, reading checklists, trying to get an airport advisory, briefing and setting up for the approach, trying to monitor CTAF and doing everyhting else that we are doing at that time, we may miss a call from Skyhawk #2 or number #3 as they announce their position. Therefore, I ALWAYS say, "Any aircraft in the area, please advise". Sometimes, I get a call from an aiplane I was not aware was in the area . . . and that's why I do it.

If you think it is unecessary, well, sorry, but I don't do it to please you, I do it to keep you out of my airplane, literally.

 

[dsee8driver]

ATC..

How 'bout when you "check in" twice. All of a sudden ATC comes back, "Sorry I was on a landline." You don't hear us ignoring ATC and saying, "Sorry I was on company frequency."

I guess when it comes to communications there are times when it's busy, you just need to get your message across in a proper manner. At our company we do quite a bit of flying in and out of military fields and worldwide airports and we try to use standard ICAO phraseology which makes it easier for ATC ands us to understand.

 

[DCitrus9]

In most cases "how long's the final?" is not necessary. Instead of asking; listen up for a few seconds and you'll hear "5 from ajaay" or "5 from freal" and cleared approach for an aircraft in front of you. That will tell you how long the final is. If there's no one in front of you they'll offer or advise a short approach so you can plan accordingly.

 

[ifly4food]

In most cases "how long's the final?" is not necessary. Instead of asking; listen up for a few seconds and you'll hear "5 from ajaay" or "5 from freal" and cleared approach for an aircraft in front of you. That will tell you how long the final is. If there's no one in front of you they'll offer or advise a short approach so you can plan accordingly.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

I know it makes you feel important to be flying right seat in a "slippery jet" instead of a "draggy straight wing" one (yeah, that 717 is one hot rod, eh Ty? ) , but my point wasn't really that the calls are unnecessary. My point was that if you listen up before shooting your mouth off you will find out how long the final is and that the wind is the same as it was 30 seconds ago when the last guy asked.

 

[ATCER]

Re: ATC..

How 'bout when you "check in" twice. All of a sudden ATC comes back, "Sorry I was on a landline." You don't hear us ignoring ATC and saying, "Sorry I was on company frequency."

LOL ! Good point... It's an equipment thing. When a controller is speaking on a landline we here the landline in the headset and all other coms are redirected over a speaker. The speaker volume is very often set low as not to disrupt the sector sitting next to us. When you here that happen the radar controller is most likley working solo (no radar associate) so the workload is a bit increased, especially the coms part. The RA will generally handle all landline info... unless they are very busy where both the R and RA are on landlines. (that's a good indication that the sector is down the crapper )

I'm not making excuses, it's just one of those things.

 

[AirportRat]

i should clarify....a tower controlled airport

 

[dsee8driver]

LOL ! Good point... It's an equipment thing. When a controller is speaking on a landline we here the landline in the headset and all other coms are redirected over a speaker. The speaker volume is very often set low as not to disrupt the sector sitting next to us. When you here that happen the radar controller is most likley working solo (no radar associate) so the workload is a bit increased, especially the coms part. The RA will generally handle all landline info... unless they are very busy where both the R and RA are on landlines. (that's a good indication that the sector is down the crapper )

Thanks ATCer...next time I'll know. Always wondered about that. Out of curiosity, what does a Radar Associate do? Is it like an extra pair of eyes over you? Sometimes when it's really busy you hear a different voice over the frequency usually gives just one instruction to an aircraft. Is that the RA guy looking over shoulder?

 

[TwinTails]

Wow it took me forever to read through all of those. A few pet peeves of mine are:

"I'd like to pick up instruments to ....."

"any traffic please advise"

For the most part I kinda like how everyone has there own style and personality on the radio. As long as it doesn't get in the way of normal and safe operations.

A couple things that no pilot should ever do and almost gets steam to shoot outta my ears would be:

Strobes on the ramp or taxi way. For God's sake man, turn em off unless on the runway or in the air.

And also guys sittting there pointing right at you on the ramp picking up the clearance or whatever the f*ck they're doing for all that time. All the while with the friggin landing light on.

Nice little b*tch session. Now that thats off my chest I'll be much more safe I'm sure.

 

[TwinTails]

Quick question:

When responding to ATC do you guy's say call sign first or instruction first then the call sign.

I always put the call sign at the end of a transmission.

ATCER, is there a preffered way?

 

[Ty Webb]

Looks like the inmates re running the asylum.

I know it makes you feel important to be flying right seat in a "slippery jet" instead of a "draggy straight wing" one (yeah, that 717 is one hot rod, eh Ty? ) , but my point wasn't really that the calls are unnecessary. My point was that if you listen up before shooting your mouth off you will find out how long the final is and that the wind is the same as it was 30 seconds ago when the last guy asked.

I can see you are moderator on this forum. Congratulations. Maybe you can use the opportunity to " listen up before shooting your mouth off" as you so eloquently put it.

I would think by now that you should know better than to try to slam someone for the seat that they occupy . .. I see an awful lot of FO's at our company who were Check Airmen on Boeing and McDouglas stuff at other companies.

I have spent plenty time in the left and right seats of transport-category jets, thank you- certainly enough to know that it being a "hot-rod" has nothing to do with how well a particular plane comes down . . just talk to anyone who has flown a B737-200.


I think it is especially humorous that you think that you are the ATL pro . . . . I routinely hear ATC tell how long the final will be . . but I gues they are just giving out info that you already knew, regardless of whether you may have just been changed from the north to south runways. I guess you, too, can foresee the delicate changes that happen minute by minute, during the big pushes . . . guess you've never been changed from an assigned 180 Kts to "max forward speed- you're now number 1", but hey, All Hail FlyforFood- ATC specialist, Meteorologist and part-time aircraft recognition expert- you're so far ahead of the rest of us . . . . probably at the gate by now, huh?

I didn't bring up wind checks, but since you have done so twice- As someone else tried to gently point out- if you have FMS wind info, and you know the present surface wind, the difference between the two is the wind shear you can expect to encounter. But hey, an ATC pro and crack board moderator such as yourself already knew the windshear was coming, right? Man, I wish I was you.


Last- that B717 crack- most of the time coming out of ATL we are doing 12% or 18% de-rated takeoffs. With 37,000# of thrust and a BOW of 68,000#, I am sure a consumate aviation professional such as yourself can do a quick thrust-to-weight calculation . . something to ponder while you're droning along at 5000' for a 20 mile final.

 

[darling pretty]

How about this one

ATC: "Acft #324 Contact Center 134.45"

Acft#324: "Acft#324 134.45 SWITCHING"

What's with the switchy thing?


Also why is ATL and CVG the only places that you CONTINUALLY hear "Wind check and what is my sequence?"

 

[ifly4food]

Gee whiz, touched a nerve there, didn't I Ty? I didn't know that was such a sensitive issue for you.

I'll ignore the attacks you made in that rant. After all, I was only responding to your first rant which I should have ignored in the first place.
You go get all the windchecks and final reports you want to. I'll continue as the "aviation professional" and consummate wise arse that I am .

Oh, and for the cheap shot at my being a moderator, I'm sure there's an opening. Why not step up to the plate and help me keep morons like TSTM and JimboRealGoodPilot's latest character out. It's great fun.

See you on concourse C.

 

[dsee8driver]

Pet peeves..

I guess it's a matter of opinion but after reading about everyone's pet peeves I myself can think of a few scenerios where "Any traffic please advice" would be "HELPFULL". Coming in to an airport where the tower has closed, at night, in a heavy jet, where center lines you up for a 20 mile final and tell you unidentified traffic circling over the field, cleared for the approach, switch to CTAF frequency, is a perfect example to ask and hope the guy is monitoring the frequency and tell you about his intentions are. This happens to us going into Laredo to name one.

MetroSherrif said: 6. On the Hold

Can you think of a time when a controller asked you to hold hort of X and forgot about you? Or when a position you hold is not visible from the tower? Maybe this is appropiate.

When you are 20 or 30 miles out, in a jet, that means you are only five to seven minutes from entering the pattern, yet you are picking up airplanes on overlapping CTAF frequencies for perhaps a 100-150 mile radius, so it's not always clear who is who/where/what.

I have to agree with Ty on this one!

Typhoon1244 quote:

Delta 821: "What's the sequence?
"DFW Tower: "Eagle 621, Eagle 606, Delta 821, Candler 455, and Delta 1120."
Two minutes later...
Delta 821: "What's the sequence?

Typhoon I can't blame the DL guy here. In PHL when they use both parallel taxiways often encoutered the same problem at time of push and when you ask about sequence you get a smartass controller reading you a number of flight numbers instead of saying the USair A320 to you left or the weedwacker(EMB120)(Joke) to your right. All he did was waste air cause his statement gave us no info. So you have to ask again. I can see how sequence to some might seem a waste but to a 4 engine jet taxing on 2 and having a 45 min delay can make a difference.

 

[dsee8driver]

Other pet peeves....

Other pet peeves:

I know a captain who hates hotel shower heads so he carried his own with a wrench to change it at hotels he stayed at! Cool guy in cockpit though!

 

[jsoceanlord]

i sent this reply a week ago, but don't think it went through.

i've heard puerto rican islander pilots report their position on CTAF over 7 times

 

[Typhoon1244]

Re: Re: ATC..

I'm not making excuses, it's just one of those things.

One of my favorite all-time radio transmissions came from a DFW tower guy. We'd been holding short of 17-C for a long time with no arrivals or departures. Finally I keyed up: "Candler 123's short of the Center at Zulu."

After a few seconds, the tower came back with: "Sorry, Candler. I got up to get coffee and forgot you were out there!"

Now how could I get mad at an honest reply like that?